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  Reply # 648734 30-Jun-2012 18:36 Send private message

freitasm: Not exactly. There are things that should be correctly configured. For example a non-Telecom handset, even though they might have the right bands could have the wrong dormancy settings.

If wrongly set these will cause excessive battery usage, frequent disconnections, slow response, etc.


Why not just have a 'carrier pack' like Apple does then? And then the carrier can just push out tweaks rather than having it tied to the entire OS build. Or separate the layers. It's like saying your ISP has to approve the next version of your browser or something like that




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  Reply # 648742 30-Jun-2012 19:01 Send private message

freitasm:
ajobbins: If the phone runs firmware that uses the protocols (GSM, UMTS, LTE etc) in a standards compliant way, and so do the networks - shouldn't there be no need for individual network testing?


Not exactly. There are things that should be correctly configured. For example a non-Telecom handset, even though they might have the right bands could have the wrong dormancy settings.

If wrongly set these will cause excessive battery usage, frequent disconnections, slow response, etc.




I understand the need for a quick tweak in that regard, but to take more than two weeks to configure some settings . . . . . 

And why the need to change things like browser names? 

At the end of the day, I paid for a Samsung phone , so when Samsung say " here's an update for your Samsung" I don't see why telcos in general hold up the update, change the dormancy settings if needed then release ? 

Obvisouly I'm missing something because it can't be that simple, but like I said earlier, if a big company like HTC or samsung are happy to push an update out to over ten million phones , why the need for months of testing from a lil telco ? 



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  Reply # 648780 30-Jun-2012 20:56 Send private message

sbiddle: The issue isn't one that Telecom have a big say in.

The massive fragmentation in the Android space means that manufacturers need to firstly make the release available for their handsets, it's only then that operators can test it and make the final decision about releasing it.



Cough cough...save the marketing pitch for the general public.



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  Reply # 648782 30-Jun-2012 20:58 Send private message

freitasm: No. He is saying Jelly Bean won't be available at announcement as it needs to be customised for each device by manufacturers before it even goes out for Telco testing.


Actually, that is not what he is saying, it one of the things he is saying...the other thing he is saying indirectly is "it's not Telecom's fault they were so far behind the 8 ball with the HTC One X updates"...this of course is garbage.

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  Reply # 648872 1-Jul-2012 08:56 Send private message

I am talking explicitly about Jelly Bean here, as this is the topic, isn't it?

I am not talking about previous versions. I am saying that JB was just announced, so don't expect it to be available tomorrow morning in all devices, regardless of which OEM or telco is supplying it. That's all.






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  Reply # 648876 1-Jul-2012 09:08 Send private message

motorwayne:
sbiddle: The issue isn't one that Telecom have a big say in.

The massive fragmentation in the Android space means that manufacturers need to firstly make the release available for their handsets, it's only then that operators can test it and make the final decision about releasing it.



Cough cough...save the marketing pitch for the general public.


Why you say that? Sbiddle is not with Telecom. He's not responsible for testing handsets in any telco. He's no interest, except that he's an Android user - and from what I've seen mighty pissed with lack of updates.

Instead he takes the rational answer and he gets this comment?




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  Reply # 648902 1-Jul-2012 09:56 Send private message

freitasm: I am saying that JB was just announced, so don't expect it to be available tomorrow morning in all devices, regardless of which OEM or telco is supplying it.


The problem is that I *am* expecting it and so too are many other people. Google should change its release strategy to match these expectations. For example, instead of calling it a release, call it a release candidate (or other marketing spin), then give manufacturers a deadline for the final release.



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  Reply # 648903 1-Jul-2012 09:58 Send private message

rvangelder:
freitasm: I am saying that JB was just announced, so don't expect it to be available tomorrow morning in all devices, regardless of which OEM or telco is supplying it.


The problem is that I *am* expecting it and so too are many other people. Google should change its release strategy to match these expectations. For example, instead of calling it a release, call it a release candidate (or other marketing spin), then give manufacturers a deadline for the final release.



Yes, and this is what is wrong with handset manufacturers. We (the consumers) are not the customer. The telcos are the customers. We are just temporary holders of some combination of hardware/software and they don't really worry about us.

The same happens on Windows Phone with its "staggered release to avoid overloaded servers", in a new world of CDNs, caches...

A huge collection of bollocks, made to generate money for them, not benefits for us.




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  Reply # 648951 1-Jul-2012 11:17 Send private message

Or we have the case with Apple where Apple make the releases for worldwise release and just release them.  And it's up to consumers worldwide to complain to Apple when they break stuff that causes a sub-par expereince with their phones.

Who's better to blame, the Telco providing the update to their subscribers to make sure it works on their network, or the OEM that releases directly to the customer and then if it's a problem in a small country you may or may not have your issue fixed.

The other issue is Apple is one OEM, HTC, Samsung, Huawei, Moto are all OEMs too.  There are a lot of OEMs in the handset market whereas Apple only need to focus on a small number of devices inside their own walled garden.




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  Reply # 648974 1-Jul-2012 11:48 Send private message

I can't work out why telcos are involved at all.. what value do they add?
if it's so they can rebrand the integrated browser, then give me a break. I thought that "Internet Explorer provided by Xtra" crap died out with the 90's


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  Reply # 648977 1-Jul-2012 11:51 Send private message

Read my previous post about "GSM but not GSM". Some networks have different settings and those are not always correct in stock ROM. Just look at the Galaxy SIII thread with tips on how to get the correct "Dormancy" setting on your handset when connecting a non-Telecom unit to the network.





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  Reply # 648982 1-Jul-2012 12:00 Send private message

rvangelder: I can't work out why telcos are involved at all.. what value do they add?
if it's so they can rebrand the integrated browser, then give me a break. I thought that "Internet Explorer provided by Xtra" crap died out with the 90's



It is purely about customisation, because many operators have specific configuration requirements to suit their network.

If you look at the 2degrees version of the SGS III for example it includes the SIM Alliance API which is required for the Snapper NFC capabilities. Android doesn't ship with shis as standard because Google ship their own NFC API that doesn't support SIM based secure elements and 2wire protocol. The XT and VF versions of this handset don't include this API.

If you use a non XT branded phone on XT you'll probably also suffer worse than expected battery life since the XT network doesn't support fast dormancy. Many Android handsets will chew through the battery with fast dormancy activated in the handset, but not activated on the network. Likewise, move a XT handset that has fast dormancy disabled across to Vodafone and your battery life won't be optimal because Vodafone does support fast dormancy, and the handset can't take advantage of it.

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  Reply # 649002 1-Jul-2012 12:39 Send private message

my faith in mobile technology just took a knock

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  Reply # 649004 1-Jul-2012 12:42 Send private message

rvangelder: my faith in mobile technology just took a knock


Education will do that to you




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  Reply # 649101 1-Jul-2012 15:55 Send private message

freitasm:
motorwayne:
sbiddle: The issue isn't one that Telecom have a big say in.

The massive fragmentation in the Android space means that manufacturers need to firstly make the release available for their handsets, it's only then that operators can test it and make the final decision about releasing it.



Cough cough...save the marketing pitch for the general public.


Why you say that? Sbiddle is not with Telecom. He's not responsible for testing handsets in any telco. He's no interest, except that he's an Android user - and from what I've seen mighty pissed with lack of updates.

Instead he takes the rational answer and he gets this comment?


Well, I'm suggesting that he might well qualify for a job at Telecom with talk like that, if he ever thought of working for them, I hear the pay is ok.

So, lets stay on JB like you suggested.



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