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831 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 649104 1-Jul-2012 15:59 Send private message

sbiddle:
rvangelder: I can't work out why telcos are involved at all.. what value do they add?
if it's so they can rebrand the integrated browser, then give me a break. I thought that "Internet Explorer provided by Xtra" crap died out with the 90's



It is purely about customisation, because many operators have specific configuration requirements to suit their network.

If you look at the 2degrees version of the SGS III for example it includes the SIM Alliance API which is required for the Snapper NFC capabilities. Android doesn't ship with shis as standard because Google ship their own NFC API that doesn't support SIM based secure elements and 2wire protocol. The XT and VF versions of this handset don't include this API.

If you use a non XT branded phone on XT you'll probably also suffer worse than expected battery life since the XT network doesn't support fast dormancy. Many Android handsets will chew through the battery with fast dormancy activated in the handset, but not activated on the network. Likewise, move a XT handset that has fast dormancy disabled across to Vodafone and your battery life won't be optimal because Vodafone does support fast dormancy, and the handset can't take advantage of it.



So what does all that have to do with the topic of Telecom not being shy with a speedy update? We're not asking them to think about all the other non Telecom handsets out there or even those people like that run on their network with a non Telecom handset.

Simply, just to stay frosty with the newer handsets that are getting released at present with a lot of hype...they may as well do this as it will score points fot Telecom and retain customers I guess.



831 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 649115 1-Jul-2012 16:07 Send private message

freitasm: Read my previous post about "GSM but not GSM". Some networks have different settings and those are not always correct in stock ROM. Just look at the Galaxy SIII thread with tips on how to get the correct "Dormancy" setting on your handset when connecting a non-Telecom unit to the network.



The thing is though, that I have non Telecom handsets running perfectly well on their XT network, without anything other than the Telecom roaming menu installed. So really, what is the worry I'll face?

Another question: Do we need to get our updates from Telecom at all if that is the case?
Another question: What dictates where the OTA comes from? The service provider or the Build?

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  Reply # 649190 1-Jul-2012 18:55 Send private message

I can't see the networks being too keen to rollout Jelly Bean - as Flash isn't being included or supported from this release. 

Benefits of smoother animation, vs. lots of support call complaining 'the internet' isn't working anymore?

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  Reply # 649387 2-Jul-2012 10:10 Send private message

Here are some of my thoughts on this (copied and pasted from my post on the Vodafone forum, so substitue "Vodafone" for "telco")

"If it's being sold by Vodafone, then there is an element of it being their reputation on the line with it as well as Samsung's. They test and customise the firmware as they see fit to make sure it performs correctly on their network. By selling the product, they are putting their name on it and therefore need to make sure they can back it up, so to speak."



This is just one viewpoint, and I know there are a lot of arguments to say otherwise (Why don't Apple allow branding etc) but it's something to keep in mind.


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  Reply # 649421 2-Jul-2012 10:55 Send private message

motorwayne: Telecom, you've been warned...Android Jellybean 4.1 has been launched.

You are now responsible for getting it to all of the latest Android phones you have sold recently - Fast


Do it fast and you will be a winner.

Motorwayne
The people'sfriend 


My Telecom HTC Sensation is still waiting for the ICS upgrade that Vodafone Sensation buyer got back in April.....despite Telecom having an exclusive on the phone in NZ when it was first released.  

I'm not overly concerned as ICS doesn't seem to offer much over Gingerbread, but it would be nice.

Not a word from Telecom (as far as I know).





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  Reply # 649437 2-Jul-2012 11:08 Send private message

raytaylor: I dont believe in fixing what isnt broke


Do you use the word "improve" at all? :-)  




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  Reply # 649459 2-Jul-2012 11:36 Send private message

So I've got a 2Degrees S3 (bought from Warehouse Stationary) which I'm using on Vodafone. Who will be supplying my updates? And can I somehow change it from a 2Degrees phone to a Vodafone phone (there appears to be minimal customisation that 2Degrees made).

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  Reply # 649485 2-Jul-2012 12:21 Send private message

This model also encourages provider lock in. If someone buys a phone on Vodafone, but later decides they want to move to Telecom, then they may be discouraged by the fact their phone may not perform as well on another network due to firmware configuration.

With my old iPhone, I could put in the SIM of another network - and providing they had a carrier pack with Apple, my phone would download it and be optimised to perform on that network. I don't see why other platforms couldn't work in a similar way.




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  Reply # 649489 2-Jul-2012 12:25 Send private message

MurrayM: So I've got a 2Degrees S3 (bought from Warehouse Stationary) which I'm using on Vodafone. Who will be supplying my updates? And can I somehow change it from a 2Degrees phone to a Vodafone phone (there appears to be minimal customisation that 2Degrees made).


I have a SGS2 from Telecom running on Vodafone.  The updates in my case came via Telecom when Kies was runup.  No doubt it IDed the model number and provided the appropriate update software.. 




Regards,

Old3eyes

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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 649522 2-Jul-2012 13:03 Send private message

old3eyes:
MurrayM: So I've got a 2Degrees S3 (bought from Warehouse Stationary) which I'm using on Vodafone. Who will be supplying my updates? And can I somehow change it from a 2Degrees phone to a Vodafone phone (there appears to be minimal customisation that 2Degrees made).


I have a SGS2 from Telecom running on Vodafone.  The updates in my case came via Telecom when Kies was runup.  No doubt it IDed the model number and provided the appropriate update software.. 

Thanks, so I'll be waiting on 2Degrees to provide updates then. At least I now know who to chase up! Smile

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  Reply # 649562 2-Jul-2012 13:46 Send private message

freitasm:
ajobbins: If the phone runs firmware that uses the protocols (GSM, UMTS, LTE etc) in a standards compliant way, and so do the networks - shouldn't there be no need for individual network testing?


Not exactly. There are things that should be correctly configured. For example a non-Telecom handset, even though they might have the right bands could have the wrong dormancy settings.

If wrongly set these will cause excessive battery usage, frequent disconnections, slow response, etc.


So roaming would be broken. Interesting. 






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  Reply # 649911 3-Jul-2012 10:30 Send private message

Linuxluver: So roaming would be broken. Interesting. 


I'm coming back to NZ for a week in October. Was planning on using my XT SIM in my SGSIII but now i'm worried my battery is going to get smashed (Battery life isn't that amazing anyway).

Very broken model.




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  Reply # 649941 3-Jul-2012 11:24 Send private message

Not having owned an iPhone I wasn't aware of the 'Carrier Pack' concept. Could that possibly work with Android? Would it involve some sort of temporary root access? I can see the upside for the telecoms in that they could promise some sort of optimisation of the stock OEM rom for their network, maybe even sneak in a couple of proprietary apps and a splashscreen, but leave the general running of the phone to the OEM. I guess it's not high on the agenda as most markets have locked handsets.




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  Reply # 650096 3-Jul-2012 15:13 Send private message

Linuxluver:
motorwayne: Telecom, you've been warned...Android Jellybean 4.1 has been launched.

You are now responsible for getting it to all of the latest Android phones you have sold recently - Fast


Do it fast and you will be a winner.

Motorwayne
The people'sfriend 


My Telecom HTC Sensation is still waiting for the ICS upgrade that Vodafone Sensation buyer got back in April.....despite Telecom having an exclusive on the phone in NZ when it was first released.  

I'm not overly concerned as ICS doesn't seem to offer much over Gingerbread, but it would be nice.

Not a word from Telecom (as far as I know).



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  Reply # 651175 5-Jul-2012 11:17 Send private message

With this model, what is the incentive for a carrier to bother releasing an OS upgrade for your device?

Why would they expend time and money re-configuring, testing and certifying a device they have already sold you (And perhaps locked you into a contract with).

Buy not providing you an update, it means that some people will end up upgrading their phone earlier, which I am sure the telco's are keen on.




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