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  Reply # 563641 2-Jan-2012 02:44 Send private message

zeydsecond: Everyone has an opinion over here.



Let's say, fine, that stupid whoever he was committed the crime but the main points in here are mainly how's that customer can get her dollars back; who's the real culprit and how's that guy will be reprimanded; investigations of the bank, & merchant involve; and what we can do to have a safer transaction with merchants regardless of the location of people we are dealing with (call centre staffs).





Well the problem is twofold.  First, there is getting the money back.  The credit card company should be able to do a reverse on the transaction.

Second, there is minimising risk.  It's annoying when fraud is commited on your card.  In the same way that you may not trust giving your credit card to a cheap restaurant with lots of immigrant workers, you shouldn't trust your credit card to some random call centre in a third world country.  It's not as bad for technical support- but usually financial matters are handlded locally by any but the most cost-cutting companies.  I don't know how it works legally, but I'm assuming going to the police wouldn't get very far.  In this country fraud is a pretty big thing, but in some less developed countries it's kind of "normal" - which is one of the reasons some companies block some asian countries from doing credit card payments over the internet.

It's reasonable to expect that when you ring a New Zealand number that you are advised when calls are being forwarded around the world.  But as far as I'm aware it's not completely obvious if you're talking to someone in New Zealand or not.  And if Telstraclear are really forwarding calls over bill matters to third world countries it's showing that they don't care about service, or being safe at all, and are just trying to work around things like minimum wage in New Zealand.

A lot of people don't like to buy from sweat shops, like fair trade products etc, but don't want to pay the premium that these products have.  But Telstraclear isn't exactly cheap.  They're just trying to extract maximum profit.  So my recommendation would be to stay away from them.  Even companies like Slingshot have NZ'ers answering the phones and can still manage to have cheap prices.

If people vote with their feet and publicise such things then maybe a push for NZ owned and operated companies for services companies  such as Telstraclear are really needed.  It has been done on products successfully in the past, but a lot of people don't seem to realise that some services companies push work offshore too.

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  Reply # 563762 2-Jan-2012 15:07 Send private message

codyc1515: I agree, it is in fact possible to get overdrawn on a Visa Debit card (on Westpac, at least) but thats a whole different story...



I would think that is indeed the case if the account the card is linked to has an overdraw facility. If not, well then I'd be concerned.  

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  Reply # 563777 2-Jan-2012 15:58 Send private message

I am 16 so I cannot legally get an overdraft (to my knowledge) and I did not ask for it and when I contact them they tell me they cannot remove it.

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  Reply # 564117 3-Jan-2012 20:47 Send private message

We have removed some posts from a new user who was found to be in breach of FUG.




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  Reply # 564132 3-Jan-2012 21:41 Send private message

mercutio: it's pretty dodgy giving your credit card details over to some random overseas who is on a low wage,. pretty much if telstraclear are going to have their financial department overseas it'd be prudent to discontinue business with them.

i wonder if minimum wage should include hiring overseas people?


I don't agree that just because TCL hire overseas staff there is going to be an increase in theft and fraud.  Unfortunately criminals exist in all walks of life, wage they earn and country. 

If we are simply talking about boycotting TCL just because they offshore staff - that I can understand.  If you are suggesting that our money is no longer safe because they have their call centre in a foreign country then I have to strongly disagree - I'm sure that's not what you meant.

In my opinion - INAL - irrespective of where the call centre is placed or which country the unathorised transactions took place, Telstra Clear Ltd is a NZ company and is responsible under NZ law to protect its customers from fraud. 

If that means they stand up to the loss to keep a customer - perhaps they should do that.  At minimum from a customer service perspective, they should off something to the customer for the trouble they have received - perhaps a free 1 year upgrade to whatever service they were after! 




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  Reply # 564140 3-Jan-2012 22:14 Send private message

StarBlazer: If we are simply talking about boycotting TCL just because they offshore staff - that I can understand. 


I really would prefer we talk about getting Telstra to bring the call center back on shore rather than compromise the jobs of the rest of the people working there...  but what ever works.






Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a .kiwi.nz domain name!!!

Check out mine - i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz - [email protected]


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  Reply # 564142 3-Jan-2012 22:18 Send private message

DonGould:
StarBlazer: If we are simply talking about boycotting TCL just because they offshore staff - that I can understand. 


I really would prefer we talk about getting Telstra to bring the call center back on shore rather than compromise the jobs of the rest of the people working there...  but what ever works.



This is another - valid - point of view. But in this specific case I am not sure the call centre location is the problem. There's no evidence that a local call centre would not have this kind of problem (credit card fraud).

My evidence that there's local fraud:

1.Kiwi fraudster
2.Kiwi fraudster
3.Kiwi fraudster

I could continue. But just search...

 




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  Reply # 564146 3-Jan-2012 22:35 Send private message

MF my response to that would be off topic. If you want to start a thread on the location of TC's call center and the pros and cons of having it purely New Zealand based then I'm happy to comment.

D




Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a .kiwi.nz domain name!!!

Check out mine - i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz - [email protected]


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  Reply # 564161 3-Jan-2012 23:11 Send private message

When I had multiple credit cards, to be honest I didn't give a toss where they were used etc, as it wasn't my money at risk, it was the banks. If something turns up that I didn't authorize then a charge back was always a simple straight forward process, I was unable to use some of my credit limit for a while, but I was never out of money, and if they did insist on reissuing a card (only happened twice that I can recall) then I just used another card for the time while waiting for a replacement.

It should not be up to the customers to have any concern about security, to care about it just delays the banks sorting out a half decent payment method compared to the embarrassment that is using plastic embossed cards that were invented in the 50's and 60's to be only ever used in person.

Now I only have a stupid prepaid card that has a charge for initiating a charge back, im damned if I am entering it into any dodgy website. Paypal, google checkout or get stuffed when I am buying.




Richard rich.ms

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  Reply # 564169 3-Jan-2012 23:43 Send private message

credit cards are perfect for over the phone transactons. If they turn out to be fraud, then the cc company will refund you the money and chase it up themselves with whoever was responsible.

Doesn't sound tome like TCL are trying to absolve themselves,but rather pointing out that it is the CC company who should be issuing a refund, and they are absolutely right about that.

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  Reply # 564209 4-Jan-2012 08:48 Send private message

freitasm:
DonGould:
StarBlazer: If we are simply talking about boycotting TCL just because they offshore staff - that I can understand. 


I really would prefer we talk about getting Telstra to bring the call center back on shore rather than compromise the jobs of the rest of the people working there...  but what ever works.



This is another - valid - point of view. But in this specific case I am not sure the call centre location is the problem. There's no evidence that a local call centre would not have this kind of problem (credit card fraud).

My evidence that there's local fraud:

1.Kiwi fraudster
2.Kiwi fraudster
3.Kiwi fraudster

I could continue. But just search...

 


Thanks for the research :) Exactly my point.
  




Procrastination eventually pays off.

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  Reply # 564219 4-Jan-2012 09:23 Send private message

I'm 2/3rd of the way through reading Darkmarket at the moment.

I wouldn't call it gripping but it's reasonably interesting.  For me the two main points so far are:
  1. (Fairly obvious) no matter how stringent and cautious you are about securing your own systems, as soon as you use your credit card (particularly online) it only takes one disgruntled or dishonest employee somewhere to compromise your details
  2. If the authorities and enforcement agencies tried a bit harder to work together, rather than the prevalent egocentric approaches, the global battle against cyber-crime would be more successful.





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  Reply # 564254 4-Jan-2012 11:07 Send private message

StarBlazer:
freitasm:
DonGould:
StarBlazer: If we are simply talking about boycotting TCL just because they offshore staff - that I can understand. 


I really would prefer we talk about getting Telstra to bring the call center back on shore rather than compromise the jobs of the rest of the people working there...  but what ever works.



This is another - valid - point of view. But in this specific case I am not sure the call centre location is the problem. There's no evidence that a local call centre would not have this kind of problem (credit card fraud).

My evidence that there's local fraud:

1.Kiwi fraudster
2.Kiwi fraudster
3.Kiwi fraudster

I could continue. But just search...

 


Thanks for the research :) Exactly my point.
  



I accidently left my credit card at the drive thru at Burger King a few years ago (if you consider that an "accident" - they clearly never gave it back and I didn't realise at the time, and went back an hour or so later and picked up the card. Within days I had a number of fradulent transactions occur on the card, which ANZ reversed for me. Whether they took any action with Burger King I don't know, but it did seem rather coincidental.


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  Reply # 564258 4-Jan-2012 11:11 Send private message

Thats why I hate the old terminals where you have to hand over the card. I always try to get the card back before doing the pin entry but some cashiers are real funny about it.




Richard rich.ms

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  Reply # 564260 4-Jan-2012 11:13 Send private message

Yep. They hold the card, even if you have your hand extended to get it back.

What's this about? Will they hold the card if the terminal sends out a blinking message "HOLD CARD CALL POLICE"?





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