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Topic # 109907 28-Sep-2012 17:39 Send private message

If the GCSB was working under a misunderstanding from late 2009 until a week or two ago about who they could legally spy on, shouldn't PM John Key be investigating who else may have been illegally spied on?

I'd certainly like to know what  crimes may have been committed in the two year period during which they didn't know what a NZ resident was.

The PM was just on the radio saying it was a brain fade by one person. 

For two years? In all cases? 

Reeeeally? 





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Watchmaker Wizard
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  Reply # 693063 28-Sep-2012 17:50 Send private message

TorrentFreak have been following it closely if you want a view unpolluted by the NZ media.

I suspect that they knew full well he was a resident and thought they could get away with it. I also suspect that John Key will "forget" to do much further investigating.

http://torrentfreak.com/new-zealand-prime-minister-apologizes-to-kim-dotcom-120927/




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  Reply # 693092 28-Sep-2012 18:48 Send private message

I think it is bizarre they aren't allowed to spy on NZ residents. There are plenty of people on NZ that are far far more dangerous than Mr.com and they aren't allowed to keep tabs on them. Ridiculous.

...
And know people will say we shouldn't have to 'live in fear' that people could be spying on us it but it truly is a case of be good and it wont happen.

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  Reply # 693099 28-Sep-2012 18:55 Send private message

The guy is a criminal anyway, no idea how he got residency in the first place. Now he has brought all this baggage with him. Public seems to love him though.

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  Reply # 693100 28-Sep-2012 18:58 Send private message

Linuxluver: If the GCSB was working under a misunderstanding from late 2009 until a week or two ago about who they could legally spy on, shouldn't PM John Key be investigating who else may have been illegally spied on?

I'd certainly like to know what  crimes may have been committed in the two year period during which they didn't know what a NZ resident was.

The PM was just on the radio saying it was a brain fade by one person. 

For two years? In all cases? 

Reeeeally? 



Are you now worried that they spied on you??




Regards,

Old3eyes

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  Reply # 693113 28-Sep-2012 19:27 Send private message

Its pretty simple to me.  I'm not allowed to use ignorance as an excuse for breaking the law.  Neither should a government organisation.  Someone should be held to account for this.

BDFL
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  Reply # 693114 28-Sep-2012 19:32 Send private message

chevrolux: I think it is bizarre they aren't allowed to spy on NZ residents. There are plenty of people on NZ that are far far more dangerous than Mr.com and they aren't allowed to keep tabs on them. Ridiculous.


It's not bizarre. Is a safeguard that guarantees that a rogue administration will not come up with "bad intel" on good citizens that dissent. 

Remember, not all governments are good. A government is not the same as country. Dissent is not bad.

chevrolux: And know people will say we shouldn't have to 'live in fear' that people could be spying on us it but it truly is a case of be good and it wont happen.


This argument is so wrong. People should always be vigilant and do not allow government to have more power than needed - and power to covertly monitor its citizens is something that should be monitored by independent entities, to avoid exactly what I said before - rogue governments that decide by themselves no longer to follow the will of the people to keep their own interests above all.








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  Reply # 693226 29-Sep-2012 00:28 Send private message

Linuxluver: If the GCSB was working under a misunderstanding from late 2009 until a week or two ago about who they could legally spy on, shouldn't PM John Key be investigating who else may have been illegally spied on?

I'd certainly like to know what  crimes may have been committed in the two year period during which they didn't know what a NZ resident was.

The PM was just on the radio saying it was a brain fade by one person. 

For two years? In all cases? 

Reeeeally? 



Exactly. I think that it goes deeper than many realize though.

This government is shaping up to be one of the most callous, corrupt governments New Zealand has ever known. This GCSB is simply the last in a long list of shonky dealings or callous attitudes. Off the top of my head:

  1. Passing a Copyright law change at mid night as part of the amendments for helping Christchurch, after a previous attempt was protested by the voters and dropped. Later it was revealed that the US had paid several hundred thousand dollars to get it en-acted.
  2. Mining of environmentally protected land, a policy hidden during the election and revealed only afterward.
  3. Nasty 'private' comments between Shonky JohnKey and Dirty Bird Banks (tea pot tapes), showing their uncensored true feelings about normal people.
  4. The head of a long-voted for system set up to provide for the poor and vulnerable publicly declaring she 'doesn't need to read' any statistics about child poverty.
  5. NZ Government agencies are increasingly attempting to exempt themselves from the Official Information Act - e.g. keeping what they do secret from the voter.
  6. Grand claims from National - quietly backpedaled and watered down when the media spotlight - and the voters - attention is elsewhere. (e.g. jobs, childcare demands on beneficiaries, etc).
  7. Asset sales policy that has been universally panned - even buy Governments own Treasury Dept - yet, curiously, is still being rammed through... It's almost like John Key is got a personal stake in it....
  8. The Megadownload debacle. Really, where do I start? A corrupt foreign government is told by one of it's owners to 'make an example of' a competitor, and so talks to a few of it's lapdogs in NZ. What then results is a comedy of inept key-stone cops capers, forgetful politicians, missing evidence, cowboy tactics, illegal spying and influence pedaling. I do not know if I should laugh at the incompetence and be thankful, or cry that they cannot even run a good conspiracy let alone a country!
  9. And finally (although I am certain I have missed many other good examples): the total, total inability to actually FIX anything significant! Did they think we wouldn't notice? For all the big claims - nothing is actually better, and not ever likely to BE better. WTF? Is it the 1990's again???

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  Reply # 693230 29-Sep-2012 00:47 Send private message

chevrolux: I think it is bizarre they aren't allowed to spy on NZ residents.


The GCSB is not allowed to spy on NZ residents because that is the job of the SIS. So don't worry, everyone can be legitimately spied on.

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  Reply # 693280 29-Sep-2012 08:23 Send private message

Linuxluver: If the GCSB was working under a misunderstanding from late 2009 until a week or two ago about who they could legally spy on, shouldn't PM John Key be investigating who else may have been illegally spied on?


Probably quite a lot fewer than you yourself are hoping is the case, if only because the 2009 Act which has apparantly caused the confusion (it resulting in the demise of permits authorising stays and changing the use of the use of the term "visa" to describe the conditions of a permission to stay) did not come into effect until late 2010 (29 November) not "late 2009" as you have claimed.

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  Reply # 693287 29-Sep-2012 08:30 Send private message

Jarno:
chevrolux: I think it is bizarre they aren't allowed to spy on NZ residents.


The GCSB is not allowed to spy on NZ residents because that is the job of the SIS. So don't worry, everyone can be legitimately spied on.


It would be my hope that they are keeping a watch of some sort on Brendan as he sounds like an extremely angry man beyond rational thought Wink.

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  Reply # 693345 29-Sep-2012 11:09 Send private message

freitasm:
chevrolux: I think it is bizarre they aren't allowed to spy on NZ residents. There are plenty of people on NZ that are far far more dangerous than Mr.com and they aren't allowed to keep tabs on them. Ridiculous.


It's not bizarre. Is a safeguard that guarantees that a rogue administration will not come up with "bad intel" on good citizens that dissent. 

Remember, not all governments are good. A government is not the same as country. Dissent is not bad.

chevrolux: And know people will say we shouldn't have to 'live in fear' that people could be spying on us it but it truly is a case of be good and it wont happen.


This argument is so wrong. People should always be vigilant and do not allow government to have more power than needed - and power to covertly monitor its citizens is something that should be monitored by independent entities, to avoid exactly what I said before - rogue governments that decide by themselves no longer to follow the will of the people to keep their own interests above all.







+1

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  Reply # 693363 29-Sep-2012 11:44 Send private message

Brendan:
Linuxluver: If the GCSB was working under a misunderstanding from late 2009 until a week or two ago about who they could legally spy on, shouldn't PM John Key be investigating who else may have been illegally spied on?

I'd certainly like to know what  crimes may have been committed in the two year period during which they didn't know what a NZ resident was.

The PM was just on the radio saying it was a brain fade by one person. 

For two years? In all cases? 

Reeeeally? 



Exactly. I think that it goes deeper than many realize though.

This government is shaping up to be one of the most callous, corrupt governments New Zealand has ever known. This GCSB is simply the last in a long list of shonky dealings or callous attitudes. Off the top of my head:

  1. Passing a Copyright law change at mid night as part of the amendments for helping Christchurch, after a previous attempt was protested by the voters and dropped. Later it was revealed that the US had paid several hundred thousand dollars to get it en-acted.
  2. Mining of environmentally protected land, a policy hidden during the election and revealed only afterward.
  3. Nasty 'private' comments between Shonky JohnKey and Dirty Bird Banks (tea pot tapes), showing their uncensored true feelings about normal people.
  4. The head of a long-voted for system set up to provide for the poor and vulnerable publicly declaring she 'doesn't need to read' any statistics about child poverty.
  5. NZ Government agencies are increasingly attempting to exempt themselves from the Official Information Act - e.g. keeping what they do secret from the voter.
  6. Grand claims from National - quietly backpedaled and watered down when the media spotlight - and the voters - attention is elsewhere. (e.g. jobs, childcare demands on beneficiaries, etc).
  7. Asset sales policy that has been universally panned - even buy Governments own Treasury Dept - yet, curiously, is still being rammed through... It's almost like John Key is got a personal stake in it....
  8. The Megadownload debacle. Really, where do I start? A corrupt foreign government is told by one of it's owners to 'make an example of' a competitor, and so talks to a few of it's lapdogs in NZ. What then results is a comedy of inept key-stone cops capers, forgetful politicians, missing evidence, cowboy tactics, illegal spying and influence pedaling. I do not know if I should laugh at the incompetence and be thankful, or cry that they cannot even run a good conspiracy let alone a country!
  9. And finally (although I am certain I have missed many other good examples): the total, total inability to actually FIX anything significant! Did they think we wouldn't notice? For all the big claims - nothing is actually better, and not ever likely to BE better. WTF? Is it the 1990's again???


Not to worry it will be forgotten about in a few weeks especially by the National Voters.

Dion

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  Reply # 693430 29-Sep-2012 18:02 Send private message

Jarno:
chevrolux: I think it is bizarre they aren't allowed to spy on NZ residents.


The GCSB is not allowed to spy on NZ residents because that is the job of the SIS. So don't worry, everyone can be legitimately spied on.


The SIS is legally prohibited from intercepting communications to or from citizens or permanent residents.  A lawful intercept of a citizen or resident can only be performed by the Police, with a warrant.

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  Reply # 693439 29-Sep-2012 18:27 Send private message

John2010:
Jarno:
chevrolux: I think it is bizarre they aren't allowed to spy on NZ residents.


The GCSB is not allowed to spy on NZ residents because that is the job of the SIS. So don't worry, everyone can be legitimately spied on.


It would be my hope that they are keeping a watch of some sort on Brendan as he sounds like an extremely angry man beyond rational thought Wink.


This gave me my best LOL of the weekend thanks. 

I would imagine plenty of investigating will be held into whom else was spied on, and someone will be held accountable.

gzt

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  Reply # 693457 29-Sep-2012 19:03 Send private message

Kyanar:The SIS is legally prohibited from intercepting communications to or from citizens or permanent residents.  A lawful intercept of a citizen or resident can only be performed by the Police, with a warrant.

Wrong.


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