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  Reply # 528149 2-Oct-2011 04:30 Send private message

Ragnor:
dontpanic42:?
It is a marvel of our times that people still vote National in time after time?



Labour was in power for 3?consecutive?terms aka 9 years before the current National?government?term.?

So people haven't been voting them in very often in recently times!

Personally I haven't decided who I will vote for this time around, waiting to see what policies are announced first but right now as mentioned in my earlier post it's probably going to be a matter of?choosing?the least bad option.

I'm still waiting for national to release it's policies from it's last election bid...
From what I have heard the current national policy is muddling through.



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  Reply # 528159 2-Oct-2011 08:57 Send private message

Ragnor:
National: No tax changes, reduce spending


reduce spending? i doubt it - they have spent more than labour in one term

oh dont forget that national will sell our 'national assets' to make the balance book look better!





ajw

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  Reply # 528177 2-Oct-2011 10:21 Send private message

Interesting interview with Gareth Morgan this morning on the state of the economy.

Q+A on TV1 repeated on TVNZ7 at nine tonight. Has not been posted on the TVNZ website yet.

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  Reply # 528181 2-Oct-2011 10:32 Send private message

nakedmolerat:
Ragnor:
National: No tax changes, reduce spending


oh dont forget that national will sell our 'national assets' to make the balance book look better!


Tell the story not some half baked rubbish!!

National is not selling off assets

John




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  Reply # 528189 2-Oct-2011 10:55 Send private message

Dear John, National have said, if they get another term, they will sell our national assets.
John Key reveals plan for asset sales | Stuff.co.nz



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  Reply # 528244 2-Oct-2011 12:47 Send private message

Thanks hellonearthisman

Another one John, NBR 28/Sept/2011 (delay for asset sales)





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  Reply # 528261 2-Oct-2011 14:07 Send private message

hellonearthisman: Dear John, National have said, if they get another term, they will sell our national assets.
John Key reveals plan for asset sales | Stuff.co.nz


Read the article you linked to

partial sale!




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  Reply # 528275 2-Oct-2011 15:19 Send private message

Ragnor: All options are bad it's just National are the least worst option currently.


Rubbish.

They want to sell your power company to the yanks/etc, so you will pay twice as much.

Only a fool would think that selling your own house and then paying rent to live in it was a sound financial option.

Consider these two facts:

43% of households in New Zealand receive more from the Government in support than they pay in tax.
17% of households in New Zealand pay a 97% of the net income tax collected by the Government.


Can we have some links to peer reviewed, official sources for that rather fantastic claim?

I don't know how any sane person could support any party that wants to increase income tax on workers given the above, workers are already paying a massively disproportionate amount.


How about we tax those people who are rich? Aren't our taxpayer dollars being used disproportionatly by them to protect their wealth? (police, etc). They have more to protect; they require more protection. Shouldn't they then be expected to pay more?

Don't they want to help their fellow countryman?

If not - do we wan parasites like that here?

Or how about we stop focusing on the casino-like current financial system and think of a better one?


Labour: Capital gains tax, increase income tax for highest bracket, increase spending
National: No tax changes, reduce spending


Labour seems more sensible then.

Two things seem more and more obvious:
Reducing social services increases costs elsewhere;
A market economy is a theory with so little supporting empirical evidence it is tantamount to a religious faith.


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  Reply # 528277 2-Oct-2011 15:32 Send private message

Ragnor:
dontpanic42: 
It is a marvel of our times that people still vote National in time after time 



Labour was in power for 3 consecutive terms aka 9 years before the current National government term. 

So people haven't been voting them in very often in recently times!

Personally I haven't decided who I will vote for this time around, waiting to see what policies are announced first but right now as mentioned in my earlier post it's probably going to be a matter of choosing the least bad option.


You have a short memory.

Before Labour was in for 9 years, NATIONAL was in for 9 years. The scars from that blighted time still exist today. This was the time of Jenny Shipley, work for the dole, $80 undies, winebox enquiries, etc.

National was then handed it's biggest defeat in 80 years. Not only did they lose that final election, they also lost half their previously loyal voters. And the NEXT election was at least as bad for them.

Why? Because there policies didn't work. They still don't work and never will. They are the same now as they were then.

I do not like any of the parties. I think they are all f-ing incompetent. But with National and especially ACT, all we have is corporate puppets who will sell the very air you breathe - right after they have sold the water you drink.

No offense. But really, if you think National will pull some magic rabbit out of the hat after 20, 30 years NOW?!? Not a hope. But they will make a tiny few extremely rich and you will not see a penny of it. 

THAT is a promise.

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  Reply # 528280 2-Oct-2011 15:44 Send private message

johnr:
hellonearthisman: Dear John, National have said, if they get another term, they will sell our national assets.
John Key reveals plan for asset sales | Stuff.co.nz


Read the article you linked to

partial sale!


And that makes no material difference.

They will not buy unless they have will profit; that profit will come from adding a percentage to the current charges and then claiming innovation.

And I'll bet the percentage they add is the same amount they spent to BUY it in the first place: in other words, we'll be paying them to take it. And then paying again and again...

Simple, uncomplicated idiocy.

We know this from our own recent history. We have tried asset sales before and they DO NOT WORK. It is no surprise they do not work; it's simple logic, and it will never work.

I do not understand why you seem to be in favor of them. Or is it blind loyalty to National? Serious question... 



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  Reply # 528295 2-Oct-2011 17:31 Send private message

johnr:
hellonearthisman: Dear John, National have said, if they get another term, they will sell our national assets.
John Key reveals plan for asset sales | Stuff.co.nz


Read the article you linked to

partial sale!

If the government brought your business and left you 51% it would still mean they took your business.
It's the same with the government is selling your assets, yeah the cash not does look good in the short term but in the long term it's a multimillion dollar loss.
It's like reducing the unemployment numbers by kicking people off the dole, they are still jobless but by Nationals calculations they have cut unemployment because the numbers getting a benefit have fallen.

Another 3 years of this government will be as bad as the Muldoon years for New Zealand.

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  Reply # 528301 2-Oct-2011 18:00 Send private message

It seems they do not teach economics in schools or if they do the teachers deliver it with a strong flavour of Labour/NZ First's political rhetoric Surprised.

Perhaps the guardians of the "family silver" can tell us what other businesses the government should buy or start, or do they think the current portfolio of government owned businesses comprises a perfect portfolio?

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  Reply # 528304 2-Oct-2011 18:14 Send private message

hellonearthisman:
johnr:
hellonearthisman: Dear John, National have said, if they get another term, they will sell our national assets.
John Key reveals plan for asset sales | Stuff.co.nz


Read the article you linked to

partial sale!

If the government brought your business and left you 51% it would still mean they took your business.
It's the same with the government is selling your assets, yeah the cash not does look good in the short term but in the long term it's a multimillion dollar loss.
It's like reducing the unemployment numbers by kicking people off the dole, they are still jobless but by Nationals calculations they have cut unemployment because the numbers getting a benefit have fallen.

Another 3 years of this government will be as bad as the Muldoon years for New Zealand.


Um, no. 51% is more than half ownership retained by the Govt. This means 51% of potential profits are still retained.

I do like the comment re unemployment numbers..., much the same as not including those in part time work who still claim a portion of the unemployment benefit.

Agreed on Muldoon, at the time, NZ did not like his policies, however, wasn't it Rogernomics that followed good old Sir Rob...?




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  Reply # 528315 2-Oct-2011 19:31 Send private message

Linuxluver: NZ doesn't have a serious debt problem. But it is a lot worse now, at just under 30% of GDP than it was  (only 18% of GDP) when National took office. 


What is your source for this data?



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  Reply # 528321 2-Oct-2011 19:52 Send private message

1080p:
Linuxluver: NZ doesn't have a serious debt problem. But it is a lot worse now, at just under 30% of GDP than it was  (only 18% of GDP) when National took office. 


What is your source for this data?


you can download it HERE

edit: if you look under the government sector, official government debt while under labour always below ~$20billion. since national took over, it has jumped over ~$40billion





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