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5370 posts

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  Reply # 584646 21-Feb-2012 16:04 Send private message

sen8or: think our give way to the right is bad, try the hook turn in central melbourne, thats craziness


 

Even worse over there.  They pull to the left then hook a rite..




Regards,

Old3eyes

450 posts

Ultimate Geek


  Reply # 584655 21-Feb-2012 16:12 Send private message

so the general response to my question for evidence is that we are changing the rules because surgery everyone else does it different, or that kiwi drivers are too stupid, impatient, or ignorant to follow the current ones..

Is there any empirical evidence that this will reduce crashes, save lives, or improve traffic flow?

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  Reply # 584694 21-Feb-2012 17:34 Send private message

MikeyPI: Is there any empirical evidence that this will reduce crashes, save lives, or improve traffic flow?


Here's what NZTA say http://www.nzta.govt.nz/traffic/around-nz/docs/give-way-bg-info.pdf

450 posts

Ultimate Geek


  Reply # 584750 21-Feb-2012 19:22 Send private message

hmmm they don't provide any evidence..most of that is pretty vague...

I'm don't really care either way, just playing devils advocate...

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Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 584761 21-Feb-2012 19:36 Send private message

BraaiGuy:

Yea I agree. But I have learned while driving in this country never trust somebody indicating.



I've learned riding a motorcycle - never trust anybody.

They're all out to get you.




Current Phone:
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  Reply # 584792 21-Feb-2012 20:27 Send private message

There's a lot of study and research behind the change but a large part is down to the complex demands placed on the left turn driver. They have to:
  1. Check for approaching oncoming traffic
  2. Check if any oncoming traffic is turning right
  3. Check along the left side of the car for cyclists
  4. Check behind for following vehicles who may or may not be going straight ahead
  5. Judge if the following car (if going straight ahead) has room to get past and will proceed or not
  6. Judge if any successive following vehicles has room to pass
  7. Judge if the right turning car (which has right of way) has time to make the turn (and are they going to?)
  8. Watch for pedestrians
...all in the space of about 3 seconds!

It's all a bit confusing really.  After the law change only #3 and #8 apply, and it's easier to remember...if your turning right, you give way to everything.




Artificial intelligence is no match, for natural stupidity



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  Reply # 584793 21-Feb-2012 20:29 Send private message

scuwp: There's a lot of study and research behind the change but a large part is down to the complex demands placed on the left turn driver. They have to:
  1. Check for approaching oncoming traffic
  2. Check if any oncoming traffic is turning right
  3. Check along the left side of the car for cyclists
  4. Check behind for following vehicles who may or may not be going straight ahead
  5. Judge if the following car (if going straight ahead) has room to get past and will proceed or not
  6. Judge if any successive following vehicles has room to pass
  7. Judge if the right turning car (which has right of way) has time to make the turn (and are they going to?)
  8. Watch for pedestrians
...all in the space of about 3 seconds!

It's all a bit confusing really.  After the law change only #3 and #8 apply, and it's easier to remember...if your turning right, you give way to everything.


Yeah far too much to think about so I got bullbars.

1757 posts

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  Reply # 584850 21-Feb-2012 22:12 Send private message

Probably the best thing about the change (and the worry about confusion) is....
(It appears) They're going to advertise it to the point that everyone should know what the rule is.

Overall that can't be a bad thing.

Of course it won't account for the people who see the ad once next week and apply it the next day (or the 1st of March). That'll be the problem period. The time between the first add and the last one....

484 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 584939 22-Feb-2012 08:17 Send private message

scuwp: There's a lot of study and research behind the change but a large part is down to the complex demands placed on the left turn driver. They have to:
  1. Check for approaching oncoming traffic
  2. Check if any oncoming traffic is turning right
  3. Check along the left side of the car for cyclists
  4. Check behind for following vehicles who may or may not be going straight ahead
  5. Judge if the following car (if going straight ahead) has room to get past and will proceed or not
  6. Judge if any successive following vehicles has room to pass
  7. Judge if the right turning car (which has right of way) has time to make the turn (and are they going to?)
  8. Watch for pedestrians
...all in the space of about 3 seconds!

It's all a bit confusing really.  After the law change only #3 and #8 apply, and it's easier to remember...if your turning right, you give way to everything.




Any competent driver will have checked 1~6 on approach to the corner which leaves 7 & 8 to check before turning. 

All without leaving a car hindering oncoming traffic by waiting to turn right.

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  Reply # 584940 22-Feb-2012 08:19 Send private message

Cars turning left never hinder traffic?

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  Reply # 584942 22-Feb-2012 08:33 Send private message

Some interesting points here

http://www.aa.co.nz/about/newsroom/media-releases/safety/aa-supports-government-s-plans-to-change-give-way-rules-and-improve-motorcycle-safety/

The Association has long been advocating for changes to the Give Way (Right Hand Turn) Rule because it is not well complied with on our roads and New Zealand is the only country where it still applies.

AA General Manager Motoring Affairs, Mike Noon, says “when you have large volumes of through-traffic, the Right Hand Give Way Rule often doesn’t work well and can result in uncertainty for drivers.”

“There are also risks, such as when someone has a left-turning indicator on because they have forgotten to turn it off - anyone turning right across their path will get a very nasty surprise. Police attend 40 to 50 injury crashes of this type a year.”

AA research has found that current give way rules are a factor in 6% to 7% of intersection crashes, and one or two deaths each year.

“We’re pleased that the Government has decided to tackle the issue and create more simple give way rules that are consistent with traffic rules in other countries. Having a traffic rule that is unique to New Zealand is dangerous, given the many overseas drivers on our roads, and of course for New Zealanders when they travel overseas,” says Mr Noon.

The AA estimates that during summer there can be up to 100,000 tourists at any one time driving on our roads with a foreign licence and following the give way rules they learned in their home countries.

The current give way rule was introduced in 1977 and states that a vehicle turning right (typically across the stream of traffic) takes precedence over a vehicle turning left. The rule came from Victoria, Australia, originally to assist trams on Melbourne’s streets, but Victoria changed back in 1993 and experienced a decline in intersection crashes as a result. Today New Zealand is the only country in the world with this priority rule.

“The AA will assist with driver education around the rule change as much as possible, but it is vital that there is a significant government education and advertising campaign to support the rule changes. It is also likely that some traffic light phasing will need to be reviewed and holding areas introduced to ensure the transition to the new rule is a smooth one,” says Mr Noon.

The AA is also very pleased to see the Government’s changes to improve motorcycle safety.

“Motorcycling is growing in popularity in New Zealand, but it comes with real dangers. For every kilometre that motorcyclists ride, they are 20 times more likely to be killed or seriously injured than a car driver. The fact that more people are taking up motorcycling, and that motorcycle and moped crashes are also increasing, is a clear indication that licensing and safety measures need attention.”

The Government’s intention to strengthen motorcycle licence tests and requirements, introduce power-to-weight restrictions for novice riders, develop and encourage refresher training for returning riders, and promote high visibility and protective clothing for riders, should significantly improve motorcycle safety, says Mr Noon

“They are very sensible and practical changes which will help keep riders safe.”

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  Reply # 584990 22-Feb-2012 09:54 Send private message

I think it will be fine. Easy to remember, if you are turning right (on an uncontrolled intersection), you have NO rights. Simple. Impatience will be the biggest problem, but that is no different to any other time.

768 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 584995 22-Feb-2012 09:56 Send private message

Putting aside all opinions over whether these changes are sensible or not, the fact is that these law changes will come into effect on 25 March and threads like this certainly raise awareness of the impending changes which can only be a good thing.





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  Reply # 585131 22-Feb-2012 12:41 Send private message

kiwitrc: Cars turning left never hinder traffic?


Most times, no.

Usually there is room to pull left before turning. 

65 posts

Master Geek


  Reply # 585282 22-Feb-2012 17:34 Send private message

Actually cars turning right won't cause any holdups under the new rule. In the UK I've hardly ever experienced delays caused by cars waiting to turn right. There's almost always space to drive past them on their left, even on quite narrow roads.

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