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Topic # 57496 15-Feb-2010 17:29 Send private message

Well Telecom's subsiduary in OZ are launching an all you can eat unthrottled BB plan for $99 AUD ( $130) with a two year sign up,

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/australian-it/aapt-launches-no-limit-broadband-plan/story-e6frgakx-1225830479094

I give it 6 months before it collapses under the leachers

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  Reply # 299164 15-Feb-2010 17:58 Send private message


This page http://www.aapt-broadband.com.au/unlimited-broadband-music-downloads/24-7-unlimited-bundle talks about unlimited ADSL2 speeds and  "no download limits and no throttling." but then further down they drop this wopper in "Broadband of 512K or higher"

So unlimited ADSL2 = 512K :-)

One of two things happens with a ISP launches these plans, the first is as predicted, the plan and sometimes the ISP crumples under the leachers, or they have redefined unlimited to not equal unlimited.





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  Reply # 299167 15-Feb-2010 18:11 Send private message

You mean "Only for AAPT broadband plans of 512k or higher."

This clause refers to the eligibility to stream stuff from their music store.




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  Reply # 299170 15-Feb-2010 18:37 Send private message

Predicted answer from Telecom NZ as to why they don't offer this in NZ: "Different markets" (yeah, because they actually have to compete in AU)

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  Reply # 299173 15-Feb-2010 18:46 Send private message

They do offer bigtime...




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  Reply # 299176 15-Feb-2010 19:03 Send private message

That's hardly the same. This is unthrottled.

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  Reply # 299181 15-Feb-2010 19:23 Send private message

Bigtime isn't throttled, it has traffic shaping.




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  Reply # 299182 15-Feb-2010 19:23 Send private message

Screeb: Predicted answer from Telecom NZ as to why they don't offer this in NZ: "Different markets" (yeah, because they actually have to compete in AU)


different costs too.

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  Reply # 299183 15-Feb-2010 19:25 Send private message

It looks like Big Time to me.

No capping and throttling is marketing spin - they mean no fixed data cap and no throttling to 64kbit after cap is exceeded (just like Big Time).

It will most certainly be traffic managed like Big Time, I read somewhere it's using effectively the same hardware tools to do the job.

I believe it even has the same 2am - 9am offpeak unmanaged p2p window that Big Time has.

Summary:  It's Big Time in AU

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  Reply # 299184 15-Feb-2010 19:29 Send private message

cokemaster: Bigtime isn't throttled, it has traffic shaping.


Whatever, semantics. That's what I meant and you know it. This AAPT plan doesn't have shaping.


NonprayingMantis: different costs too.


Are you saying that's what they will claim, or do you think that's a real reason? Given that Telecom essentially owns SCC and has its own national network, it would actually probably be cheaper for Telecom to offer such a plan in NZ than AU.

Ragnor: It looks like Big Time to me.

No capping and throttling is marketing spin - they mean no fixed data cap and no throttling to 64kbit after cap is exceeded (just like Big Time).

It will most certainly be traffic managed like Big Time, I read somewhere it's using effectively the same hardware tools to do the job.

I believe it even has the same 2am - 9am offpeak unmanaged p2p window that Big Time has.

Summary:  It's Big Time in AU


I see nothing in the terms that state that there is any shaping whatsoever. The "offpeak" time you're talking about is for AAPT's other plans.

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  Reply # 299193 15-Feb-2010 19:43 Send private message

Disregarding the off peak part it's still going to be like Big Time in that national traffic is fast/un-managed and international traffic will be some form of total bandwidth pool that gets shared out between all active users.

The contention ratio for international bandwidth will be whatever it economically sustainable, could be 1000:1, who knows?

Additionally it would be insane for them to not manage p2p/rapidshare traffic, so expect that to be managed in peak time.

As noted overseas the larger the scale of the ISP/customer base the easier it is to offer an unlimited plan.

It'll be interesting to see early reports of "performance" on this plan.  $5 says it's exacty like Big Time.

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  Reply # 299217 15-Feb-2010 20:09 Send private message

Ragnor: Disregarding the off peak part it's still going to be like Big Time in that national traffic is fast/un-managed and international traffic will be some form of total bandwidth pool that gets shared out between all active users.

The contention ratio for international bandwidth will be whatever it economically sustainable, could be 1000:1, who knows?

Additionally it would be insane for them to not manage p2p/rapidshare traffic, so expect that to be managed in peak time.

As noted overseas the larger the scale of the ISP/customer base the easier it is to offer an unlimited plan.

It'll be interesting to see early reports of "performance" on this plan.  $5 says it's exacty like Big Time.


Like I said, it still doesn't say anything about bandwidth pools, throttling or shaping. If they did something like manage p2p traffic without saying, I'm sure the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission would have something to say about that. So they're either going to get in trouble for not mentioning it, or it (shaping) doesn't exist.

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  Reply # 299228 15-Feb-2010 20:16 Send private message

The fact is at any point in time ISP has x bandwidth and y users, they are never ever ever provisioned 1:1 for residential internet services.

Residential internet is a shared network best effort service, a good (but still poor) analogy for bandwidth is imagine traffic as cars on a motorway.

Dedicated bandwidth is very expensive and regular residential consumer can not afford it.


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  Reply # 299243 15-Feb-2010 20:27 Send private message

So? I never said it was equivalent to dedicated bandwidth. I'm simply saying that it appears to be equivalent to a capped plan in terms of speed, only uncapped. Ie what is normally expected of a typical (uncapped) plan overseas, as opposed to Big Time, which is shaped far more than the typical overseas plan.

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  Reply # 299345 15-Feb-2010 22:31 Send private message

Had a good look through the AAPT site, and could find no details of any shaping. So one must conclude that it is not shaped (they have a commerce commission over there too).

It does sound too good to be true.

Australia does have a much much bigger domestic market than NZ, but I would have thought that they still have a good portion of expensive International traffic too. It does sound unsustainable.

Where's my popcorn?




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  Reply # 299366 15-Feb-2010 23:37 Send private message

AAPT has apparently invested heavily in caching.  That would certainly help them in reducing the cost of their unlimited service: http://www.itnews.com.au/News/155060,aapt-to-launch-a-commercial-cache-service.aspx

Another interesting quote in that article:
"It also helped, he said, that AAPT owner Telecom New Zealand owns half of the Southern Cross Cable."




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