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  Reply # 622967 10-May-2012 16:10 Send private message

Nebbie:
insane:
So can I hold you to that should the ISP you work for try doing the same?

Hold me to what? I don't have any crontrol over what any ISP does.

I agree that It sux that NZer's don't have access to NetFlix and the likes however this is a dodgy way of getting around the restraints . Put yourself into Netflix's, SkyTV's shoes your going to be pissed that someones making ways to bypass your current restaraints to protect your investment your going to do something about it.


I mean't hold you to your word that you wouldn't try such a product without a guarantee. 

I'm no expert in this, but from what I've been reading in the media over the last few days,  SKY don't have any rights to online broadcasting, so while they may be upset, they should rather innovate to keep ahead. From what I've heard iSKY has room for improvement.

If iSKY offered individual channels at a realistic price I'd sign up just so I could watch the F1 alone. I don't watch enough TV to justify a $90/month subscription.





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  Reply # 622969 10-May-2012 16:13 Send private message

insane:
Nebbie:
insane:
So can I hold you to that should the ISP you work for try doing the same?

Hold me to what? I don't have any crontrol over what any ISP does.

I agree that It sux that NZer's don't have access to NetFlix and the likes however this is a dodgy way of getting around the restraints . Put yourself into Netflix's, SkyTV's shoes your going to be pissed that someones making ways to bypass your current restaraints to protect your investment your going to do something about it.


I mean't hold you to your word that you wouldn't try such a product without a guarantee. 

I'm no expert in this, but from what I've been reading in the media over the last few days,  SKY don't have any rights to online broadcasting, so while they may be upset, they should rather innovate to keep ahead. From what I've heard iSKY has room for improvement.

If iSKY offered individual channels at a realistic price I'd sign up just so I could watch the F1 alone. I don't watch enough TV to justify a $90/month subscription.






Of course they have online rights – what on earth do you think iSky is?

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  Reply # 622982 10-May-2012 16:23 Send private message

NonprayingMantis:
Of course they have online rights – what on earth do you think iSky is?


Sorry of course, re-read the article I had read and it was talking about not having a monopoly, my mistake.  

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  Reply # 623142 10-May-2012 19:34 Send private message

NonprayingMantis: The reason they might be bothered is that they pay the rights holders for US rights, *not* NZ rights.

If the rights holders think they aren't taking reasonable precautions to not sell to non-US people, then their contracts with rights holders could be at risk.

Currently IP address checking is considered ?reasonable? by rights holders, but if lots of people do it, the rights holders might change their mind and require other checks, such as a US credit card or proof of US address


Netflix has about 24m customers in the US. Do you think anybody is going to be concerned about a few 100 (possibly thousand) customers outside the US viewing their content when they ostensibly should not be.

I would seriously doubt it. Similarly the content owners are also unlikely to be concerned about this drop in the ocean.

The situation is not dissimilar to Amazon selling BluRay discs outside the US when it normally states quite clearly for US sale only. This is to protect the local authorised distributors outside the US and their own profit margins but does Amazon caer?  Not really and they could easily stop doing it.

But note Amazon does care about some items they won't sell outside the US, primarily electronics,  but for others they will sell them.




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  Reply # 623149 10-May-2012 19:38 Send private message

lchiu7:
NonprayingMantis: The reason they might be bothered is that they pay the rights holders for US rights, *not* NZ rights.

If the rights holders think they aren't taking reasonable precautions to not sell to non-US people, then their contracts with rights holders could be at risk.

Currently IP address checking is considered ?reasonable? by rights holders, but if lots of people do it, the rights holders might change their mind and require other checks, such as a US credit card or proof of US address


Netflix has about 24m customers in the US. Do you think anybody is going to be concerned about a few 100 (possibly thousand) customers outside the US viewing their content when they ostensibly should not be.

I would seriously doubt it. Similarly the content owners are also unlikely to be concerned about this drop in the ocean.

The situation is not dissimilar to Amazon selling BluRay discs outside the US when it normally states quite clearly for US sale only. This is to protect the local authorised distributors outside the US and their own profit margins but does Amazon caer?  Not really and they could easily stop doing it.

But note Amazon does care about some items they won't sell outside the US, primarily electronics,  but for others they will sell them.


Amazon won't even sell MP3s outside the US.  Been like that for years.  Licensing they say.




Regards,

Old3eyes

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  Reply # 623191 10-May-2012 20:38 Send private message

I found this thread via a story on the front page of Boing Boing. So I hope they aren't depending on a low profile for the success of Global Mode.

http://boingboing.net/2012/05/09/kiwi-isp-offers-global-mode.html

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  Reply # 623300 10-May-2012 23:15 Send private message

lchiu7:
NonprayingMantis: The reason they might be bothered is that they pay the rights holders for US rights, *not* NZ rights.

If the rights holders think they aren't taking reasonable precautions to not sell to non-US people, then their contracts with rights holders could be at risk.

Currently IP address checking is considered ?reasonable? by rights holders, but if lots of people do it, the rights holders might change their mind and require other checks, such as a US credit card or proof of US address


Netflix has about 24m customers in the US. Do you think anybody is going to be concerned about a few 100 (possibly thousand) customers outside the US viewing their content when they ostensibly should not be.

I would seriously doubt it. Similarly the content owners are also unlikely to be concerned about this drop in the ocean.

.


maybe, but if they weren't that concerned, why have the regional protection in the first place?

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  Reply # 623319 11-May-2012 00:19 Send private message

NonprayingMantis: 

maybe, but if they weren't that concerned, why have the regional protection in the first place?


Netflix, Hulu etc don't own content, just licenses to show content online in the US.

The content owners/agents/distributors make more money from selling multiple types of licenses (online, offline, premiere, syndication) and segmenting in regional rights - instead of selling the rights once worldwide.

The content owners have lawyers.

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  Reply # 623322 11-May-2012 00:22 Send private message

Ragnor:
NonprayingMantis: 

maybe, but if they weren't that concerned, why have the regional protection in the first place?


Netflix are not content owner.

The content owner/agent/distributor makes more money from selling multiple regional rights instead of selling the rights once worldwide.

The content owners have lawyers.


right, that was my previous point.  Netflix might care because the rights holders will care.

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  Reply # 623339 11-May-2012 07:59 Send private message

Very simple solution to the arguments you guys are still talking about.

Solution:
No Fixed Contract...

What this means is if said Netflix Hulu or whoever do block this then YOU as a customer of Fyx have a choice.. Either go to another ISP (realistically you would only do this if you only wanted netflix from Fyx & not the per gb price point) OR carry on with Fyx if it is meeting your requirements for Broadband & is of a price you are happy to pay..

Not happy Change ISP
Happy? Do what you want

Fyx are not Guaranteeing this as they have no control over how these non related companies will react so they have done the right thing & not tried to tie you in for a 12 month contract

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  Reply # 623343 11-May-2012 08:04 Send private message

So if the rights holders are that concerned why have they not gone after unblock-us?  It clearly states on it's website that it is all about getting around geo blocking.  They would have one hell of a lot more users than fyx will ever have.

gzt

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  Reply # 623346 11-May-2012 08:21 Send private message

wallop: So if the rights holders are that concerned why have they not gone after unblock-us?  It clearly states on it's website that it is all about getting around geo blocking.  They would have one hell of a lot more users than fyx will ever have.

You could ask that question about any number of content carrying internet services. It takes time for enough case law to become established to make legal action possible and successful + lobbying to get politicians onside. Why do you think the leader of the opposition is having private dinners with Sky executives? Do you think this kind of relationship with politicians might be helpful to establish a walled garden with crap content? Money Mouth

We are the 99%.

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  Reply # 623417 11-May-2012 10:15 Send private message

wallop: So if the rights holders are that concerned why have they not gone after unblock-us?  It clearly states on it's website that it is all about getting around geo blocking.  They would have one hell of a lot more users than fyx will ever have.


could be any number of reasons:

maybe they know that shutting down what amounts to basically a website for ublck-US will simply result in another one springing up somewhere else instantly  becaus it costs virtualy nothing to setup (same cannot be said for an NZ ISP - if the first ISP to offer this gets shut down by the copyright mafia, no other ISP will ever try it)

Maybe unblock-us is registered somewhere that is dificult or impossible to take legal action e.g. eastern europe, Russia, etc (same cannot be said for a NZ based company)

Maybe they think that if Fyx suceeds then other, much larger, ISPs globally might decide to do the same thing - ratcheting up the number of people by considerable amount.


But really who knows. I'm not NBCUniversal, Warners etc so I don;t know how they think (or even whether they think rationally at all!). Maybe they will just ignore the whole thing. Maybe they won't.

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  Reply # 623524 11-May-2012 13:22 Send private message

All this discussion is pretty interesting and the pricing for Fyx is great but i think one point almost everyone has missed is if this is successful and Netflix etc see this they may actually try and offer us content without circumventing there systems (i understand this is a long shot but hey it could happen)

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  Reply # 623525 11-May-2012 13:24 Send private message

Tk421nz: All this discussion is pretty interesting and the pricing for Fyx is great but i think one point almost everyone has missed is if this is successful and Netflix etc see this they may actually try and offer us content without circumventing there systems (i understand this is a long shot but hey it could happen)

True - one of their reasons for not setting up here was the very low caps - If we have a cost effective pay as you go ISP that is one of the hurdles removed.  Good point well put.




Procrastination eventually pays off.

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