Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.



2 posts

Wannabe Geek


Topic # 106805 31-Jul-2012 21:27 Send private message

Hi all,

Does anyone here have a Heat Pump Water Heater ?
Looking for advice on split-type units, and efficiency during winter and summer months.
Hoping especially to hear from people in Christchurch.

The ones reviewed in consumer org are 3 years old, and there's only 1 split type
http://www.consumer.org.nz/reports/heat-pump-water-heaters

There was a 10-unit trial of Exceed-branded units in Burnham Military Camp but i can't seem to find the actual result.
http://www.eeca.govt.nz/node/5960

Thanks !

View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
 1 | 2 | 3
2895 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 33

Trusted

  Reply # 665097 1-Aug-2012 06:10 Send private message

Their cost in NZ is a bit high, not worth the power saving. Years ago there was a very nice model on TradeMe but it was taken off. I suspect it did not have local approval. But was a very nice unit for half the price of the subsidised retail units.




You can never have enough Volvos!


876 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 53


  Reply # 665102 1-Aug-2012 06:51 Send private message

Niel: Their cost in NZ is a bit high, not worth the power saving. Years ago there was a very nice model on TradeMe but it was taken off. I suspect it did not have local approval. But was a very nice unit for half the price of the subsidised retail units.


Of course they're 'worth' the power saving because they're more efficient to run albeit with a higher up front cost.

It seems to be the Kiwi way to only do something if there's something in it for them. Why can't people see the bigger picture in that if we all do something to reduce consumption then in the end we ALL benefit.

Note this isn't a personal attack but a vent of frustration at the general apathy here in terms of efficiency.

7065 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 504

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 665111 1-Aug-2012 07:36 Send private message

There's efficiency with money as well as with energy. According to consumer the payback period is too long to bother with unless you use a lot of hot water, and it takes resources to build them too.

I expect them to be more worthwhile in a few years, but not yet, they're still new in NZ.




Asus eee pad transformer
iPod 2G
Windows 7 PC
Lots and lots of Nikon camera gear

876 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 53


  Reply # 665121 1-Aug-2012 08:10 Send private message

It's this obsession with payback period that stagnates the kiwi building industry, that's why you're only just starting to use double glazing (and even then only because the building code has been changed). Everyone uses pink batts even though you can get products that have double the r value but still fitting in the standard 90mm framing.

Until more people commit to helping the majority instead of the rather selfish 'what's in it for me' approach these superior products will remain out of reach for the majority as greater demand equals lower prices.


4788 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 126

Trusted

  Reply # 665122 1-Aug-2012 08:17 Send private message

I think enforcement is the only way you're going to see this situation change. Fundamentally, it's bad business practise to purchase equipment that costs far more up front than you're ever going to save by using it. That additional money could be in a bank earning interest for the life of the product instead of being sunk into a low energy device that's not really low energy enough.

Like it or not, that's the society we live in. There's low cost and low energy consumption, and they're not the necessarily the same thing.  Heat pumps are the flavour of the day, but they do have downsides that don't appear to be acknowledged enough currently.  There are concerns regarding defrost cycle frequency in temperate winter locations, and the power factor/back effect on the supply grid by using more Aircon units etc.

If we as a society did chose to value low energy consumption (which we should, as this reduces the need for more power stations, not all of which are 'nice' on the environment) then we need some form of enforcement or incentive scheme to promote the use of these devices.  Just to be clear, I'm all for this, as I think we trade on the 'Clean and Green' banner despite not doing enough to ensure that is sustainable.  I feel we're clean and green due to our location and not yet stuffing it up, rather than much we're actively doing to ensure this situation continues.

7065 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 504

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 665125 1-Aug-2012 08:23 Send private message

langers1972: It's this obsession with payback period that stagnates the kiwi building industry, that's why you're only just starting to use double glazing (and even then only because the building code has been changed). Everyone uses pink batts even though you can get products that have double the r value but still fitting in the standard 90mm framing.

Until more people commit to helping the majority instead of the rather selfish 'what's in it for me' approach these superior products will remain out of reach for the majority as greater demand equals lower prices.



I agree, to a point. Insulation and double glazing have huge benefits, save a lot of energy and reduce condensation making a home more liveable, and aren't that much more expensive than single glazing or no insulation. When something has more costs than benefits though I would tend to disagree.

Which insulation has double the R value of pink batts?

You could always move to a socialist country...




Asus eee pad transformer
iPod 2G
Windows 7 PC
Lots and lots of Nikon camera gear

876 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 53


  Reply # 665160 1-Aug-2012 09:00 Send private message

timmmay: Which insulation has double the R value of pink batts?


PIR board which is basic standard in most of Europe, see http://www.celotex.co.uk/products/celotex-products/celotex-ga4000 Can get it here for $52/sqm which is double R2.8 batts but it's twice as effective and ought to be the go to product here.

3540 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 405

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 665169 1-Aug-2012 09:13 Send private message

langers1972:
timmmay: Which insulation has double the R value of pink batts?


PIR board which is basic standard in most of Europe, see http://www.celotex.co.uk/products/celotex-products/celotex-ga4000 Can get it here for $52/sqm which is double R2.8 batts but it's twice as effective and ought to be the go to product here.


Good grief I have to fill out my life history to get a F#$king data sheet. Looks like a great product though as I guess it wont compress like pink batts either. I hate pink batts.

876 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 53


  Reply # 665177 1-Aug-2012 09:25 Send private message

Poor formatting but this gives you an idea (I can't attach the PDF)

Product Code Thickness (mm) R-value (m?K/W) Weight (kg/m?)
GA4050 50 2.25 1.55
GA4055 55 2.50 1.74
GA4060 60 2.70 1.90
GA4065 65 2.95 2.05
GA4070 70 3.15 2.19
GA4075 75 3.40 2.34
GA4080 80 3.60 2.48
GA4085 85 3.85 2.62
GA4090 90 4.05 2.76
GA4095 95 4.30 2.90
GA4100 100 4.50 3.27

These guys import it into NZ and are very knowledgeable http://www.composite-nz.co.nz/dynamicpage.asp?pageid=1 

4788 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 126

Trusted

  Reply # 665194 1-Aug-2012 09:37 Send private message

kiwitrc: . I hate pink batts.
Especially the blown approach. 

I had blown rockwool and blown pink batts in my roof, and they had all subsequently been blown to one end of the roof.  30cm deep over one end of my lounge and bare gib board ceiling over the wind facing rooms....

7065 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 504

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 665198 1-Aug-2012 09:40 Send private message

Why's there so much wind in your ceiling?




Asus eee pad transformer
iPod 2G
Windows 7 PC
Lots and lots of Nikon camera gear

4788 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 126

Trusted

  Reply # 665201 1-Aug-2012 09:46 Send private message

timmmay: Why's there so much wind in your ceiling?


Ha, true!  I suspect the bulk of that thickness was from the actual install process but definitely it was thinner towards the wind facing side of the house.  Natural leaks I guess, coupled with the standard roof vents.  In addition there were some very unfortunate bracing beams near that same wind facing side which would have prevented the insulation from being able to be blown into that area as well.

I quite like the wide blanket approach, it's supposed to result in a better overall 'system' r value than laying the same r value insulation down between the ceiling beams.  Must be a nightmare to work in the ceilings afterwards though, as you'd not be able to see the beams/cables underneath any more.

Sorry, none of this relates to heat pump hot water heaters.

I iz your trusted friend
5297 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 52

Mod Emeritus
Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 665214 1-Aug-2012 10:05 Send private message

We have it. And works brilliantly well. This is our model: http://www.rheem.co.nz/heat-pump-water-heaters/product/A551310/

We have the single unit one - saved us some indoor space by putting the water tank and the heating unit outside. It worked well through the 2011 and 2012 snow storms. We installed it back in later 2010.




Internet is my backyard...

«Geekzone blog: Tech 'n Chips Takeaway» «Personal blog: And then...» «Photo blog: I see...»

Please read the Geekzone's FUG


7065 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 504

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 665248 1-Aug-2012 10:48 Send private message

Did your power bill drop significantly when you got it chiefie?




Asus eee pad transformer
iPod 2G
Windows 7 PC
Lots and lots of Nikon camera gear

I iz your trusted friend
5297 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 52

Mod Emeritus
Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 665258 1-Aug-2012 10:57 Send private message

timmmay: Did your power bill drop significantly when you got it chiefie?


Seems to have, but then we don't actually actively "conserve" the power usage. We're with Powershop as well but this year, we haven't "stock up" for winter.

Regardless, we enjoy having the HPWH as it heats up water quicker and seems to have unlimited hot water for 4 people, twice a day shower and hot water dish washing. The heating cycles happen throughout the day when the temperature is below a certain threshold and it spins up and heat for short period then spin down.

It takes a bit to get use with a very low rumbling noise - as with any heat pump - soon slowly it just become ambient noise that you won't notice so much of. We didn't have any heat pump unit so it was pretty obvious to us at the very start.




Internet is my backyard...

«Geekzone blog: Tech 'n Chips Takeaway» «Personal blog: And then...» «Photo blog: I see...»

Please read the Geekzone's FUG


 1 | 2 | 3
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic




Twitter »
Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





Trending now »

Hot discussions in our forums right now:

Government Limos
Created by networkn, last reply by Bung on 31-Oct-2014 12:39 (94 replies)
Pages... 5 6 7


Snap refuses to replace faulty gear
Created by Brendan, last reply by MadEngineer on 28-Oct-2014 19:07 (92 replies)
Pages... 5 6 7


How good is your general Science Knowledge?
Created by Aredwood, last reply by joker97 on 31-Oct-2014 20:31 (28 replies)
Pages... 2


Sky will be 'upgrading software' of My Sky to connect to internet. What does that mean?
Created by Geektastic, last reply by hio77 on 31-Oct-2014 19:14 (23 replies)
Pages... 2


Shutup and take my money (via NFC on my mobile phone)
Created by sxz, last reply by afe66 on 31-Oct-2014 19:19 (22 replies)
Pages... 2


Speed limit when overtaking? Teach me please.
Created by nakedmolerat, last reply by joker97 on 28-Oct-2014 17:13 (123 replies)
Pages... 7 8 9


Uber: a cheaper taxi ride?
Created by kingdragonfly, last reply by livisun on 31-Oct-2014 14:47 (34 replies)
Pages... 2 3


DDos Protection from ISP
Created by charsleysa, last reply by freitasm on 31-Oct-2014 12:11 (46 replies)
Pages... 2 3 4



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.

Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.