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367 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 761759 13-Feb-2013 14:28 Send private message

gcorgnet:
wallop: We had a shade sail attached to one of our houses.  The installers had a 6mm steel plate made up for the house connection.  It was in a corner and the plate was then bolted to 2 or 3 rafters that meet at that point.  The other ends were attached to telephone poles buried 3 - 4 metres in the ground.  I remember them saying that they had seen rafters pulled off a house because the sail was attached incorrectly.  The shade sails have a alot of force applied when it is windy.  We have a different one currently that is attached to 4 120mm steel poles.  Once it hailed and the weight on the sail bowed the poles.  They went back in to shape was I got the melted hail off the sail.  You are meant to take the sails down if it is going to hail or snow.  A lot of poles bent out of shape down here last year when it snowed.


Wow, sounds like these shade sails are evil!

I guess the size would matter as well with bigger sails putting much bigger force, etc..

If you got that professionally installed, was it around Auckland and would you mind sharing the contact?

Thanks,

Guillaume


Down in Christchurch I'm afraid.  They were pretty big sails, our current one is 6 x 6 and made of a solid pvc like shade material.

4 posts

Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 761777 13-Feb-2013 15:06 Send private message

Hi Bill,

The shade sail thing is a big deal.  Don't want to get it wrong.  Some pointers that I took on board from my builder father-in-law...

Use stainless steel, costs more but won't rust.
Attaching to veneers will pull the veneer off.  If you attach to brick veneer with a dynabolt the bolt will pull the brick away from the rest of the bricks/mortar.
Take the sail down when daylight savings finishes.
Use large diameter screws into timber with open hooks to attach sail.
Before you dig a hole make sure there are no below ground services such as water, drainage (storm and foul water), telecoms, power, gas.

Good luck.



346 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 14


  Reply # 761792 13-Feb-2013 15:26 Send private message

rmackay: Hi Bill,

The shade sail thing is a big deal.  Don't want to get it wrong.  Some pointers that I took on board from my builder father-in-law...

Use stainless steel, costs more but won't rust.
Attaching to veneers will pull the veneer off.  If you attach to brick veneer with a dynabolt the bolt will pull the brick away from the rest of the bricks/mortar.
Take the sail down when daylight savings finishes.
Use large diameter screws into timber with open hooks to attach sail.
Before you dig a hole make sure there are no below ground services such as water, drainage (storm and foul water), telecoms, power, gas.

Good luck.




Thanks for the tips!

So for brick veneer the idea would be to go through the bricks and find a stud? Would that be string enough?



346 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 14


  Reply # 761794 13-Feb-2013 15:29 Send private message

Handsomedan: I have a Cedar house that i have had a shade sail attached to for about 6-7 years.

I have used the flat-plated eylets from the picture above (Pic 1) and they are marine grade stainless.
I used large marine grade stainless screws to screw directly into the studs on the house and then used the other style of eyelets (Pic 2) ion the posts at the other end.



Hey,

Thanks for that. So how did you get to the studs? Drilled through the Cedar? How long do the screws need to be?



Thanks,

Guillaume

4 posts

Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 761796 13-Feb-2013 15:35 Send private message


I probably wouldn't go through bricks at all, even if you could find a stud behind the brickwork.



346 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 14


  Reply # 761799 13-Feb-2013 15:42 Send private message

rmackay:
I probably wouldn't go through bricks at all, even if you could find a stud behind the brickwork.


Ok, so my only option would be to go through the fascia and screw onto the rafters (assuming I can find them). Is that correct?

4 posts

Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 761803 13-Feb-2013 15:48 Send private message

I think so.

1464 posts

Uber Geek
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  Reply # 761804 13-Feb-2013 15:50 Send private message

I think finding a stud behind bricks would be real pain, and even then you would need a hoofing-long (like 150mm) self tapping eyelet/hook to make a strong connection into the stud.

My best bet would be a chunky (like 10mm+ diameter) self taping cup hook screwed through the soffit into the rafter

7372 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 408


  Reply # 761806 13-Feb-2013 15:51 Send private message

gcorgnet:
rmackay:
I probably wouldn't go through bricks at all, even if you could find a stud behind the brickwork.


Ok, so my only option would be to go through the fascia and screw onto the rafters (assuming I can find them). Is that correct?


I wouldn't think that would be strong enough, as no dout you will be going into eeh end of the rafter in the same directon as the wood grain, which is weak.

I would install proper posts, possible galvansied. You may pay more, but at least you can install it exactly where you want it.



346 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 14


  Reply # 761823 13-Feb-2013 16:27 Send private message

Thanks for the tips!

Well, doesn't sound like there is a proper way to attach a sail to my house, then...

Posts my be the way to go even though like you say this will be more expensive and probably won't look that nice...

The thing is that the sail was supposed to be a semi-cheap semi-temporary thing before I spend more money and get a pergola or something like that put in...

If it won't be cheap and won't be temporary (as in posts sticking out everywhere) then I might have to re-think the whole thing...

sigh...

470 posts

Ultimate Geek
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  Reply # 761847 13-Feb-2013 17:16 Send private message

Why dont you screw a piece of ( eg 6x1) the lenght of the soffit, or at least long enough for the length of the shade sail , paint it the same colour , then screw the eyes / hooks through that and the timber underneath , spreading the load.

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  Reply # 761861 13-Feb-2013 17:46 Send private message

I am looking at doing this in the future and have a brick house with slightly larger soffits than you have. Some neighbors around the road from us have large eyelets attached vertically into the soffit. I like the idea of timber along the underside of the soffit idea.

I was going to ring a sail place and see if they had an engineer to do the loading calculations but ran out of money this year!

Cheers, Mat.




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7372 posts

Uber Geek
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  Reply # 761868 13-Feb-2013 17:52 Send private message

hairy1: I am looking at doing this in the future and have a brick house with slightly larger soffits than you have. Some neighbors around the road from us have large eyelets attached vertically into the soffit. I like the idea of timber along the underside of the soffit idea.

I was going to ring a sail place and see if they had an engineer to do the loading calculations but ran out of money this year!

Cheers, Mat.



Depends on how well the house is built, as to what the soffit supports are connected to and how well. They are only designed to hold up the soffit linings after all. Connecting to the rafters would be far stronger, as they would be partly supporting the soffits anyway. Fixing ripped out soffit linings would be expensive.

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  Reply # 761869 13-Feb-2013 18:00 Send private message

I am sure the eyelets are through to the rafters. They look pretty substantial and are set closer to the house than the guttering.




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1973 posts

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  Reply # 761870 13-Feb-2013 18:02 Send private message

I thought the idea of the timber was screws into the rafter.




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