Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.

Filter this topic showing only the reply marked as answer View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
1 | 2 | 3 | 4
6093 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 208


  Reply # 765473 18-Feb-2013 22:17 Send private message

networkn: 3 attempts is a reasonable number under which to claim. 1 is not enough. Items fail, it's a fact of life, those suggesting a single failure warrants a replacement or refund aren't being reasonable nor following the spirit of the laws. I do personally feel that the current laws are bent too far in favour of the consumer, and put an unfair burden on the retailer who isn't guaranteed the same protection from their up-link suppliers. 


I don't disagree. However retailers do have to build these costs into their margins. If NZ didn't have these consumer laws, far more people would just buy stuff directly from overseas where there is no consumer protection apart from the manufacturers global warranty if it exists. I believe it  is partly there to self regulate the market, so NZ doesn't get poor quality goods dumped on the market, and kiwis don't get ripped off.

I believe on Fair Go about a year ago, the lady from the Ministry of Consumer Affairs specifically said that companies don't get a specific number of chances to repair an item, it should be fixed on the first attempt, and there is no reason why most faults shouldn't be fixed on the first attempt. They said that there was a misconception that they should get 3 chances to fix something, which over time could be many months without the goods.

6097 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 383

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 765481 18-Feb-2013 22:22 Send private message

mattwnz:
networkn: 3 attempts is a reasonable number under which to claim. 1 is not enough. Items fail, it's a fact of life, those suggesting a single failure warrants a replacement or refund aren't being reasonable nor following the spirit of the laws. I do personally feel that the current laws are bent too far in favour of the consumer, and put an unfair burden on the retailer who isn't guaranteed the same protection from their up-link suppliers. 


I don't disagree. However retailers do have to build these costs into their margins. If NZ didn't have these consumer laws, far more people would just buy stuff directly from overseas where there is no consumer protection apart from the manufacturers global warranty if it exists. I believe it  is partly there to self regulate the market, so NZ doesn't get poor quality goods dumped on the market, and kiwis don't get ripped off.

I believe on Fair Go about a year ago, the lady from the Ministry of Consumer Affairs specifically said that companies don't get a specific number of chances to repair an item, it should be fixed on the first attempt, and there is no reason why most faults shouldn't be fixed on the first attempt. They said that there was a misconception that they should get 3 chances to fix something, which over time could be many months without the goods.


Heh, see only someone like that woman who has likely never had to troubleshoot an intermittent or poorly described issue, or one with multiple factors would say something so dumb. I believe so long as the retailer is making a genuine attempt and the impact to the customer is kept to a minimum, then I believe it's equally the customers responsibility to be understanding and allow a reasonable number of repair events to occur. I believe the laws serve a purpose, but I think they are unbalanced in the direction of the consumer, who can pretty much hold a retailer to ransom.

6093 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 208


  Reply # 765495 18-Feb-2013 22:38 Send private message

networkn:

Heh, see only someone like that woman who has likely never had to troubleshoot an intermittent or poorly described issue, or one with multiple factors would say something so dumb. I believe so long as the retailer is making a genuine attempt and the impact to the customer is kept to a minimum, then I believe it's equally the customers responsibility to be understanding and allow a reasonable number of repair events to occur. I believe the laws serve a purpose, but I think they are unbalanced in the direction of the consumer, who can pretty much hold a retailer to ransom.


Sure there are intermittent problems that are difficult to resolve or even replicate. But these problems are even more frustrating to the consumer, when you have an expensive item and it has a fault. You then send something off that has a fault, and either it returns with them saying they couldn't find a fault. Or they say it has been repaired, when nothing has been done to fix it, and the same fault persists, eg they may have fixed something else. Sometimes it comes down to how much information the customer provides, and also good for them to video the fault to provide as much information initially about the fault. Many customers wouldn't do this, which is possibly why more attempts maybe needed. But I think if the customer did originally provide all the relevant information needed, it should be resolved in the first attempt, unless more complex in nature. Some good faith is needed, but it needs to be from both sides
The OPs fault sounds like it is more of a difficult one, and maybe more than one separate fault. But still the retailer should be sorting it, rather than telling them to go to the manufacturer. 

6097 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 383

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 765497 18-Feb-2013 22:44 Send private message

 

Sure there are intermittent problems that are difficult to resolve or even replicate. But these problems are even more frustrating to the consumer, when you have an expensive item and it has a fault. You then send something off that has a fault, and either it returns with them saying they couldn't find a fault. Or they say it has been repaired, when nothing has been done to fix it, and the same fault persists, eg they may have fixed something else. Sometimes it comes down to how much information the customer provides, and also good for them to video the fault to provide as much information initially about the fault. Many customers wouldn't do this, which is possibly why more attempts maybe needed. But I think if the customer did originally provide all the relevant information needed, it should be resolved in the first attempt, unless more complex in nature. Some good faith is needed, but it needs to be from both sides
The OPs fault sounds like it is more of a difficult one, and maybe more than one separate fault. But still the retailer should be sorting it, rather than telling them to go to the manufacturer. 


His issue does sound more complicated than some repairs, and I am not necessarily commenting based on his example, rather responding to those who wheel out the CGA as the preferred method of resolution every time something happens with a device, or purchase. PB shouldn't have acted the way they did, but honestly I am not surprised, as will many others, as their point of difference is price. It does constantly amaze me that often those who make the most noise are the ones who get the cheapest product from the cheapest supplier as if there is no connection made at the time of purchase and no allowance made to compensate them on their savings.... Have your cake and eat it too, I think is the phrase used to describe it.

6093 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 208


  Reply # 765502 18-Feb-2013 22:51 Send private message

networkn: 
His issue does sound more complicated than some repairs, and I am not necessarily commenting based on his example, rather responding to those who wheel out the CGA as the preferred method of resolution every time something happens with a device, or purchase. PB shouldn't have acted the way they did, but honestly I am not surprised, as will many others, as their point of difference is price. It does constantly amaze me that often those who make the most noise are the ones who get the cheapest product from the cheapest supplier as if there is no connection made at the time of purchase and no allowance made to compensate them on their savings.... Have your cake and eat it too, I think is the phrase used to describe it.


Yeap we don't know what the issues the OP laptop really has, and whether they are even user generated faults. Laptops can get a hard life, and knocked around, and whether something has dislodged, or a harddrive failed from being knocked while it is writing to the disk.  There are always two sides to every story. I was a little confused though when they said that some seal had been broken, which sounded like the manufacturer had suggested that the OP may have opened the laptops case themselves.



14 posts

Geek


  Reply # 765524 19-Feb-2013 00:47 Send private message

The laptop I purchased is an ultra book Timeline series which is a mid range laptop. So I have a higher expectation then a student budget one. 

I think the law bend towards the consumer for a good reason because consumer is usually the minority group with less negotiation power compare to the much bigger retail chain stores by scale. From business point of view, the return or repairs of goods are part of the cost for selling the products. Of course the retailer will bear a higher risk for selling more profitable compare to something in $2 shop. 

Surely there are people around abuse the law somehow but there are more bullied by the retailers simply because of lack of expertise. In this case its lucky that my IT background and my experience in the field helped me or I would have thought "Its all my fault".

I have been told today Acer tech would put a sticker on the screw to show the repair is done and ensure no one opens it. It was not there out of the box. I did sign a form upon pickup from repair center but its only a form to acknowledge the pickup. in fact the sticker is on where you would upgrade your Ram so it doesn't make sense to place a sticker there. 

I was shaking my head when they said " the cover was not pop properly and the sticker is broken so it proves someone unprofessional has opened it up". I said" thank you for reminding me how poorer Acer has completed the repair"

Moreover, I try to be reasonable for me to not just asking for cash refund but in fact I asked for an upgrade so they can still make some money even there high end laptops are more expensive. Unfortunately they just don't want to deal with it.





333 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 20

Trusted

  Reply # 765553 19-Feb-2013 08:12 Send private message

The fun part is when PB Tech refuse to help with a warranty and the customer calls the distributor. PB Tech parallel import a lot of their products (that's how they undercut everyone else), so the NZ distributor generally can't/won't assist with a warranty claim.

327 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 8


  Reply # 765556 19-Feb-2013 08:16 Send private message

They blocked you from their FaceBook page? What pricks...

333 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 20

Trusted

  Reply # 765559 19-Feb-2013 08:24 Send private message

StevieT: They blocked you from their FaceBook page? What pricks...


Quite common among companies who let their Facebook be run by traditional PR people and not those who actually use social networking. They just see it as analogous to spraypainting "Acer sucks" on the side of their building.

4624 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 77

Trusted

  Reply # 765564 19-Feb-2013 08:46 Send private message

I'm pretty sick of companies trying to act just as intermediaries, whereby they clip the ticket on selling the goods, but don't want to stand by any of their post sale obligations. As others have said before, we as consumers don't actually deal with the manufacturer much, short of getting drivers/updates directly from them.

If something goes wrong, and you're within a realistic warranty period, you go back to whomever sold you the goods. It's then over to them to progress this with their supplier, not you.

1035 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 24


  Reply # 765591 19-Feb-2013 09:18 Send private message

rickdias099: Thanks All,
I asked them what have been done so far and they said they chased Acer for me but unfortunately acer is not approving the credit.

I said last time I lose important data because of the fault so why would I try again after 3 issues?


FYI the fact you lost data is not really a good arguementative subject. Much the same as it wouldn't be up to them to send a failed HDD to data recovery to get anything back should it fail.

Yet to find a manufacturer that considers user data backup/restore warrantable. (this is listed on the acers)


1. Loss of Stored Data
The repair of goods capable of retaining user-generated data may result in the loss of data stored on those goods.


It is up to the owner to make sure any data is backed up. In somce cases even a SW reload is not covered if you did not take the opportunity to create the restore CD Kit when requested on first 1-5 bootups and the CDs have to be requested from australia.

For nearly all brand name PCs generally any SW that ships with the device not working for one or other reason usually has a 90 day out of box cover phone support. However this does not cover loading all in sundry and all of a sudden it starting to blue screen.

In general, and this is for most brand name devices I've dealt with - if issues can be resolved by the unit being restored by a factory reload, then it won't be covered. Its the first thing that should be considered when issues arise as an isolation test and quite likely to be performed in shop if it is not an obvious HW causing it. But don't expect your data to be backed up and restored onto it for free.



14 posts

Geek


  Reply # 765725 19-Feb-2013 12:46 Send private message

In regards to data lose, what I meant was the risk of losing data due to the known faults of this laptop. I understand its the user's responsibility to backup the SAVED data. However, if I give you a laptop and you experienced at least 3 issues where you did not even have a chance to save your data, would you keep trying so as to establish enough hardware faults to justify for a credit approval.

I also have to emphasis, the faults were not developed over time but within a month. I kind of make sense if it happens over a year or 2 , but 1 month? Come on....

852 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 51


  Reply # 765727 19-Feb-2013 12:46 Send private message

So did the OP open the laptop up? I have only ever had good experiences dealing with Acer on warranty issues and resolution.

If they believe something the user did caused the fault then they are will within their rights to refuse warranty, and PB Tech would be silly to honour the warranty only to have it refused to them by Acer.

As always and stated below there are always 2 sides to every story, and I have a feeling we are only being told one and a half sides of the story.




I know a little more than nothing but not much...

6097 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 383

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 765729 19-Feb-2013 12:49 Send private message

rickdias099: In regards to data lose, what I meant was the risk of losing data due to the known faults of this laptop. I understand its the user's responsibility to backup the SAVED data. However, if I give you a laptop and you experienced at least 3 issues where you did not even have a chance to save your data, would you keep trying so as to establish enough hardware faults to justify for a credit approval.

I also have to emphasis, the faults were not developed over time but within a month. I kind of make sense if it happens over a year or 2 , but 1 month? Come on....


No i think you are missing the point. If your data is important, anything you want to keep should be kept in a backed up state. If you can afford to lose a weeks data, ok to backup weekly, if you can lose a day, backup daily, if you can't lose any, backup continuously. 

You are confusing the faults with the backups, and they are not directly linked




6093 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 208


  Reply # 766016 19-Feb-2013 21:58 Send private message

StevieT: They blocked you from their FaceBook page? What pricks...


I looked at their website, and I can see a number of posts from disguntled cusomters having problems. So maybe they don't delete them all.
Personally I have had a few acer computers from new , and have never had any faults with them. But they were pretty underpowered machines I found.

1 | 2 | 3 | 4
Filter this topic showing only the reply marked as answer View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic








Twitter »
Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new jobs are posted to our jobs board:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:




News »

Trending now »
Hot discussions in our forums right now:

Forms of government for New Zealand
Created by charsleysa, last reply by sir1963 on 19-Apr-2014 20:52 (108 replies)
Pages... 6 7 8


MH370 - Call for Search & Rescue Help
Created by DS248, last reply by Sideface on 17-Apr-2014 17:28 (735 replies)
Pages... 47 48 49


galaxy s4 now on 4.4.2
Created by nzrock, last reply by Yabanize on 19-Apr-2014 21:59 (56 replies)
Pages... 2 3 4


why does the tax payer have to pay for the prince and princess' 6 star holiday?
Created by joker97, last reply by Geektastic on 17-Apr-2014 15:49 (67 replies)
Pages... 3 4 5


Paywave unauthorised transaction
Created by Ford, last reply by NonprayingMantis on 19-Apr-2014 22:06 (15 replies)

Whats the best wife friendly media centre?
Created by amorpeth, last reply by jonolynn on 19-Apr-2014 20:20 (14 replies)

Snap suffering Trans-Tasman congestion 18/04?
Created by Lias, last reply by NonprayingMantis on 19-Apr-2014 00:05 (26 replies)
Pages... 2


Help ! Home business connection and VDSL dead. yikes.
Created by Scotsman, last reply by Scotsman on 17-Apr-2014 21:10 (26 replies)
Pages... 2



Geekzone Live »
Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.

Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.