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4 posts

Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 690677 24-Sep-2012 15:28 Send private message

Whose problem is it - Clear or Xtra.  It is only Clear of Paradise this is happening with... Thanks


18 posts

Geek


  Reply # 690687 24-Sep-2012 15:42 Send private message

lawiephillips: Whose problem is it - Clear or Xtra.  It is only Clear of Paradise this is happening with... Thanks



If your question is who is responsible for the mess, then it is almost certainly Telecom (xtra). Please take care to read the forum. It is complicated, and not how it might look at first glance.

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Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 690713 24-Sep-2012 16:38 Send private message

Thank you for responding to my query - I did not realise it was a blog for experts!! I am far from one... However I will contact Telecom yet again, I don't want to get my own domain and I am annoyed that Telecom should let this happen, I guess this is what happens when one uses a monopoly...  I will put something on my facebook and twitter but somehow think Telecom will continue to ignore the problem.


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  Reply # 690726 24-Sep-2012 16:48 Send private message

lawiephillips: Thank you for responding to my query - I did not realise it was a blog for experts!! I am far from one... However I will contact Telecom yet again, I don't want to get my own domain and I am annoyed that Telecom should let this happen, I guess this is what happens when one uses a monopoly...  I will put something on my facebook and twitter but somehow think Telecom will continue to ignore the problem.



If enough customers complain loudly enough I'm sure they'll get on to it.



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Master Geek
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  Reply # 690748 24-Sep-2012 17:26 Send private message

ubergeeknz: If enough customers complain loudly enough I'm sure they'll get on to it.


Yeah, right!  Obviously not an affected customer!

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  Reply # 690758 24-Sep-2012 17:49 Send private message

I think ISPs need to stop offering free email accounts. People are best to use services like Gmail or use a paid service with their own domain (which is the only long term solution). I doubt ISPs make much if any money from providing email anyway, especially as it probably requires quite high support costs. Device provides also now provide free email accounts, like apples icloud /mobileme etc so there are plenty of good options out there.

Have plan, send $NZD50m
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  Reply # 690775 24-Sep-2012 18:30 Send private message

lawiephillips: Thank you for responding to my query - I did not realise it was a blog for experts!! I am far from one... However I will contact Telecom yet again, I don't want to get my own domain and I am annoyed that Telecom should let this happen, I guess this is what happens when one uses a monopoly...  I will put something on my facebook and twitter but somehow think Telecom will continue to ignore the problem.


With all due respect...

Your own domain name would cost you $3 a month.

I am guessing you were also very annoyed when Air New Zealand stopped serving lunch on every flight and you had to either eat first or take a snack of your own.

Telecom is not a monopoly in this space and never has been.  Yes, because of its size it has been able to gain traction in ways other providers have not, but this still does not make it a monopoly.  Telecom has not been a monopoly for over 20 years.

20 years ago when I first got internet access, data cost ~$4.50 per mb.

If we do the sums, today I have a ~100,000mb data plan.  That's $450,000 of value per month for $115.

Seriously, the product offering has changed, the product value has changed and you need to just get with the program.

Telecom will not be so direct to tell you they don't care about your twitter and facebook page, but rest assured on this issue they simply don't care.

D




Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a .kiwi.nz domain name!!!

Check out mine - i.am.a.can.do.kiwi.nz - [email protected]


18 posts

Geek


  Reply # 690876 24-Sep-2012 23:02 Send private message

This seems to be just a race to the very bottom, so far as Telecom's credibility is concerned.

Telecom might not care about email. I certainly don't care about Telecom customers when the emails they send go nowhere. They deserve it for being stupid enough to still be with Telecom.

But I care when Telecom is screwing the whole email phenonemon locally, just by being in it - when they shouldn't be as they don't have any credibility. Get out Telecom. Soon. (So yes, I care when the email was for me, doesn't get to me, and the stupid Telecom customer who sent it doesn't even realise what's happened and that their provider is utterly incompetent, unreliable and out of depth trying to do email).

Telecom cannot remain in email if they are going to be idiots about it. Cannot have players in the email space who don't care if some emails go nowhere, because then the email phenonemon ceases to work any more. It's great for NZ productivity! Not. What does it say about Telecom's standards as a company anyway?

I know I'm complaining a lot instead of just getting alternative email for myself. But how bad is it, when I'm with TelstraClear and I have to a) Abandon my TelstraClear email service and b) go thru all the inconvenience of changing email service and address ... just because Telecom is behaving like fumbling idiots in the email space? (sorry TelstaClear, was nice knowing you).

As an aside ... TelstraClear, are you doing anything so far as pushing this out into the media? Or TelstaClear, give Telecom some of their own medicine and refuse to deliver emails to xtra (by accident of course) - that'll get things stirred up pretty quick. TelstaClear customers won't mind - Telecom customers don't deserve to receive their emails so long as they are silly enough to stay with Telecom.

Come on NZ News Media. I don't get why there is no heat on Telecom (asides from a Stuff article - thanks Stuff). Their outgoing email has been unreliable for 3 weeks, they are still "working closely ... blah blah". News Media needs to inform Telecom customers that Telecom is incompetent, because they (custoemrs) are too stupid to work it out for themselves. Surely email being unreliable is a story as well, I know that a complete email outage for 10 hours is a more sensational story, but email's got to be reliable too doesn't it? Apparently Telecoms Chris Quin thinks so ... quote "I get that email is critical to our customers' daily lives and it has got to work." lol. Our expected standards are getting so low. Apathy.

(Apologies to Telecom Customers for what I said about you :-)

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  Reply # 690888 25-Sep-2012 00:31 Send private message

As far as Telecom's "credibility" I don't think a few emails bouncing is going to make any difference whatsoever... most people are blissfully unaware of the problems that you are experiencing, and most of us here accept that it probably is a very complex issue and/or not as widespread as one might be lead to believe.

As much as it must be very frustrating as a customer, you do have options, use a different mail service for one, ring in and complain (with concrete examples, preferably), take your business elsewhere, etc.

Carrying on here with talkback-radio style rants and and attacking people who have nothing to do with it at all is not really going to help solve the problem.

That's my 2c worth, anyway :)

18 posts

Geek


  Reply # 690909 25-Sep-2012 07:35 Send private message

ubergeeknz: As far as Telecom's "credibility" I don't think a few emails bouncing is going to make any difference whatsoever... most people are blissfully unaware of the problems that you are experiencing, and most of us here accept that it probably is a very complex issue and/or not as widespread as one might be lead to believe.



You really beleive that of the hundreds of thousands of emails going xtra ---> clear.net & paradise.net, that we can safely assume that it is only a little handful that have failed? What are the chances of that? If there's a gremlin in the system, it's a gremlin isn't it? I wouldn't even call it bouncing. It's more like a dull thud as the emails hit Telecom systems. The emails wake up a few days later and find their way back to the sender as a failed delivery. I suspect many people are probably blissfully unaware of their emails that haven't been delivered (yes it's true, I've spoken with senders who say "did you get my email", or they just have no idea), or people are blissfully unaware of the emails that they should have received, but didn't.

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  Reply # 690948 25-Sep-2012 09:21 Send private message

ABeerForMe:You really beleive that of the hundreds of thousands of emails going xtra ---> clear.net & paradise.net, that we can safely assume that it is only a little handful that have failed? What are the chances of that? If there's a gremlin in the system, it's a gremlin isn't it? I wouldn't even call it bouncing. It's more like a dull thud as the emails hit Telecom systems. The emails wake up a few days later and find their way back to the sender as a failed delivery. I suspect many people are probably blissfully unaware of their emails that haven't been delivered (yes it's true, I've spoken with senders who say "did you get my email", or they just have no idea), or people are blissfully unaware of the emails that they should have received, but didn't.


Until enough examples are provided and analysed, these comments are based on hearsay and guesswork, in my experience as a support engineer, these are not reliable things and tend to blow problems out of all proportion to reality.  Not saying for sure that it is not widespread, but there is so far no evidence for or against.  

What will help is that when customers get these bounces, they report them to Telecom ASAP, with all the details ready (don't delete the emails then contact them a week later with vague recollections). If they start seeing a pattern then it might help them nail down the problem.

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Geek


  Reply # 690954 25-Sep-2012 09:42 Send private message


What will help is that when customers get these bounces, they report them to Telecom ASAP,



When we stop to think about, isn't this getting abit ridiculous? They are boucing back into Telecom inboxes, and Telecom cannot investigate the extent themselves? How about a search for "452"? Problem may be a dysfunctional relationship between Telecom and Yahoo7, as suggested by someone else (I think in a comment on Stuff article).

I suspect Telecom knows there's something more than minor going on, since this is the 4th day that it's been up on their site as an issue.

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  Reply # 690959 25-Sep-2012 09:44 Send private message

ABeerForMe:
I suspect Telecom knows there's something more than minor going on, since this is the 4th day that it's been up on their site as an issue.


If it's at that point, then it's probably going to get solved eventually.  4 days is actually not very long in terms of investigating an issue like this one on large, complex, and very busy production systems.

4 posts

Wannabe Geek


  Reply # 690971 25-Sep-2012 10:03 Send private message

my problem has been going on for 2 weeks... I am no an expert but because it is only happening to Clear it seemed to be their problem not xtra... but it appears I am wrong




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Master Geek
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  Reply # 690975 25-Sep-2012 10:18 Send private message

ubergeeknz: ....4 days is actually not very long in terms of investigating an issue like this one on large, complex, and very busy production systems.


No, 4 days is not very long.  We lost access to TCL domains on 28 August.  Thinking it would go away we waited until 5 September before raising it with the help desk. We have probably called them 10 times since then - now on our third case number.  But if you want to make excuses you could also say 30 days is not very long  etc, etc...

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