Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.

View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5
653 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 20

Trusted

  Reply # 973092 23-Jan-2014 19:20 One person supports this post

DarthKermit: Hey what about that stupid person in the USA who spilled hot McDonalds coffee on her lap and won millions when she sued them for not having a warning stating that it was HOT? On second thought, maybe she wasn't stupid. Got millions for her silly act.


It gave her third degree burns over 6% of her body and lesser burns over another 16% and required 8 days of hospitalisation and another two years of ongoing treatment; at the time McDonald's were requiring their franchisees to serve coffee at 82-88C; even lowering the temperature to 71C would increase the time to cause a third degree burn from 2-7 seconds to well over 20 seconds.  

She even attempted to settle for $20,000 at one stage, but McDonald's refused.

Applying the principles of comparative negligence, the jury found that McDonald's was 80% responsible for the incident and Liebeck was 20% at fault. Though there was a warning on the coffee cup, the jury decided that the warning was neither large enough nor sufficient. They awarded Liebeck US$200,000 in compensatory damages, which was then reduced by 20% to $160,000. In addition, they awarded her $2.7 million in punitive damages. The jurors apparently arrived at this figure from Morgan's suggestion to penalize McDonald's for one or two days' worth of coffee revenues, which were about $1.35 million per day.[2] The judge reduced punitive damages to $480,000, three times the compensatory amount, for a total of $640,000. The decision was appealed by both McDonald's and Liebeck in December 1994, but the parties settled out of court for an undisclosed amount less than $600,000.


It wasn't a silly act, nor was it a frivolous lawsuit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liebeck_v._McDonald's_Restaurants
http://www.stellaawards.com/stella.html

2194 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 372

Subscriber

  Reply # 973095 23-Jan-2014 19:25 Send private message

so how would this person get on at home if she had made the coffee, its stupid and shows how dumbed down we all have come. Just reading your quotes makes me so frustrated that we should need a warning to say coffee is hot, for goodness sake give me a break and people actually stand up for it .




Galaxy S4 I9505
Samsung (custom)  KITKAT 4.4.2 (no Knox bootloader)





653 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 20

Trusted

  Reply # 973097 23-Jan-2014 19:29

jeffnz: so how would this person get on at home if she had made the coffee, its stupid and shows how dumbed down we all have come. Just reading your quotes makes me so frustrated that we should need a warning to say coffee is hot, for goodness sake give me a break and people actually stand up for it .


...I think you've missed the point.  She sued because McDonald's refused to contribute to her medical bills, which is not unreasonable.  The courts even accepted that she was partly liable and reduced the settlement proportionally.

In any case, it's hardly the outrageous frivolous litigation that people so love to make it out to be.

2194 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 372

Subscriber

  Reply # 973111 23-Jan-2014 19:35 Send private message

KevinL:
jeffnz: so how would this person get on at home if she had made the coffee, its stupid and shows how dumbed down we all have come. Just reading your quotes makes me so frustrated that we should need a warning to say coffee is hot, for goodness sake give me a break and people actually stand up for it .


...I think you've missed the point.  She sued because McDonald's refused to contribute to her medical bills, which is not unreasonable.  The courts even accepted that she was partly liable and reduced the settlement proportionally.

In any case, it's hardly the outrageous frivolous litigation that people so love to make it out to be.


I haven't missed the point at all, she spilt coffee over herself not Macdonalds that is was hot would be expected unless you had ordered it cold. It had a warning on it but was deemed not big enough, really so when does common sense prevail or are we so entrenched in abdicating responsibility we can't think for ourselves.

I'm not arguing the legal issue just the fact it gets to that stage. 




Galaxy S4 I9505
Samsung (custom)  KITKAT 4.4.2 (no Knox bootloader)





2391 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 292
Inactive user


  Reply # 973112 23-Jan-2014 19:35 Send private message

freitasm:
Klipspringer: If there was ever a need for a "-1" button this is it. If I had to see something like this on geekzone I would be out of here, ha and some of you would probably appreciate that. ;-)


No, no, no. Just because the site name is "Geekzone" doesn't mean EVERY SINGLE VISITOR to the site is a geek, or have high knowledge of electronics, computing, etc.

Our demographics vary quite wildly and the number of visitors we have landing here from search engines is huge. These people AREN'T GEEKS and we should make sure everyone get the information they seek but also give sound advice.



I agree. But then why should it stop at electrical DIY work.

There are plenty of dangerous things I can think of that have been discussed in the past that would then probably warrant the same rules. Home brewing, hot water dispensers, hydrogen reactors, car brake pads, lawnmowers etc ... etc...

I say leave things like they are.. 

Maybe the OP can supply us with an example as to why he had this idea? I have yet to see bad advice on geekzone.





653 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 20

Trusted

  Reply # 973114 23-Jan-2014 19:40

jeffnz:I haven't missed the point at all, she spilt coffee over herself not Macdonalds that is was hot would be expected unless you had ordered it cold. It had a warning on it but was deemed not big enough, really so when does common sense prevail or are we so entrenched in abdicating responsibility we can't think for ourselves.

I'm not arguing the legal issue just the fact it gets to that stage. 


It got to that stage because McDonald's wouldn't chip in $20k towards her medical expenses :p



2391 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 292
Inactive user


  Reply # 973116 23-Jan-2014 19:41 Send private message

KevinL:
jeffnz:I haven't missed the point at all, she spilt coffee over herself not Macdonalds that is was hot would be expected unless you had ordered it cold. It had a warning on it but was deemed not big enough, really so when does common sense prevail or are we so entrenched in abdicating responsibility we can't think for ourselves.

I'm not arguing the legal issue just the fact it gets to that stage. 


It got to that stage because McDonald's wouldn't chip in $20k towards her medical expenses :p




Why should they?

I'm with McDonalds on that one.

653 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 20

Trusted

  Reply # 973117 23-Jan-2014 19:46

Shrug, let's agree to disagree and be thankful that we have ACC in New Zealand.

6126 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 213


  Reply # 973160 23-Jan-2014 20:42 Send private message

Klipspringer:
freitasm:
Klipspringer: If there was ever a need for a "-1" button this is it. If I had to see something like this on geekzone I would be out of here, ha and some of you would probably appreciate that. ;-)


No, no, no. Just because the site name is "Geekzone" doesn't mean EVERY SINGLE VISITOR to the site is a geek, or have high knowledge of electronics, computing, etc.

Our demographics vary quite wildly and the number of visitors we have landing here from search engines is huge. These people AREN'T GEEKS and we should make sure everyone get the information they seek but also give sound advice.

r

I agree. But then why should it stop at electrical DIY work.

There are plenty of dangerous things I can think of that have been discussed in the past that would then probably warrant the same rules. Home brewing, hot water dispensers, hydrogen reactors, car brake pads, lawnmowers etc ... etc...

I say leave things like they are.. 

Maybe the OP can supply us with an example as to why he had this idea? I have yet to see bad advice on geekzone.






I would be interested in what the motivation for the original post was too.

1351 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 164


  Reply # 973161 23-Jan-2014 20:46 One person supports this post Send private message

ubergeeknz: I was thinking more in terms of forum rules, ie before someone gets hurt due to taking advice on these forums - although the advice is generally "Get an Electrician" I can see the potential for someone to get hurt... but maybe it's overkill. Just wondering what others' thoughts were.


i don't see it is needed for similar reasons that I would not jump off a bridge if someone told me to. 


gzt

3774 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 111

Subscriber

  Reply # 973203 23-Jan-2014 21:25 Send private message

As far as discussion goes, community moderation works well in this area.

Users arriving from search are a bit different. Warnings in thread would not really work unless every second post was a warning.

One solution, establish a separate '240v electrical' forum and give a landing page warning for search arrivals before allowing navigation to the post. I'm not really advocating that but it is one solution that makes sense for all cases.

62 posts

Master Geek
+1 received by user: 4


  Reply # 973400 24-Jan-2014 10:44 One person supports this post Send private message

Klipspringer: If there was ever a need for a "-1" button this is it. If I had to see something like this on geekzone I would be out of here, ha and some of you would probably appreciate that. ;-)




A bit off topic, but this sign has a specific meaning.  It means the flushing water comes from a non-potable source, maybe untreated rain water or re-cycled waste water.  Some "green" buildings do this to save water.  Piping non-potable water around a public building presents a real health risk so most building codes (including NZ) require a sign like this at any outlet where dangerous water can be got at.  Filling a glass from a urinal flusher may be stupid, but in this case doubly so.


343 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 38

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 973404 24-Jan-2014 10:46 Send private message

gzt: As far as discussion goes, community moderation works well in this area.

Users arriving from search are a bit different. Warnings in thread would not really work unless every second post was a warning.

One solution, establish a separate '240v electrical' forum and give a landing page warning for search arrivals before allowing navigation to the post. I'm not really advocating that but it is one solution that makes sense for all cases.


It's watered down because you can get killed by 12v - I work for a company that makes electric fences, we have to build protection in to our products for this reason.

I'm all for peter reader looking for keywords such as "mains power" and adding a quick autoreply with links to some government site that lists what you can and cannot do or maybe there is a way to 'certify' people in the site as subject matter experts, without them being bombarded for free advice? Linked in has an endorsement facility for particular areas of knowledge, I think this would also remove a lot of the garbage replies?

2391 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 292
Inactive user


  Reply # 973424 24-Jan-2014 10:58 Send private message

gundar:
Linked in has an endorsement facility for particular areas of knowledge, I think this would also remove a lot of the garbage replies?


I'm still waiting to see an example from the OP as to what prompted this discussion.

Maybe you can supply some links of some existing "garbage replies". I don't believe the problem exists on geekzone so there is no need to try and fix something thats not broken.

2391 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 292
Inactive user


  Reply # 973428 24-Jan-2014 11:03 Send private message




1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic








Twitter »
Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new jobs are posted to our jobs board:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:




News »

Trending now »
Hot discussions in our forums right now:

Telecom introduces unlimited broadband data plan
Created by freitasm, last reply by kawaii on 25-Apr-2014 04:42 (100 replies)
Pages... 5 6 7


Stonedine
Created by Lizard1977, last reply by mattwnz on 24-Apr-2014 15:45 (67 replies)
Pages... 3 4 5


Auckland Transport Hop card - look out for errors
Created by robjg63, last reply by sbiddle on 24-Apr-2014 20:48 (21 replies)
Pages... 2


Windows 8 System Mechanics
Created by eme, last reply by eme on 24-Apr-2014 21:10 (20 replies)
Pages... 2


Using my Mac to ring family in the UK
Created by Geektastic, last reply by nakedmolerat on 24-Apr-2014 11:28 (19 replies)
Pages... 2


Telecom has started metering their TiVo customers' broadband usage (WITHOUT PRENOTIFICATION)
Created by Peteriv, last reply by mattwnz on 24-Apr-2014 15:11 (74 replies)
Pages... 3 4 5


Forms of government for New Zealand
Created by charsleysa, last reply by gzt on 24-Apr-2014 21:36 (176 replies)
Pages... 10 11 12


Parallel imported product
Created by Wills1, last reply by joker97 on 23-Apr-2014 21:01 (53 replies)
Pages... 2 3 4



Geekzone Live »
Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.

Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.