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Topic # 87395 28-Jul-2011 00:24 Send private message

Hi There!

I am considering upgrading from my ADSL2+ Connection to a Naked VDSL connection. Estimated attainable rates are between 40-50Mbps and upload of 5-8Mbps.

I have some questions please:

1) With that much bandwidth is it worth me setting up QOS?

2) Is there a nice SIMPLE bandwidth calculator that will allow me to work out how much traffic each hour of calling will cost in terms of bandwidth?

3) We have 5 extensions in our house, all on 1 line/circuit. I would ideally like to seamlessly connect them to the VOIP system, I presume I need to find the point they all connect outside onto the street, and instead interface that to a VOIP device (ATA?). We want the whole system to work as closely on VOIP as it does now. Each phone can be picked up and dialed from (All cordless dect 5.8ghz).

4) Is faxing going to be massively a problem? My wife is a doctor she still sends/receives faxes semi regularly for legal reasons. We have an Epson MFC now.

5) 2talk seem to be the cost cost effective and biggest provider, any caveats or alternative recommendations worth considering?

6) I have heard that g.729 and g.711 are the codecs to try and go for. Is this correct? We don't want to compromise much if at all on call quality. I understand that perhaps WXC are the only provider with the superior 711 system? This uses 64k and the 729 is 8K? MOS according to the sites I looked at rated (from 5) g.711 as 4.1 and g.729 as 3.92 which doesn't seem far apart, though one uses 8x the bandwidth of the other.

7) Does anyone here have a regular household and know roughly how much bandwidth they use just for VOIP?

Thanks for the assistance.

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  Reply # 498767 28-Jul-2011 01:26 Send private message

for bandwidth you're either going to use g.711 (uncompressed 64kbit/s) or g.729 (compressed 8kbit/s) i expect. add a bit extra - say 20kbit/s for the ip overheads and you have something like this:

g.711 = (64kbit/s + 20kbit/s) * 3600 sec / 1024 /8 = 36.9 MB/hour
g.720 = (8kbit/s + 20kbit/s) * 3600 sec / 1024 /8 = 12.3 MB/hour

double that for the bandwidth used in both directions and you get around 70MB/hour and 25MB/hour.

fax will suck over VoIP. you can use a online fax service to receive faxes to your email, and probably also use one for sending them along with the use of the scan portion of your MFC

callplus do both g.711 and g.729 - so i assume that italk do too. g.711 is uncompressed and requires no license so its usually the primary supported codec for VoIP systems. i'd be surprised if it wasnt supported by everyone.

another alternative to regular VoIP is to go with a hosted Microsoft Lync service which can give you access to your 'phone' from anywhere. There is extra cost associated with that though - as well as additional benfits.




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  Reply # 498772 28-Jul-2011 06:16 Send private message

Faxing works well over VFX using T.38, Brother MFC's tend to have have issues with T.38 issues through.

I know from a number of posts on here in the past many 2talk users can't get faxing working properly, but since they don't offer any autoiprovisioning to correctly configure devices it's hard to know if that's a case of people configuring their ATA's incorrectly.



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  Reply # 499316 29-Jul-2011 11:16 Send private message

Is it possible to attach an entire network of analogue devices to voip in a single connection, similar to what I described about connecting the source to the voip system or am I misunderstanding? The thought of needing to connect each device via ata seems expensive and a real hassle.

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  Reply # 499326 29-Jul-2011 11:20 Send private message

You can attach multiple analogue phones to a single ATA. The main issue most people face is getting the ATA wired into the house phone wiring. However, if you are keen DIY'er it is pretty straightforward




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  Reply # 499334 29-Jul-2011 11:24 Send private message

networkn: Is it possible to attach an entire network of analogue devices to voip in a single connection, similar to what I described about connecting the source to the voip system or am I misunderstanding? The thought of needing to connect each device via ata seems expensive and a real hassle.

You need to climb under your house (or get up in the roof) and sleuth out where the phone cables go.  Having found the first BT socket in the chain i.e. where the Telecom line enters your house, you need to pick apart the wiring at that point so as you have 2 independent circuits:

-  One BT socket for your router going directly to the incoming line ONLY (no filter required)

-  One BT socket which connects to ALL the other phone jackpoints in the house (this is where you connect your ATA)

I have done this in two different houses now, and it means that your existing phone jackpoints can continue working normally, whether with wired or cordless phones, faxes etc.  Sky Decoder probably won't work, but that is another story.

Once you plug your router in directly without any filter, you may also see an increase in sync speed.





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  Reply # 499340 29-Jul-2011 11:31 Send private message

You also need to factor in the REN figures for your devices. Most ATA's have a REN of around 3 and most phones have a REN value of around 0.5 - 1 so if you're hooking up a number of phones your best bet is to look at the REN figure on the Telepermit sticker or look it up on the Telepermit site by entering the Telepermit number.



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  Reply # 499367 29-Jul-2011 11:57 Send private message

grant_K: I have a properly split master jackpoint in my office, where the adsl connects to (so I wouldn't need stupid filters hanging out of every point) and then another jackpoint for a phone (BT) beside it. We have Telecom Jacks in about 4 other rooms in the house including our bedroom, my wife's office and the kitchen.



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  Reply # 499381 29-Jul-2011 12:38 Send private message

This is all starting to sound a lot less seamless than I had thought it might be. I think I need to do more investigation and get more information before changing over, as I need our existing equipment to work with the new VOIP solution, and I don't think until I understand it more, and understand what is fully required, it will be that good.

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  Reply # 499423 29-Jul-2011 13:56 Send private message

networkn:
4) Is faxing going to be massively a problem? My wife is a doctor she still sends/receives faxes semi regularly for legal reasons. We have an Epson MFC now.

5) 2talk seem to be the cost cost effective and biggest provider, any caveats or alternative recommendations worth considering?



2Talk provide a fax server.

If you're able to scan documents and use the fax server without hassle then it's worth doing.

If you want a no hassle solution where you put the document on the machine, dial 7 numbers and press "start" then stick with a POTS line from Telecom.

$40 a month.  Say you send 2 faxes a month, that's $20 per fax.  If your time is worth $200 an hour then it's a no brainer isn't it.  Stick with your phone line.

If on the other hand you're sending 1 fax every two months and you're not being able to bill out time...  then it's worth the 15 minutes to scan and send via the fax server.

I run a small printing business and you'd think we'd us faxes all the time for proofs.... wrong - we just tell people we don't do faxing and to use email.

Lawyers and doctors have other issues though, but given what they charge... 






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  Reply # 499425 29-Jul-2011 14:00 Send private message

Does the ATA need to be at the demarc or can I just plug the ATA into any phone jack and it should interface all phones in the house to the VOIP? It should work that way for incomming calls as the number will be ported to 2talk so the only way for calls to come in is via the ATA, the more puzzling thing, is outbound calls. I think I am just missing one critical bit of information I think.



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  Reply # 499426 29-Jul-2011 14:00 Send private message

Incoming faxes shouldn't be an issue though right? Just outgoing?

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  Reply # 499429 29-Jul-2011 14:11 Send private message

VOIP is something you want to take slowly and a step at a time. It took me 6 months of playing before I ported over. A good starting point is to open a 2talk account with a local number. Once you get a phone running ok on that I would consider diverting existing calls from existing phone to the 2talk number. Then once thats working look at porting. There are solutions to every thing you ask about plus alot more. There are so many features its hard to understand them in one go. An extremly valuable feature for me is the ability to use my home phone any where I can get Broadband and considering you can set up mobile BB that means anywhere to me. Plus the ability to have several phone numbers in different areas .. plus plus ..Its so amazing and all the time I discover a feature I havnt tried yet. Its a journey.



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  Reply # 499430 29-Jul-2011 14:15 Send private message

The problem is I need to get it sorted ASAP as I want to order my VDSL Service and I am trying to decide if Naked is the way forward, especially since it's complicated because unleash don't offer phone services.

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  Reply # 499432 29-Jul-2011 14:20 Send private message

networkn: Does the ATA need to be at the demarc or can I just plug the ATA into any phone jack and it should interface all phones in the house to the VOIP? It should work that way for incomming calls as the number will be ported to 2talk so the only way for calls to come in is via the ATA, the more puzzling thing, is outbound calls. I think I am just missing one critical bit of information I think.


You can't just plug the ATA into a phone jack if it's still connected to the Telecom PSTN network. if you want it running throughout your house you have to isolate the internal wiring and also be aware of the REN values for multiple devices.
  

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  Reply # 499433 29-Jul-2011 14:21 Send private message

networkn: Incoming faxes shouldn't be an issue though right? Just outgoing?


If you want to use your existing fax machine it's both.  VOIP (with some exceptions) doesn't play nice with faxes and dial up modems.  Basically the codecs used for VOIP are optimised for voice, not data modems.

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