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Topic # 103475 7-Jun-2012 23:15 Send private message

Hello
I'm in Christchurch and I'm wondering where I can purchase equipment to test raw data speed for ADSL 2+ broadband at a customers Demarcation point.
This can be done but I don't know the name of the equipment or where to purchase.
Thanks
Ford
 

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  Reply # 637576 7-Jun-2012 23:51 Send private message

What do you actually want to test? Unless you don't believe that the ADSL layer is working as it should, then the next most sensible option is using iperf with UDP to see how much IP you can stuff down the pipe before traffic starts getting lost.

However, for 99% of people the most sensible test is a reasonably modern PC plugged into the ADSL router (not wireless) and use a speedtest hosted at the ISP you are using (if possible)

I'd suggest that if the customer is using ADSL2+ (and not a more reliable/less symmetric service with better SLAs) then there's very little to be gained by trying to find specialised test equipment.

Cheers - N



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  Reply # 637768 8-Jun-2012 12:39 Send private message

Hello

I want to test raw data speed as it is known.
The customer’s ISP did a sync test and it came out at 3mbps. He suggested it should be around 5mpbs. Customer is approximately 3.5kms from the exchange.

If the customer wants faster internet it is pointless replacing internal cabling if the broadband to the demark only shows a speed into the property at 3mbps.

With other customers I have gotten ISP’s to replace ports in the local dslam and increase the customers profile so they have more power down their lines. Telecom will do this if there is an issue with their own equipment. But ISP’s like the customer to test all their internal stuff first, which I do because often it is the internal cabling that is at fault.

The ISP’s line test for my customer came out with noise on the line and 57decibels which is too high so this is an issue with the customer’s internal wiring or filters. That is something I can eliminate but I don’t think it will make any difference in speed. Fixing the internal stuff will only make the connection more stable and even. I like to start with a base figure. And that is, what speed is the broadband actually being received into the house. If I have to suggest to the customer that they have issues on their lines and they will need to have some of their equipment fixed, I like to advise on the most likely outcome and speed increases by way of percentage which the customer likes and can understand.

I will start with a speed test at the customers site and compare it to the ISP's and I'll look at the ADSL router log. I always use the speed test sites that the ISP tells me to use and I run all tests according to their instruction. Because there is noise on the line the ISP are going to run a 12hr test and I will ring today and discuss the results with them.

Hope that explains it.
Thanks for the IPerf suggestion.

 

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  Reply # 637780 8-Jun-2012 12:54 Send private message

Sync speed/attenuation is visible in the modem, there isn't any need for any other hardware. Your ISP can also tell you based on a Chorus prequal what the estimated attenuation/sync speed should at the the street.


Without fixing the internal wiring however you're not going to be able to accurately judge what impact it could have, your best bet is to perform a full isolation test and test the modem to see what the attenuation is.




 
 

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  Reply # 637782 8-Jun-2012 12:58 Send private message

Yep - beat me by a minute there Steve :-)

The only thing to add is that if you REALLY want, you could wire up the ADSL router at the demarc to (temporarily) remove the impact of the internal wiring.

Presumably if you have had other customers with issues you are aware of how to log into the ADSL router and get the line stats?

Cheers - N

ps. Ah Steve, your ninja edit also added in what I said :-)

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  Reply # 637810 8-Jun-2012 13:45 Send private message

Yeah you don't need anything specialised for this, just:

- A modem with a good status page
- A netbook for accessing the admin ui
- Network cable for modem to netbook
- Phone cable with wiring exposed at one end for connecting to the line once you disconnect the internal wiring at the ETP/demarc.

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  Reply # 637968 8-Jun-2012 17:56 Send private message

There is the Dynatel series of testers (made by 3M). It's what Chorus use for fault finding. But be prepared to empty out your wallet!
Best to just use a modem for general testing.

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  Reply # 638001 8-Jun-2012 20:09 Send private message

You can pick them up off Trademe.  YMMV and I assume these are Telepermitted :).

But as Neil and Steve has said, the Modem status page is the best place to go to check out your line speed.




I work for Telecom, but as always my views are my own.



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  Reply # 638041 8-Jun-2012 22:15 Send private message

Hello
Thanks for the trademe link and the dynatel suggestion, that's a great place to start.
In the meantime here are the modem results I took from inside the customers house with my laptop plugged into their modem:-

They have a new Telecom Technicolor modem/router

Bandwidth. – Up 99 Down 2.72
Data Transferred – Sent 241,39 Received 3,22
Output power – Up 7,4 Down 19,1
Line attenuation – Up 30,7 Down 57,0
SN Margin – Up 12,8 Down 11,4
FEC errors - Up 0 Down 387
CRC errors – none
HEC errors - none

When I refreshed the screen FEC errors had increased to 422 and CRC errors now show 2 for down and none for up and HEC errors show 12 for down, none for up.

Property is 3.5km from the dslam.Don’t know if the FEC, CRC and HEC errors mean anything.

I ran a few speed tests from the telecom website and speed is 2.20mbps, I see the router actually shows 2.72.

The second tech at telecom says the maximum speed possible could never be more than 3.5mbps. Where  the first tech said it could be possible to get up to 5mbps.

When speed is that low every meg counts.

The customer has 5-6 jackpoints in the whole house. I made sure the modem was plugged into the primary jackpoint.

Wow, thanks for the suggestion of wiring in a modem directly to the demark. Snap Internet mentioned once that it could be done but they didn’t know how.

So are you saying if I remove the BT end of the phone cable, expose the wires (I think there are two pair??) and attach them to the connections in the demark box some how, and I have the other end of the phone cable plugged into the modem like normal I can then run a speed test?

The 2nd tech I spoke to at telecom didn't seem to think the 57 line attenuation was an issue, he said that figure depends on the distance from the exchange which is 3.5km.

Any more thoughts?
Thanks

 

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  Reply # 638053 8-Jun-2012 22:25 Send private message

Ford: [snip]
The customer has 5-6 jackpoints in the whole house. I made sure the modem was plugged into the primary jackpoint.
[snip]


Alarm bells going off here...

Is there a full splitter installed at the master jack, or is there an ADSL filter on EVERY OTHER CONNECTED LINE in the house? If not, then you will have issues. Just plugging the ADSL router into the master jack may not be enough.

Try unplugging ALL other phones etc (Sky box, fax) and see what happens. Also, find out if there's a monitored alarm wired into the phone somewhere. That could also affect things.

Cheers - N


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  Reply # 638099 9-Jun-2012 01:23 Send private message

Having multiple jackpoints will cause reflections on the line. There is no way to eliminate these except with a master filter.

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  Reply # 638484 10-Jun-2012 15:18 Send private message

Ford: 

Property is 3.5km from the dslam.Don’t know if the FEC, CRC and HEC errors mean anything.

The 2nd tech I spoke to at telecom didn't seem to think the 57 line attenuation was an issue, he said that figure depends on the distance from the exchange which is 3.5km. 

The customer has 5-6 jackpoints in the whole house. I made sure the modem was plugged into the primary jackpoint.



57dB is more indicative of >4km of line, chances are you can at least get a 1-2Mbit increase in speed by installing a master filter/splitter to take the daisy chained internal wiring out of the equation.

Ford: 

So are you saying if I remove the BT end of the phone cable, expose the wires (I think there are two pair??) and attach them to the connections in the demark box some how, and I have the other end of the phone cable plugged into the modem like normal I can then run a speed test?



Yes, you can basically disconnect the internal wiring from the line and test straight on the line. Only 2 wires (1 pair) is used on the phone cable.

If you're going to go to the effort of doing that may as well install a $30 master filter/splitter at the same time and run cat5e cable from the dsl out of the master filter to which jack they want to be the dedicated dsl only jack.


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  Reply # 638487 10-Jun-2012 15:27 Send private message

This is what you want to achieve





Here's an example from either one of Cyril's installs (I think), if I recall correctly this place didn't have a ETP/demarc hence it being under the house.. but it is a good example of phone line from street in and to dsl jack and to internal phone wiring out.





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  Reply # 638495 10-Jun-2012 15:45 Send private message

Here's a recent install by Coffeebaron at an ETP/demarc

http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?forumid=49&topicid=96226&page_no=7#637901

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  Reply # 638539 10-Jun-2012 17:47 Send private message


Here's an example from either one of Cyril's installs (I think), if I recall correctly this place didn't have a ETP/demarc hence it being under the house.. but it is a good example of phone line from street in and to dsl jack and to internal phone wiring out.

IMAGE



Great example!! Clearly shows how the splitter works for any one wanting to DIY their own splitter. And I love the "mounting bracket" lol.

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  Reply # 638547 10-Jun-2012 18:13 Send private message

chevrolux:

Here's an example from either one of Cyril's installs (I think), if I recall correctly this place didn't have a ETP/demarc hence it being under the house.. but it is a good example of phone line from street in and to dsl jack and to internal phone wiring out.

IMAGE



Great example!! Clearly shows how the splitter works for any one wanting to DIY their own splitter. And I love the "mounting bracket" lol.

+1
And the diagram too, havent before seen something so clear to display the theory behind it

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