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Topic # 21481 28-Apr-2008 13:16 Send private message

I'm not sure why freitasm had to close the last thread on this subject just because one tool decided to take the topic into a dark area.  So let's hope that this one stays open so we can have a constructive discussion on a very interesting topic.

Being a new HTPC convertee, I'm very interested in how to cut down on the complexity of running a complete system without having all the extra boxes etc I currently need to run my home theatre set up.  Integrating my legally purchased Sky subscription into my HTPC set up is a natural step in this direction.

One of the biggest issues with the HTPC in my household is the inability to watch one channel while recording another (I'm running my Sky STB into Vista Media Centre).  The WAF on this alone is dragging the whole system down.  Being able to view two channels from my Sky feed would be most welcome, given that I cannot get Sky and Freeview working within VMC at the same time.  Any help along this line is extremely interesting to me.

The obvious questions are (which perhaps is why the last thread was closed?):

1. Is it legal to decode my paid subscription by any other means other thay Sky's STB?
2. If 1 is ok, then is it legal to view two channels at the same time (a la MySky)?

There are other issues such as does/will VMC support this etc that need to be overcome.

I just want to move away from being tied to one TV feed only via VMC, and I do not want to move to the alternative media centre programs as my partner has just got to grips with the current set up.  She wouldn't take too kindly to changes at this stage...


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  Reply # 126779 28-Apr-2008 13:37 Send private message

There may be some confusion about legality, and terms and conditions.

I'd say legally, its a grey area (but then again, "I am not a lawyer").

Does somebody actually want to read SKYs Ts & Cs? I suspect using the card they own, in anything other than equipment they own, is not allowed.

Could they gain a conviction against you? Not with the current judicial and political climate in this country.
Would they consider cutting you off altogether? Probably, if they thought you were gaining financially at their expense, or helping others too.

Also remember, the more public an idea or a loophole goes, the more likely it is to be stopped/plugged. (Free prepay connection 3G data on both networks is a good example there).




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  Reply # 126780 28-Apr-2008 13:39 Send private message

The whole issue is a very grey one. Sky are certainly very unhappy that boxes other than their own are being used to view their service however this is an issue that Pay TV provides around the world are facing.



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  Reply # 126782 28-Apr-2008 13:43 Send private message

sbiddle: Sky are certainly very unhappy that boxes other than their own are being used to view their service...


Is this fact or speculation?  In other words, do you know for fact that they are unhappy about this?  What other methods of watching Sky are there?  And what is the benefit of using a different box to Sky's own?

And I'll reiterate again that I'm talking about using a paid subscription with a legal card.

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Reply # 126783 28-Apr-2008 13:44 Send private message

But their box is not connected to the network to receive programmes, unlike a TelstraClear cable TV set top box. In TelstraClear's case, connecting a third party box to their network can cause probems - but when you have an one way communication only, this issue is gone.




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  Reply # 126797 28-Apr-2008 14:04 Send private message

Satch:
sbiddle: Sky are certainly very unhappy that boxes other than their own are being used to view their service...


Is this fact or speculation?  In other words, do you know for fact that they are unhappy about this?  What other methods of watching Sky are there?  And what is the benefit of using a different box to Sky's own?

And I'll reiterate again that I'm talking about using a paid subscription with a legal card.



It's a fact.

There is one main reason why people are using their own boxes. I'm not going to discuss it here but if you've played with a Dreambox you'll know what I mean. This one particular feature that the Dreambox has makes it stand out from virtually every other STB on the market and raises a very serious threat to any Pay TV network's business model.



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  Reply # 126801 28-Apr-2008 14:07 Send private message

Hmm, must be dodgy I guess.  Just leave me guessing because I don't want this thread locked too!

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  Reply # 126812 28-Apr-2008 14:40 Send private message

A couple of questions..
The hauppuage wintv-ci - would this work? It says it needs a compatible card, and a compatible CAM. No idea what a CAM is, is there a way of using this?
Failing that, would most smartcard readers work? Seems pretty hard to find a decent selection in NZ.

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  Reply # 126822 28-Apr-2008 15:28 Send private message

Im not trying to tell  freitasm how to mod however the other post was working well then someone made their first post talking of the dark side. why not ban them, delete their most and carry on as normal?




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Reply # 126825 28-Apr-2008 15:48 One person supports this post Send private message

Because then people won't know that we do not accept those kind of talks here on Geekzone.

I am sorry but we can't allow people coming around asking how to break the system - it's just a big problem, even more with changes in copyright laws.




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  Reply # 126828 28-Apr-2008 15:55 Send private message

Fair enough Mauricio but you've been yawning a lot today, you might get an earlier night tonight Wink



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  Reply # 126852 28-Apr-2008 17:42 Send private message

Geekzone's FUG clearly state they don't accept discussions in breach of Terms and Conditions. Reprogramming Sky cards is certainly against their terms and conditions.

In regards to having dual tuners, I can't see any problem with this if you pay for two subscriptions. Using one subscription for two tuners is basically just local cardsharing - aka theft of service. That's a crime. It's also breach of contract, a civil offence which you can be prosecuted by Sky for if they wanted to:


(b) not reverse engineer, break, decode or otherwise interfere with any encryption, security, copy protection or other mechanisms used by us in relation to the Decoder, the Signal or our other products or services;


However, I've just read through Sky's terms and conditions and it doesn't seem to mention anything specifically about not being able to use other equipment to receive the service, so long as you're still paying them their subscription fee. If we stay on topic about this subject and don't sway too much, I can't see any reason why this isn't an acceptable topic to discuss here on GZ Cool And certainly a very interesting one!


So to answer the original question, you're probably safe with #1, but I'd definitely ask Sky for a second decoder/subscription (it's only another $25 a month!) if you're going to do #2.

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  Reply # 126865 28-Apr-2008 18:40 Send private message

How about dumping encoded stuff and then batch decoding it later on? I am only decoding one thing at a time, its just that it was from a different point in time to when it was being done, and hopefully at a much greater data rate then the origional transmission was done at.

Also, what is the data rate between the smartcard and the cam? Is it feasable to use an IP based serial port so that any machine could connect to the smartcard reader on demand vs it being connected to a hardware dedicated machine? That would be time based multiplexing of the card, not sharing it so not a problem with point #2...

   




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  Reply # 126876 28-Apr-2008 19:33 Send private message

Please read my post again on that locked forum, I am refering to reprogramming of the ndscam and NOT the skycard.  I know the guy who originally programmed NDSCAM 0.0.0.5 from another forum and when I told him it was not working properly he offered to reprogram it and sent me a few tests to try out, whats illegal about that??? this has noting at all to do with reprograming a skycard! I pay for a subscription just like everyone else.


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  Reply # 126881 28-Apr-2008 19:56 Send private message

My apologies, I misread that post and brought it to Mauricio's attention due to the direction I thought the thread might've been heading. One thing we really DON'T want is the thread to have turned into a "hi how do i get free sky plz kthx"



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  Reply # 126883 28-Apr-2008 20:21 Send private message

willnz: So to answer the original question, you're probably safe with #1, but I'd definitely ask Sky for a second decoder/subscription (it's only another $25 a month!) if you're going to do #2.


So if you have My Sky with two tuners you pay two subscriptions?  I doubt that is the case...

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