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Topic # 109542 21-Sep-2012 18:46 Send private message

I was with 2Degrees and changed back to Vodafone. On 3rd August, I confirmed that my last payment had been received & my account was cleared. On 15th August, I received an email from them saying my account was overdue. Shortly after, I received another email saying the first was in error and that my account was NOT overdue. I called and it was confirmed that my account was in order, there was nothing to pay.

That was the last thing I heard from 2Degrees. 

Today, I receive a letter from Dun & Bradstreet demanding payment for 2Degrees. I call 2Degrees and am told that they cannot give me any information because they no longer have the account & that I must deal with the debt collectors from now on.  I call the debt collectors and am told that the debt stands unless 2Degrees notifies them that it was an error. 2Degrees says they can't do that as its all now up to the debt collection agency. Nobody can tell me what the amount claimed relates to or what it is made up of. Did 2Degrees generate another monthly bill after I'd left? I have no idea. 

All I know is that I am damned glad I left 2Degrees and hell will freeze over before I recommend them to anyone. 


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  Reply # 689649 21-Sep-2012 20:22 Send private message

Demand from the debt company proof of the debt.




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  Reply # 689664 21-Sep-2012 20:30 Send private message

I'm sure Salty will see this and sort it out. I dropped him an email yesterday about a really minor issue with prepay billing and he was kind enough to send me back quite a detailed response explaining what had caused the issue.

This stuff happens with billing systems all the time. I wouldn't get to stressed about it.

2Degreess service is normally very good. At least they have call centers in New Zealand (which I'm sure played a part in bringing some other providers home ;) ).

I wouldn't worry about trying to sort it out with the debt collector but just wait for Salty to have a look or pass it down to his team.

D




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  Reply # 689688 21-Sep-2012 21:13 Send private message

FYI Don played zero part




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  Reply # 689693 21-Sep-2012 21:21 Send private message

Not the first time (1,2). Usually this can be fixed by contacting 2DegreesCare.




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  Reply # 689702 21-Sep-2012 21:35 Send private message

freitasm: Not the first time (1,2). Usually this can be fixed by contacting 2DegreesCare.


Those links are really interesting. 

Just shows how complex this stuff is to fully automate and get right.






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  Reply # 689752 22-Sep-2012 00:26 Send private message

freitasm: Not the first time (1,2). Usually this can be fixed by contacting 2DegreesCare.


Fixing, for the customer (or former customer) shouldn't be needed. Fixing the system seems to be definitely needed. 



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  Reply # 689754 22-Sep-2012 00:30 Send private message

DonGould: I'm sure Salty will see this and sort it out. I dropped him an email yesterday about a really minor issue with prepay billing and he was kind enough to send me back quite a detailed response explaining what had caused the issue.

This stuff happens with billing systems all the time. I wouldn't get to stressed about it.

2Degreess service is normally very good. At least they have call centers in New Zealand (which I'm sure played a part in bringing some other providers home ;) ).

I wouldn't worry about trying to sort it out with the debt collector but just wait for Salty to have a look or pass it down to his team.

D


I'm sure Salty will fix it etc, but that doesn't change the fact that this is EXTREMELY poor.

This should NEVER happen. Some one at least should try and get in touch with you personally before your handed off to the debt collectors.

This sort of issue would put me off any company completely.

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  Reply # 689783 22-Sep-2012 08:06 Send private message

Elpie:
freitasm: Not the first time (1,2). Usually this can be fixed by contacting 2DegreesCare.


Fixing, for the customer (or former customer) shouldn't be needed. Fixing the system seems to be definitely needed. 



Of course not. The thing is you need this removed from your shoulder ASAP.

2degrees needs to accept there's something wrong with their process because when you have quite a few people with the same problem, there's obviously something they are missing. At some point customers will take this to ComCom and complain about the debt collection tactics.





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  Reply # 689794 22-Sep-2012 10:04 Send private message

Have sent email to 2d care with link to same.

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  Reply # 689799 22-Sep-2012 10:15 Send private message

freitasm:
Elpie:
freitasm: Not the first time (1,2). Usually this can be fixed by contacting 2DegreesCare.


Fixing, for the customer (or former customer) shouldn't be needed. Fixing the system seems to be definitely needed. 



Of course not. The thing is you need this removed from your shoulder ASAP.

2degrees needs to accept there's something wrong with their process because when you have quite a few people with the same problem, there's obviously something they are missing. At some point customers will take this to ComCom and complain about the debt collection tactics.



I believe they are working on it, actually, but billing is outside my area so I do not know what the holdup is. My bit does the rating - i.e. how much should the call cost. I don't look after the bills or collections.




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These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.

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  Reply # 689819 22-Sep-2012 10:51 Send private message

ArcticSilver:  I'm sure Salty will fix it etc, but that doesn't change the fact that this is EXTREMELY poor.

This should NEVER happen. Some one at least should try and get in touch with you personally before your handed off to the debt collectors.

This sort of issue would put me off any company completely.



This comment from Telstra Clear's CEO sums up this issue quite well I  think...

“While the current consumer frustration with data caps and usage charges is understandable, such perspectives are in violent opposition to the physics and economics of network infrastructures. ” http://www.telstraclear.co.nz/company-info/media-release-template.cfm?newsid=442&myear=2012

The link is worth a read, it's quite interesting to understand how current big telcos regard this space.

While this issue is not about data caps, the issue is the same.  It's about the dynamics of getting a price point the customer will pay for balanced with all the back end systems that have to be delivered to bring a product to market and pay the team of people that do it.

What I find really interesting is the value it puts on information from D & B.  If you're paying for credit check information from a credit agency then you want it to have value.  What this is saying to me is that if I was making sales decisions based on D & B information then it could end up costing me valuable customers.

To me it's the guys in sales who should be most concerned about this stuff.  Having got a customer to agree to sign up for a contract, the sales guy is going to lose his sale and customer when he presents them with this credit information.

The OP knowing she has this credit problem currently, won't be going out an even attempting to make any purchases in the market at present. Is this what sales people want?

But what's worse for the sales team is the message it sends to consumers about signing contracts at all. 

Getting customers to make a commitment to spending the next X months of their life to pay for something that they don't really need is part of what sales is all about.

I'm very sure the OP will think twice before making a commitment to anything, consider if she really does actually need our technology offerings and just focus on being content with what she already has or doing something else with her money.

So while she comments she wouldn't recommend 2Degrees to anyone, it's everyone else that's going to be impacted that should really be concerned.







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  Reply # 689846 22-Sep-2012 11:20 Send private message

Elpie: I was with 2Degrees and changed back to Vodafone. On 3rd August, I confirmed that my last payment had been received & my account was cleared. On 15th August, I received an email from them saying my account was overdue. Shortly after, I received another email saying the first was in error and that my account was NOT overdue. I called and it was confirmed that my account was in order, there was nothing to pay.

That was the last thing I heard from 2Degrees. 

Today, I receive a letter from Dun & Bradstreet demanding payment for 2Degrees. I call 2Degrees and am told that they cannot give me any information because they no longer have the account & that I must deal with the debt collectors from now on.  I call the debt collectors and am told that the debt stands unless 2Degrees notifies them that it was an error. 2Degrees says they can't do that as its all now up to the debt collection agency. Nobody can tell me what the amount claimed relates to or what it is made up of. Did 2Degrees generate another monthly bill after I'd left? I have no idea. 

All I know is that I am damned glad I left 2Degrees and hell will freeze over before I recommend them to anyone. 



I'm sorry to hear of your experience with your final bill.  It's possible there was some activity on your account after paying your last bill and the last email hadn't taken this into account.  Paying your bill by direct debit or auto-payment as usual is not open to you once you terminate the account unfortunately.  To pay your last bill you need to go to NZ Post or pay by Internet Banking (search for Two Degrees Mobile) and quote your account number. 

We usually send an email to customers to let them know if there's anything outstanding on their account before involving D & B. 

So I can follow up on this for you please can you PM your 2degrees account number and email address. 

I appreciate this has not been an ideal situation and as Salty says we are looking to improve this process. 

^POB

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  Reply # 689874 22-Sep-2012 13:34 Send private message

2DegreesCare: I'm sorry to hear of your experience with your final bill.  It's possible there was some activity on your account after paying your last bill and the last email hadn't taken this into account.  Paying your bill by direct debit or auto-payment as usual is not open to you once you terminate the account unfortunately.  To pay your last bill you need to go to NZ Post or pay by Internet Banking (search for Two Degrees Mobile) and quote your account number. 

We usually send an email to customers to let them know if there's anything outstanding on their account before involving D & B. 

So I can follow up on this for you please can you PM your 2degrees account number and email address. 

I appreciate this has not been an ideal situation and as Salty says we are looking to improve this process. 

^POB


How is that possible?  According to the OP, they checked with 2degrees that their account was cleared on the 3rd August, and the notification that their account was overdue was on 15th August.  Since bills are typically due 14 days after generation, that would mean the overdue bill would have had to have been generated 1st August at the latest - before they checked with you guys.  If there is in fact activity after their last bill that the CSR didn't know about on 3rd August, I'd say 2degrees has some bigger issues to investigate.

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  Reply # 689894 22-Sep-2012 15:31 Send private message

You'd think youd have numerous automated notifications if there is debt outstanding before its sent to the collectors. Because the moment you have debt collection appearing on your credit history, it destroys your credit rating which can cause major financial troubles.



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  Reply # 689934 22-Sep-2012 17:11 Send private message

Kyanar:
2DegreesCare: I'm sorry to hear of your experience with your final bill.  It's possible there was some activity on your account after paying your last bill and the last email hadn't taken this into account.  Paying your bill by direct debit or auto-payment as usual is not open to you once you terminate the account unfortunately.  To pay your last bill you need to go to NZ Post or pay by Internet Banking (search for Two Degrees Mobile) and quote your account number. 

We usually send an email to customers to let them know if there's anything outstanding on their account before involving D & B. 

So I can follow up on this for you please can you PM your 2degrees account number and email address. 

I appreciate this has not been an ideal situation and as Salty says we are looking to improve this process. 

^POB


How is that possible?  According to the OP, they checked with 2degrees that their account was cleared on the 3rd August, and the notification that their account was overdue was on 15th August.  Since bills are typically due 14 days after generation, that would mean the overdue bill would have had to have been generated 1st August at the latest - before they checked with you guys.  If there is in fact activity after their last bill that the CSR didn't know about on 3rd August, I'd say 2degrees has some bigger issues to investigate.


I called on 3rd August because 2Degrees terms & conditions state that when you close your account with them any outstanding amounts need to be paid immediately. 

I did not receive any invoice for charges that may have come through after that date. However, I received an email on 15th August saying I had a bill that was overdue. 18 minutes later, I got a second email saying:


Please disregard the email reminder you received as this was sent in error. Our apologies for the confusion caused, we note that your invoice is not overdue.


That was the last thing I heard from them until I received a letter from the debt collectors and called 2Degrees. 

While I understand charges can hit an account some time after the billing cycles, the simple fact is that I relied on 2Degrees to give me the correct information so that I could act in accordance with their terms and conditions. 

The reason I wrote, "bad communication" in the subject header is because I am not convinced I was given the correct information when I called - with any of my calls in August. When I asked if I owed anything, did the "no" answer mean, "no, there are no charges" or did it mean, "no, there are charges but they are not yet due for payment"? When I asked if my account was completely clear did the answer mean there was a zero balance (which is what I took it to mean) or were they saying, "its clear because its not overdue but there are charges coming that will need to be paid"? 

I relied on the answers to my queries and don't think its unreasonable to have relied on the email (above) either so having my credit rating hit by poor customer service by 2Degrees is both unfair and unreasonable. Telling me that they can't give me any details of the amount being claimed now because its no longer with them just adds insult to injury. 

I'm going to continue this with 2DegreesCare but I am also taking the issue further. 

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