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715 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 24


  Reply # 691233 25-Sep-2012 16:28 Send private message

BTR: I think now is the time to let this go and let both parties move on.

Well put!

Have plan, send $NZD50m
3498 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 75


  Reply # 691272 25-Sep-2012 18:08 Send private message

BTR: I think now is the time to let this go and let both parties move on.

Well put!


As a 2Degrees dealer, what would your attitude be if this OP had come into your office expressing an interest in say, 10 phones for her business, however during the sign up process the 2Degrees provisioning system rejects your sale because the customer has a bad debt lodged with D & B via Telecom?

I'm guessing the typical response would be "Oh, I'm sorry we can't sort this for you today Ms OP, I need you just to pop into a Telecom store and sort out that bad debt with them so I can then process your sale, yes I understand it's just a failure in the Telecom billing system, but unfortunately it blocks me from setting up an account in the 2Degrees billing system because both companies actually use the same credit agency".

...and yes, I'm not kidding, Telecom also use D & B.

However, what would you then say if you were to call up Ms OP on Monday to be told "Oh, thanks Mr 2DegReseller, but I've signed up my 10 staff with new phones from Telecom.  Yes, sorry to bother you, but Telecom were so embarrised, that as a good will gesture they knocked 50% off our account for 3 months to apologizes and offered me a very sharp price on the exact same iPhone you were going to sell me"

If I was you, at that point I've be ringing the ComCom to have a word about anti-competitive behavior.

What would you then say when the ComCom staff member quietly points you to the post MF made - Reply - and then goes on to suggest that they're currently recommending industry wide regulation, to the Minister, that they do understand may reduce provider profits, and perhaps drive up consumer costs, but will at the same time provide more balanced and fair, across all industry, best practice?

What we're really talking about here is a kind of industry, consumer lock in tool. 

The idea here is that you create a good perception with regular customers that there is a high risk associated with leaving a provider.

In the past it used to be things like "oh you'll loose your number and have to tell everyone your new prefix", that's why we fought for number portability.

Now I'm seeing a new trend to just use credit as a way to lock a customer in because they understand that there is risk in terminating an account.

From a consumer point of view this is not idea, but from an industry point of view it's even worse, because what happens to the small players if Telecom start getting away with this because of a market precedent created by the small players?

Promote New Zealand - Get yourself a domain name!!!

Check out mine - - [email protected]

16846 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1574

Vodafone NZ

  Reply # 691278 25-Sep-2012 18:15 Send private message

Don just drop it

2Degrees are working on making the process better that is all the consumer cares about at the end of the day

715 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 24


  Reply # 691285 25-Sep-2012 18:32 Send private message

johnr: Don just drop it

2Degrees are working on making the process better that is all the consumer cares about at the end of the day

Again, well put.

Don - you're heading off on some wild tangents here, for an issue that hasn't even affected you. While it's admiral that you care so much about the OP's original issue, it's time to move on. I know all about these debt collection issues that 2degrees are having as it has affected our customers too. There was an annoying bug in the system and 2degrees are working to fix it. In this particular case the situation was made worse by somebody in the call centre not giving out the right information. Good on Paul for fronting up for 2degrees and giving us the assurances that they are treating this with the utmost importance - well done 2degrees!

1210 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 197

  Reply # 691453 26-Sep-2012 00:25 Send private message

As the OP who was affected by this, I wish to reiterate that 2DegreesCare explained what had happened and that steps are being taken to prevent it happening to anyone else. 

The system combined with human error let 2Degrees down. They have identified where things went belly-up and are addressing these. My issue has been laid to rest and while I appreciate the indignation on my behalf it's unfair to keep pushing at 2DegreesCare. I'm very happy that my issue is resolved so enough said. 

300 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 144

  Reply # 691565 26-Sep-2012 10:21 Send private message

In general, I happen to agree that this thread has probably run its course. I am however quite alarmed by the fact that despite supposedly wanting to sort things out and so forth, 2Degrees has allowed this sort of ongoing issue with their billing system to carry on for over a year, if previous GZ posts are any guide.

Also there's something here that goes beyond a mere customer service issue, which is the fact that a certain staff member refused to comply with the Privacy Act re: access to personal information held - I haven't seen any direct acknowledgement of that. Non-compliance with the law is a serious training/compliance issue. Do something about it before someone potentially hauls you before the Privacy Commissioner or even the Human Rights Review Tribunal.

DonGould: I am not sure the scenarios you posed in your last post would ever warrant intervention from the ComComm under the Commerce Act. This is coming from someone who has actually worked for/against the ComComm in litigation. 

4823 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 136


  Reply # 691569 26-Sep-2012 10:26 Send private message

This has been done to death and the OP is happy. Those who wish to pursue it with 2deg feel free to do so privately.

Thread locked.

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