Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.



BDFL
49160 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4159

Administrator
Trusted
Geekzone
Subscriber

Topic # 110933 19-Oct-2012 17:31 Send private message

From Tech Liberty NZ, "RIANZ withdraw one of first cases to Copyright Tribunal":


RIANZ claimed a total of $2669.25 in penalties. This was made up as follows:
  • $1075.50 as the cost of the music.
  • $373.75 to repay the cost of the notices and tribunal fee.
  • $1250 as a deterrent.
The cost of the music was calculated as being five tracks (total number of notices) multiplied by the $2.39 cost of each track on the iTunes store. The observant may notice that this works out to $11.95 rather than $1075.50. RIANZ decided, based on some self-serving research, that each track had probably been downloaded 90 times and therefore the cost should be multipled by 90. There is no basis in the Copyright Act or Tribunal regulations for this claim.

When we met the defendant she was very worried about the case and what it would mean for her. It caused her significant distress and preparing a defence interrupted both her studies and her part time job. The thought of a $2669 penalty weighed heavily on her and her plans for the future.

She immediately cancelled the flat's internet account and her and her flatmates were from that point without an internet connection at home. Obviously this was not good for their studies, social lives or personal business (e.g. online banking).

The flatmates refused to acknowledge any responsibility or offer to pay any money towards the penalty. Relationships in the flat broke down and the defendant left the flat soon after.


Read the rest of the article in the link.




View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
 1 | 2
2941 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 154

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 703675 19-Oct-2012 17:45 Send private message

So it's the account holder who are liable? I wonder if it would be best then to setup a holding company to have the internet account under. It doesn't say anything about directors being liable and this way you could just fold the company if any claim is made?







BDFL
49160 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4159

Administrator
Trusted
Geekzone
Subscriber

  Reply # 703678 19-Oct-2012 17:46 Send private message

Zeon: So it's the account holder who are liable?


This has always been the case. 






3680 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 122

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 703679 19-Oct-2012 17:51 Send private message

freitasm: RIANZ decided, based on some self-serving research, that each track had probably been downloaded 90 times and therefore the cost should be multipled by 90.

Since you wouldn't download the same song 90 times, is RIANZ going after her for uploads? The article doesn't make this clear. Furthermore since torrents work by splitting the file into chunks how are they able to track the total number of uploads (since the downloader at the other end will likely not get the entire song from the one user)?

To clarify, if I download a song and bits of it come from three different peers, would that be considered one upload (for one complete copy of the song) or three?

1841 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 165

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 703681 19-Oct-2012 17:57 Send private message

Zeon: So it's the account holder who are liable? I wonder if it would be best then to setup a holding company to have the internet account under. It doesn't say anything about directors being liable and this way you could just fold the company if any claim is made?

This could potentially open you up to fraud charges under the Crimes Act.




Vodafone VDSL:

1332 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 152
Inactive user


  Reply # 703683 19-Oct-2012 18:03 Send private message

Dratsab:
Zeon: So it's the account holder who are liable? I wonder if it would be best then to setup a holding company to have the internet account under. It doesn't say anything about directors being liable and this way you could just fold the company if any claim is made?

This could potentially open you up to fraud charges under the Crimes Act.


But then RIANZ would actually need to prove you were doing something wrong rather than you having to disprove allegations made by them :)

1581 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 136


  Reply # 703693 19-Oct-2012 18:19 Send private message

i would have loved it if this case went to the tribunal because it would have been informative to find out if they agreed with RIANZ about the damages and how they worked them out. i also wonder if someone had a quiet word to RIANZ and told them there would be no way they would get what they were asking for in damages, so they dropped this case and are waiting for a really big case where there's 100's of songs

5082 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 694


  Reply # 703708 19-Oct-2012 18:33 Send private message

vexxxboy: i would have loved it if this case went to the tribunal because it would have been informative to find out if they agreed with RIANZ about the damages and how they worked them out. i also wonder if someone had a quiet word to RIANZ and told them there would be no way they would get what they were asking for in damages, so they dropped this case and are waiting for a really big case where?there's?100's of songs


This.
They will want their first case to be a slam dunk. Risking getting it thrown out might set a precedent they don't want to set.

1332 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 152
Inactive user


  Reply # 703970 20-Oct-2012 11:31 Send private message

Their first case could well be a slam dunk but if the media publish pictures of a crying, helpless, struggling female student being punished for the actions of some dishonest ex-flatmates then I doubt their image will improve at all and any deterrent effect would be diminished.

I imagine they will wait till they catch a king nerd with a massive library of 'infringements' to fully push their case. The problem is, of course, that that type of person will forever be two steps ahead of any detection measures :)

1141 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 69


  Reply # 703992 20-Oct-2012 12:53 Send private message

I imagine they will wait till they catch a king nerd with a massive library of 'infringements' to fully push their case. The problem is, of course, that that type of person will forever be two steps ahead of any detection measures :)

I wouldn't worry about that.  There are plenty of nerd who think they know what they are doing and are downloading music with applications that give them a false sense of security.  I'm sure RIANZ will find their victim.





Sometimes what you don't get it a blessing in disguise!

2941 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 154

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 704116 20-Oct-2012 20:08 Send private message

Dratsab:
Zeon: So it's the account holder who are liable? I wonder if it would be best then to setup a holding company to have the internet account under. It doesn't say anything about directors being liable and this way you could just fold the company if any claim is made?

This could potentially open you up to fraud charges under the Crimes Act.


Under what section?

This is the usual tactic used to mitigate liability and I see no provision stopping people doing it in the new law?





5082 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 694


  Reply # 704163 20-Oct-2012 22:10 Send private message

Zeon: So it's the account holder who are liable? I wonder if it would be best then to setup a holding company to have the internet account under. It doesn't say anything about directors being liable and this way you could just fold the company if any claim is made?


Directors can be held liable for the actions of the company. It's called lifting the veils of incorporation and usually happens when a company has been set up as a sham to avoid liabilities and with no intention of actually being a business, which is basically what you are suggesting.

So I don't think it would work.

7642 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 254

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 704927 23-Oct-2012 10:01 Send private message

RIANZ obviously want a slam dunk easy win for the first case they take all the way.

/cynical



BDFL
49160 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 4159

Administrator
Trusted
Geekzone
Subscriber

  Reply # 718684 17-Nov-2012 11:35 Send private message

And even more interesting: "Parents not liable for their son's illegal music sharing, German court rules"...


A German couple are not liable for the filesharing activities of their 13-year old son because they told him unauthorized downloading and sharing of copyrighted material was illegal, and they were not aware the boy violated this prohibition, the German Federal Court of Justice ruled on Thursday.

The parents met their parental obligations supervising a normally developed 13-year-old child by teaching him that filesharing is unlawful, the Federal Court of Justice ruled. The parents were not obliged to check up on the boy, or monitor his Internet behavior.





1081 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 53


  Reply # 718727 17-Nov-2012 12:15 Send private message

Well that was money well spent huh RIANZ




Asus Crosshair V Formula AMD FX8320, 8GB Corsair Vengence LP, 2X Sapphire Radeon HD7850 2GB 1000/1300, 1x WesternDigital WD2500AAJS 7200rpm 8MB cache SATAII , 1x Samsung spinpoin F1 HD502IJ 1x storage mode, 2x Samsung Spinpoint F1 HD502IJ RAID0 Boot, 1x Pioneer DVR212s 18x DVDRW, SilverStone ST75F-P (750W) Full Modular PSU, OS WIN7 x64 ultimate SP1 (7601), SilverStone RaVeN RV02B-W (with USB3.0 upgrade)

2759 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 410

Trusted
Subscriber

  Reply # 718730 17-Nov-2012 12:20 Send private message

Athlonite: Well that was money well spent huh RIANZ


Well, as others have pointed out, they hoped she would submit meekly. They want their first case before the tribunal to be a slam-dunk - this case would have been a PR nightmare, starkly illustrating the manifest injustice of the law. Even more so if they had won.

So they pulled out before it got to that point. In any case, they had already screwed the poor girl over.




iPad Air + iPhone 5S + 2degrees 4tw!

These comments are my own and do not represent the opinions of 2degrees.

 1 | 2
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic




Twitter »
Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:




News »

Trending now »
Hot discussions in our forums right now:

Hierarchy of a mistake: Gerry Brownlee
Created by joker97, last reply by nathan on 26-Jul-2014 04:30 (68 replies)
Pages... 3 4 5


Dick Smith in Continual Sale Mode
Created by Dynamic, last reply by Dunnersfella on 28-Jul-2014 22:07 (55 replies)
Pages... 2 3 4


Logitech K400r HTPC Cordless Keyboard Half Price
Created by Dynamic, last reply by Blanch on 28-Jul-2014 22:16 (25 replies)
Pages... 2


VF, why you lie to me?
Created by kenkeniff, last reply by quickymart on 28-Jul-2014 21:45 (24 replies)
Pages... 2


2 x PS4s to give away. Geekzone members only.
Created by BigPipeNZ, last reply by steve98 on 28-Jul-2014 21:51 (23 replies)
Pages... 2


Checking UHF aerial is working
Created by OnceBitten, last reply by B1GGLZ on 28-Jul-2014 21:49 (21 replies)
Pages... 2


Bridge Work - Auckland
Created by networkn, last reply by jeffnz on 28-Jul-2014 21:18 (19 replies)
Pages... 2


Is chorus going to deliberately slow adsl internet down
Created by rugrat, last reply by juha on 26-Jul-2014 14:25 (54 replies)
Pages... 2 3 4



Geekzone Live »
Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.

Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.