You catch 'em, we kill 'em

Would you trust these people with your money?

Tonight I set down with a simple goal in mind - to fill out a couple of forms on line to see if my money and I can be seperated in the noble persuit of getting a bank loan to increase my business. Does my current business need a loan? No. But I am hoping to take some of the spare cash we have and put it to good use by purchasing a new (non IT geek type) business.

All good, right up to the point that I visited the online banking sites this great nation of ours boasts. Now - please note - I am not trying to do anything secure online (like internet banking heaven help us all) instead simple things like filling out loan calculators and enquiry forms so the banks can have a crack at seperating me from my hard earned cash.

Now - I believe that if a bank wants to make me feel comfortable about my money being with them and doing business with them then their website should be the portal that helps calm my fears, e-wipe my worried e-brow and convince me these guys really do know what they are doing so maybe I can trust them to do business with. yeah right!!

In no particular order (other than alphbetical).

ANZ - online eligability tests as the first step to getting a loan with them.
    URL =

Filled out page one,
    Yes I have two years trading,
    Amount required - squazillion dollars,  click next.

Page Two -  Your incorporated entity trading results (for the last two years).

There are two columns. Both have drop down boxes at the top (defaulting to 1998 and 1997)
Click drop down boxes to try to fill in numbers for 2008 and 2007 ( year ending March yyyy - ie last two years trading results). Hmm ...1998, 99, 2000, 2001 ... 2003, 2004, 2005. bugger!!! no 2006, 2007 or 2008. Some nob has hard coded the years in and the stupid bugger hasn't updated them. whats more it hasn't been updated to allow entry of the last two years of trading accounts - Whats a boy to do? Lie about the years whose numbers I am filling in? Not likely -I would actually like to get a loan not go to court facing charges of trying to obtain money fraudulently.

Tried to contact ANZ with screen shots, URLs etc to let them know their system is shite!. Can I do that online? not so far - anyone know what their support email address is (not in their contact page), where a help 404 web form reporter is? how to actually do that? I am going to try the 0800 number but not sure the screen shot will fit down the phone line.

What is really scary is that these pages look like they were written some time in 1999 (assuming 1997 and 1998 were the last two years of financial trading at the time this page was published). It was written in ASP code. it has not been updated since. can anybody spell EXPLOIT!!!!!!!!!   ASP code from the 90s was as safe as a 13 year old model on on the catwalks of Milan

Oh by the way - laugh yourself sick at their help pages.

Recommended Browsers and Settings


 Internet Explorer® 6.0 (preferred)

 Internet Explorer® 5.5

 Netscape® 7.0

 Firefox® 1.0


 SafariTM 1.2

HOLY TIMEWARP BATMAN - ANZ - GET INTO THE BLOODY NAUGHTYS for crying out loud. The y2k bug obviously came and left you guys in its tidal back wash - by the looks of your site you are still waiting for it to come. Too late dudes - the rapture has been and you were left behind.

MARAC Finance -

Nothing inherently insecure with those guys online - infact as a security model goes, not being able to use the website at all is a fantastic form of security - oh no - wait - its only buggered in Mozilla Firefox and Safari. let me take back my previous comment regarding being secure. Bugger!bugger!bugger!bugger!bugger!. Looks like I might have to crack open that "most secure operating system ever" IE and use that instead. Posts dont work and roll overs dont work in Mozilla. I cant even use the basiscs to apply on line - Looks like I'll mark Marac off my list.

Kiwi Bank (did i say alphabetical? myaybe greek alphabet - Alpha beta, gamma, delta eeerrr ... marac, theta, kiwibank, epsilon omega .. see told you it was alphabetical).

Try filling in this form -
Try telling them your business has been trading for 0 years. did you know that 0 is not counted as a numerical entry? - If it is a true statement then you will need to commit fraud to go further on this site. By the way - numerical entry or numeric?

In all - three out of three strikes for the banks. They hardly inspire me with confidence that they know what they are doing.  I did try Westpacs site too - complete form failure and issues with Mozilla Firefox (needed IE again).  They haven't returned my email contact in the last three days. Guess I'll take my business else where - glad to see they are (not) so friendly and helpful to small businesses (just like their ad didn't say).

Lastly - here is a test for your banks - the definition of the word security.
This is a true story and is a true conversation.  In fact it is three true conversations with very little variation or altering of facts  from the real happenings.

Walk into a bank with 15k cash - preferably in bills (100s work fine if you like red and it still makes a nice wee pile - doing it in $5 bills is really exciting - but do bring a duffle bag to carry it all in).

Ask to get a credit card with a 5k limit secured against the 15k cash. The cash will be stored in a term deposit, a lien (restraint) put against it as security in case you get out of line with the credit card.  do emphasise you will be loading the credit card up with more cash as well and only need it to pay overseas contractors / suppliers.

Listen to them tell you that they cant give your business a credit card as it has been trading for less than two years (or has less than two years audited accounts ) and they have no security.

Ask them why cash doesn't count as security.

"It doesn't", they tell you - "we cannot guarentee you will be able to payback the credit card." Errrrr!!!! 15k cash - 5k  credit card - and they think I cant prove an ability to pay 5k back.

"So what does count as security? ",
"A wage / salary"
"Well I have one of those!"
Bank - "Really? Good! Now the name of your employer?  - hang on - thats your business isn't it? "


Well we cant prove you have the ability to pay the CC and so cant give you the CC as you cannot provide security.

Impatiently I tap the 15k bundle of cash (specially converted for the day to see if waving cash in front of them would get their attention).

No I'm sorry sir - we need security and it has to be a wage / salary.

What, I ask, if I bring in 70k cash (its amazing how little space a house takes up when you sell it and convert it to currency.)



No - you cant prove you can pay the 5k credit card back. We need security.

And cash - which cannot loose its job or go out of business - doesnt count as security?


Well what if I can prove an income great enough to pay back 5k if my cash somehow failed to be able to do so??

Excellent - whats you income sir?

7.5% of 70K - The going rate of a term deposit on the spare cash I have left over from the sale of my house.

No sir - thats not income.

bollocks!! I reply. It sure as poo smells, is income.

But its not a wage sir. so it doesn't count as income.

Finally I lay my trump card down. Leaning forward I say, "You do know I just won the big one with lotto dont you? I'm never going to work again - just live off the interest on my 1.2 million dollar winnings. That's about 90k a year. Do you think that might count as security?"

No sir - its not a wage so you are unable to provide security so we are going to have to decline your application for a credit card.

Retard!! - click - end of conversation.

Choose differnt bank - try again. Fail again. Choose another bank - try again - fail again.

Yes folks it is true - having pocket loads of cash, no debts, no loans, bugger all outgoings and two businesses less than 2 years old will not let you get a credit card at either the Westpac, BNZ or ASB.

Thus the reason for trolling bank sites as per the post above - trying to find a bank that understands cash is king. Unfortunately it turns out the banks above cant run web sites either so they sure as hades are not going to get my cash. And yes - my post proves it is true (some) banks really do still think it is the ninetys and haven't made it to the new millenium yet.

Lastly - a security note from Shane
Incase anybody thinks i am dumb enough to carry large amounts of cash around again, or have it at my house, in my shop, buried under the cat poo in the back corner of my garden or possibly have stashed it at the bottom of the settling tank in bromley sewerage works - think again. it is now stashed with a non-banking institute where it is not earning interest but is helping make the world a better place. All trying to rob me will do is peeve me off and get you a career as a falsetto singing farmer boy witha couple of achers to show for his encounter.  - you have been warned.

Oh and No!! I didn't win lotto but was interested what the result would be if I actually had. However any winning lotto tickets greatfully accepted.

Other related posts:
Blacklists, black holes and and staying in the black
Independence in a corporate age

Comment by Jama, on 3-Dec-2008 09:45

Yup and ANZ wins the eTard award for 2008. Their web site/internet banking is atrocious. I have two mortgages with ANZ but bank with ASB just because the ASB internet banking is so much better.

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nunz's profile

Shane Hollis
New Zealand

Shane started Virusbusters twelve years ago to provide fixed price IT support for home users.

Daily battles through the world of viruses, spammers and other malware has left an indelible impression on him so he decided to try to give back some of the help he has received over time.

Hopefully crazy ideas, virus removal tips and other help can be found in this new blog. who knows, it might even be worth reading one day.