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floydie
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  #1810652 3-Jul-2017 07:20
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It's in the electrical wiring regulations and standards. Available at the ewrb website. It talks about seperation of ELV and mains cabling.

 
 
 

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Coil
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  #1810653 3-Jul-2017 07:25
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Volt:

 

floydie: It is ILLEGAL to run cat or coax with power cables. It is VERY ILLEGAL to put them through the same stud or plate holes.

 

Can you state a reference for that please.

 

 

 

 

During my apprenticeship as an electrician this was clearly stated that it was not recommended to be done due to interference so you could get a (Purple i think) shielded cat 6 cable that could be run with power, not sure what a dye does in shielding tho..
But no it is not illegal, perfectly legal and not suggest on the product guide. 


Goosey
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  #1810654 3-Jul-2017 07:36
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Coil:

 

Volt:

 

floydie: It is ILLEGAL to run cat or coax with power cables. It is VERY ILLEGAL to put them through the same stud or plate holes.

 

Can you state a reference for that please.

 

 

 

 

During my apprenticeship as an electrician this was clearly stated that it was not recommended to be done due to interference so you could get a (Purple i think) shielded cat 6 cable that could be run with power, not sure what a dye does in shielding tho..
But no it is not illegal, perfectly legal and not suggest on the product guide. 

 

 

 

 

STP has a foil wrap inside underneath the plastic outter material (which can be any colour not just purple). 




Coil
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  #1810657 3-Jul-2017 07:38
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Goosey:

 

Coil:

 

Volt:

 

floydie: It is ILLEGAL to run cat or coax with power cables. It is VERY ILLEGAL to put them through the same stud or plate holes.

 

Can you state a reference for that please.

 

 

 

 

During my apprenticeship as an electrician this was clearly stated that it was not recommended to be done due to interference so you could get a (Purple i think) shielded cat 6 cable that could be run with power, not sure what a dye does in shielding tho..
But no it is not illegal, perfectly legal and not suggest on the product guide. 

 

 

 

 

STP has a foil wrap inside underneath the plastic outter material (which can be any colour not just purple). 

 

 

 

 

That would be it, Been a year since ive used that stuff..

 

 


gregmcc
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  #1810659 3-Jul-2017 07:52
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Coil:

 

Volt:

 

floydie: It is ILLEGAL to run cat or coax with power cables. It is VERY ILLEGAL to put them through the same stud or plate holes.

 

Can you state a reference for that please.

 

 

 

 

During my apprenticeship as an electrician this was clearly stated that it was not recommended to be done due to interference so you could get a (Purple i think) shielded cat 6 cable that could be run with power, not sure what a dye does in shielding tho..
But no it is not illegal, perfectly legal and not suggest on the product guide. 

 

 

 

 

May be good for stopping interference, but as far as the insulation requirements, cat 5/6 does not have 230V rated insulation as required by AS/NZS3000.


Mavarick

193 posts

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  #1810662 3-Jul-2017 08:14
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I have taken the line of drilling down with a stud difference gap, most of the ones i have done so far worked fine

 

As replacing cat5 for cat6  and older coaxial cable for rg6, however i have left the hardest to last , so next hardest  blew out through the gib due what I think was hitting a wall brace, so drilled another one 400mm away and that seems fine apart lost the allen key in the wall insulation somewhere and cant get the extensions out till tonite. plus when I cut the hole for the gang plate,(hopping that smaller hands could reach further to the left to get cables in the end, I found extra wooden bracing, and now will have some thinking about the cable retrieval after i run down from the roof space

 

still have the hardest one to go yet, so fingers crossed


Volt
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  #1810743 3-Jul-2017 10:10
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gregmcc:

Coil:


Volt:


floydie: It is ILLEGAL to run cat or coax with power cables. It is VERY ILLEGAL to put them through the same stud or plate holes.


Can you state a reference for that please.



 


During my apprenticeship as an electrician this was clearly stated that it was not recommended to be done due to interference so you could get a (Purple i think) shielded cat 6 cable that could be run with power, not sure what a dye does in shielding tho..
But no it is not illegal, perfectly legal and not suggest on the product guide. 



 


May be good for stopping interference, but as far as the insulation requirements, cat 5/6 does not have 230V rated insulation as required by AS/NZS3000.


TPS is double insulated, it doesn't matter what it insulation level of the ELV wiring is. LV and ELV can be enclosed within the same wiring system as long as the LV wiring is double insulated and a protected from damage. This being common with industrial Ethernet in MCCs. I don't see how how a cat 5 or rg6 through the same hole in a top plate as a TPS is in anyway illegal. On the other hand it is unprofessional and unwise where the prevention of EMI is concerned. 3.9.8.3



richms
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  #1810751 3-Jul-2017 10:17
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When I asked the tame sparky about it, the concern was only when entering an enclosure with the single insulation inside a TPS cable exposed, so long as it was passing thru where the cable was double insulated, it was all fine. The cbus pink cat5 has a rated jacket so can be exposed to single insulated 230v in the same enclosure fine. This is why you cant enter a flushbox with mains to put an antenna or network socket in place of the additional switches on powerpoints which you often see people do behind TVs etc.

 

Also there is a problem when the wall becomes the enclosure because there is an open backed power socket like on some of the in wall recessed boxes for behind TVs, or if you do things the aussie way and dont use a flush box and just direct attach or use C clamps on everything. IMO doing wiring like that is a bit crap so I have flush boxes on everything possible for mains here.





Richard rich.ms

DarthKermit
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  #1810753 3-Jul-2017 10:23
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Running your extra low voltage cables inside electrical conduit (assuming you have the space to install it) would get around the issue of close proximity to 230 volt wiring, but not any interference issues.


Mattmannz
471 posts

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  #1810820 3-Jul-2017 11:55
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A gap is always best but bear in mind that most office installations have power and data run inside the same sheath out to the desk from the wall plates for over a meter or so and this is standard practice and I havent seen an issue with it.


gregmcc
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  #1812226 3-Jul-2017 20:19
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richms:

 

When I asked the tame sparky about it, the concern was only when entering an enclosure with the single insulation inside a TPS cable exposed, so long as it was passing thru where the cable was double insulated, it was all fine. The cbus pink cat5 has a rated jacket so can be exposed to single insulated 230v in the same enclosure fine. This is why you cant enter a flushbox with mains to put an antenna or network socket in place of the additional switches on powerpoints which you often see people do behind TVs etc.

 

Also there is a problem when the wall becomes the enclosure because there is an open backed power socket like on some of the in wall recessed boxes for behind TVs, or if you do things the aussie way and dont use a flush box and just direct attach or use C clamps on everything. IMO doing wiring like that is a bit crap so I have flush boxes on everything possible for mains here.

 

 

 

 

3.9.8.3 (b) all cables or each conductor of a multi-core cable shall be insulated for the highest voltage present

 

 

 

this means if you put the cat 5 cable thru the same hole as a 230v TPS the the cat 5 cable must be insulated for 230v


floydie
472 posts

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  #1812240 3-Jul-2017 20:37
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Can non sparks please not comment on this. ... it is illegal to run ELV and lv called through the same penetration. It contravene the seperation and insulation requirements. You could possibly get away with it if the ELV cable was suitably mechanically protected such as swa.

Coil
6614 posts

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  #1812310 4-Jul-2017 06:59
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So it proves to be illegal, That goes to show the amount of sparkies that dont follow the "law" or guidelines. Recently i helped with a new build, I saw penetrations through top and bottom places with RG6,Cat6, 230V. Some of the places were tight and it may have been unavoidable. 
In these cases how does one route the cables? Is there something you can buy to separate them? I would suspect mechanical insulation of some form. But even then if your dealing with a tight spot you probably dont have room for conduit.
Yet to see a product designed for that myself or meet another sparkie who actually follows that rule.

 

 


greenbone
176 posts

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  #1812496 4-Jul-2017 12:12
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now i remember a reason i was told it was illegal. you accidently drill a screw through 240V cable, if the ELV is in the same hole and penetrated also it can 240 up your ELV wiring


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