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mdf

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  #2148268 20-Dec-2018 10:57
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Have just been having a nosey at the Dryden Woodoil datasheet. It's not super clear (and doesn't fully accord with the Queen's English), but the product seems to be a penetrating oil rather than something that "dries". This is very much a guess, but if it took 48 hours to dry off/stop being tacky, too much was applied too soon. It had nowhere to penetrate and was sitting on the surface. One part of the datasheet recommends second coating at least 30 (but no more than 90 days) after the first coat. A third coat on top of that might well be the problem. I'd be interested in both what the application instructions on the can say; they don't seem to be available online, as well as what kind of coverage rate you were getting.

 

If that is the case, the "good" news is that it is probably just a surface oil-and-water-mixing issue that won't stain the underlying wood. The current crop of photos certainly look like a different type of stain than the first crop. The bad news is that all that oiling will probably go to waste. More guesses though.

 

I do think you should talk to an expert. If it were me, I'd be aiming for a Dryden expert rather than a decking expert though. You really want some guidance about sanding back/removing it now versus letting it wait for a bit to settle down before remedying.


mdf

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  #2148273 20-Dec-2018 11:00
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I also just re-read your first post. It seems unlikely to come up now rather immediately, but the other potential possibility is the wax end sealer disagreeing with the wood oil. Were there instructions to do it that way?


 
 
 
 




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  #2148275 20-Dec-2018 11:04
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Thanks, great advice. I actually just emailed Dryden directly to see what they say.

 

Maybe you're right and I oiled again too quickly - only reason I did that was because it appeared that water was penetrating and staining the surface, which had to be sanded off (as per my first post). Will be interesting to see what Dryden say.

 

The wax end sealer only went where we made cuts in the garapa - so nowhere near where the vast majority of these stains are. Don't think that will be it unless the wax is somehow penetrating / travelling up the boards. EDIT: the wax sealer is also a Dryden product, and they specifically say not to use it on surfaces you want to oil (which I was very careful not to do)

 

This time around I won't make any brash / rush actions and will try to find some expert advice first. Maybe I inadvertently made it a lot worse for myself by sanding and re-oiling last week... :(


mdf

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  #2148277 20-Dec-2018 11:11
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morbandit:

 

Thanks, great advice. I actually just emailed Dryden directly to see what they say.

 

Maybe you're right and I oiled again too quickly - only reason I did that was because it appeared that water was penetrating and staining the surface, which had to be sanded off (as per my first post). Will be interesting to see what Dryden say.

 

The wax end sealer only went where we made cuts in the garapa - so nowhere near where the vast majority of these stains are. Don't think that will be it unless the wax is somehow penetrating / travelling up the boards. EDIT: the wax sealer is also a Dryden product, and they specifically say not to use it on surfaces you want to oil (which I was very careful not to do)

 

This time around I won't make any brash / rush actions and will try to find some expert advice first. Maybe I inadvertently made it a lot worse for myself by sanding and re-oiling last week... :(

 

 

Good luck! Decks only stay pristine for a short period of time anyway, what with UV, wind, rain, children, furniture, animals, BBQs and the like. I'd imagine that your worst case scenario is just it looking a bit worse than you'd hoped until next summer while it weathers in a bit. I've re-oiled/stained decks after a summer or two and am always amazed at how good they can come up with a good scrub and recoat.




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  #2148281 20-Dec-2018 11:14
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mdf:

 

Good luck! Decks only stay pristine for a short period of time anyway, what with UV, wind, rain, children, furniture, animals, BBQs and the like. I'd imagine that your worst case scenario is just it looking a bit worse than you'd hoped until next summer while it weathers in a bit. I've re-oiled/stained decks after a summer or two and am always amazed at how good they can come up with a good scrub and recoat.

 

 

 

 

Thanks, appreciate that comment. This is my first deck so feeling quite worried I've severely screwed something up!




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  #2148317 20-Dec-2018 12:25
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Mark at Dryden just called me and said he's almost certain it's excess oil "solids" that have dried on the surface. He also said that as the tannins release they can be quite "splotchy".

 

So:

 

     

  1. The first "staining" I saw was likely tannin staining and iron staining (not water staining as I thought)
  2. The second coat was too soon after the first, so the oil could not penetrate beyond the surface.
  3. The excess oil on some of the planks has now dried and left "solids".
  4. He recommends I get a synthetic BBQ scourer sponge thing (nothing with metal in it) and lightly brush the solids to speed up the process of their removal - though they should naturally disappear over time.
  5. Wait until end of Summer then give the deck a light clean with water, and then do another coat of oil.

 

All in all it sounds like my deck is not ruined forever, but this could likely have been avoided by me not making assumptions about the cause of the original staining. Whoops. embarassed

 

As an aside Dryden customer service is awesome. laughing


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  #2148327 20-Dec-2018 12:30
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@morbandit I occasionally do some computer work for a timber supplier, so showed them your pictures and asked their opinion.

 

They think the problems you are facing after the second coat is that Dryden's takes a long time to dry and would have required at least 7 days with no rain after the second coat. They said what happened is the water just separated the oil.

 

They said that they personally wouldn't recommend Dryden's for a Garapa deck (or any deck I from what I understood) and that they would normally recommend a more standard oil-based decking product like Wattyl Forestwood etc which has a faster drying time. Not because Dryden's is a bad product, but they felt Dryden's is better suited to exterior timber cladding (i.e. walls) and for softer woods like cedar which soak it up better and allow water to run off it if it does rain during the drying/curing period. It sounded to me as if Dryden's doesn't really "dry" as such, and needs all that extra time before being exposed to rain to properly penetrate the wood (but I'm not 100% on that).

 

They mentioned that Dryden now has a specific decking product, but they have no experience with it (I'm not sure if that's what you used).

 

They sympathized with how heartbreaking it is to put the time and effort (and money) into a deck and have something like this happen, but the good news is they said it's not as bad as it looks and should be able to be rectified.

 

By the books, they said that it is not recommended to change to a different type of oil and it would normally be recommended that you give it a light sand and then reapply the Dryden's when there will be sufficient drying time (which I understood to be at least a 7 days).

 

Off they books, they said personally they would consider trying a different product, like the aforementioned oil-based Wattyl Forestwood (a light sand would still be required). They cautioned you would need to test this on a small area first (I thought you could recreate the current deck finish on an off-cut and test on that).

 

As usual though, don't just believe what you read on the Internet as I am no expert and am just translating what I was told as best as I remember it. You need to wait and see what Dryden's says, and I would suggest also talking to an independent timber expert yourself about your best course of action.

 

 


 
 
 
 




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  #2148329 20-Dec-2018 12:36
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Thanks for this! Very interesting, and seems to make a lot of sense given the circumstances. This damn wet summer.

 

Seems either way it's going to be a case of leave it for a while, so I'll definitely give this some thought. Dryden's is bloody expensive so my wallet wouldn't mind switching to another product - lol.


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  #2148346 20-Dec-2018 12:56
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morbandit:

 

Thanks for this! Very interesting, and seems to make a lot of sense given the circumstances. This damn wet summer.

 

Seems either way it's going to be a case of leave it for a while, so I'll definitely give this some thought. Dryden's is bloody expensive so my wallet wouldn't mind switching to another product - lol.

 

 

Yeah, the guys I spoke to said you'd have been fine if it had been a normal summer.

 

Another thing to remember if considering switching products is that the end look will probably be quite different, the same with the ongoing maintenance.

 

I think with Dryden's Clear the wood still naturally silvers, and the deck requires fewer maintenance coats moving forward from what I understand. So if the natural silvering of the wood is the look you are after it may still be the best product for you.

 

I have a Kwila deck, and I personally don't like the silver look, so mine pretty much needs a clean and re-oil every year. I use Intergrain Nature's Timber Oil, which works fine for the look I want but is a very different product to Dryden's.




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  #2148348 20-Dec-2018 13:01
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Yeah actually the entire reason I chose Dryden's was because it was the only product I found which was

 

  • a penetrating oil (which I read is strongly recommended for garapa)
  • clear with no tinting
  • suitable for hardwoods

I'm trying to end up with quite a 'natural' sort of look at my place, planting lots of natives, grasses, flax, etc so figured a silver patina would suit. Probably just have to stick it out for a year until it does its thing and live with a splotchy sick looking deck lol

 

crycrycry


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  #2148365 20-Dec-2018 13:28
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I wonder if you can use something like pure mineral oil if you want a completely natural look? I use the food grade stuff on my good cutting boards and it sure penetrates deep into the wood.

 

I'm sure there are probably 100 reason why this would be a bad idea, but I'd be interested if anyone knows.

 

EDIT: @morbandit Good old fashioned linseed oil might meet your requirements.


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