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  Reply # 1871625 23-Sep-2017 17:11
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minimoke:

 

Yes, have one. Waste of money. Return on investment doesn't add up. If you are going to waste your money make sure you get one that doenst need people to be trained - that's even more money wasted.

 

 

What defib doesn't require people to be trained? 

 

Operating the defib itself is dead simple - anybody could use one of these with no training at all. The critical thing is how it's used - ensuring correct CPR is also in progress and that the pads are applied correctly and more importantly in the correct place to ensure the shock flows through the heart. If the pads are placed in the wrong place the defin will be absolutely useless.

 

I would have thought $2000 to save a life was a pretty massive ROI when you consider once you're dead you're dead for good.

 

 

 

 


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  Reply # 1871632 23-Sep-2017 17:32
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minimoke:

 

Jase2985:

 

thats a pretty narrow way of looking at it

 

what about from the families perspective?

 

a AED is what $2k? for a medium sized company this is a drop in a bucket at $500 per year overs its live span.

 

 

You don't think perhaps the money might be better spent on preventing a heart attack in the first place?

 

 

 

 

No.

 

$2k will make no difference at all in preventing heart attacks.


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  Reply # 1871640 23-Sep-2017 18:43
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No, but I really think we should have one, 4K is a bit crazy of a cost though.


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  Reply # 1871668 23-Sep-2017 20:02
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lNomNoml:

 

No, but I really think we should have one, 4K is a bit crazy of a cost though.

 

 

There must be one on Aliexpress?


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  Reply # 1871669 23-Sep-2017 20:02
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We have one,but deployment must have been super secret as I’m one of the 7 trained 1st Aiders on site (250 student school) and its apparently been there since the beginning of the year and I only ‘accidentally ‘ stumbled upon it about 2 weeks ago 🙄

I think signage and regular (quarterly?) reminders should be a basic part of any AED install... especially in a school!

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  Reply # 1871675 23-Sep-2017 20:05
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minimoke:

 

Jase2985:

 

thats a pretty narrow way of looking at it

 

what about from the families perspective?

 

a AED is what $2k? for a medium sized company this is a drop in a bucket at $500 per year overs its live span.

 

 

You don't think perhaps the money might be better spent on preventing a heart attack in the first place?

 

 

 

And now the moral bar has been set how many employers support vaping or other things that prevent or delay death unrelated to work.

 

 

the employer isnt going to spend money on that sort of thing are they. and as mentioned 2k aint going to go far.


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  Reply # 1871688 23-Sep-2017 20:14
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minimoke:


Jase2985:


thats a pretty narrow way of looking at it


what about from the families perspective?


a AED is what $2k? for a medium sized company this is a drop in a bucket at $500 per year overs its live span.



You don't think perhaps the money might be better spent on preventing a heart attack in the first place?


 


And now the moral bar has been set how many employers support vaping or other things that prevent or delay death unrelated to work.



Trouble is, not much can be done to prevent many heart attacks. It is very possible for very fit people to have a fatal heart attack because of their genetics. One of our famous triathlete's partner (also a triathlete) died of a heart attack in his 30s? (or 40s?)


The defibrillator (+CPR) is very good for only one purpose, to reset heart rhythm. When people have a heart attack and collapse, that is usually (not necessary but usually) due to a catastrophic clot type heart attack causing a "malignant" heart rhythm. These catastrophic clot type heart attacks usually happen in younger people with no apparent major risk. (People with apparent risk or older people tend to have the warning signs - called "crescendo angina" - leading to a heart attack without the malignant rhythm accompanying.)


So if one has no prior warning, those are the type that are at risk of needing the AED.


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  Reply # 1872088 24-Sep-2017 16:34
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sbiddle:

 

minimoke:

 

Yes, have one. Waste of money. Return on investment doesn't add up. If you are going to waste your money make sure you get one that doenst need people to be trained - that's even more money wasted.

 

 

What defib doesn't require people to be trained? 

 

Operating the defib itself is dead simple - anybody could use one of these with no training at all. The critical thing is how it's used - ensuring correct CPR is also in progress and that the pads are applied correctly and more importantly in the correct place to ensure the shock flows through the heart. If the pads are placed in the wrong place the defin will be absolutely useless.

 

I would have thought $2000 to save a life was a pretty massive ROI when you consider once you're dead you're dead for good.

 

 

 

 

 

 

That was my point - more money wasted if you are sending people on training courses to use it. You should get one that is one of the dead simple ones to use - with voice / picture instructions.


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  Reply # 1872089 24-Sep-2017 16:35
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Jase2985:

 

minimoke:

 

Jase2985:

 

thats a pretty narrow way of looking at it

 

what about from the families perspective?

 

a AED is what $2k? for a medium sized company this is a drop in a bucket at $500 per year overs its live span.

 

 

You don't think perhaps the money might be better spent on preventing a heart attack in the first place?

 

 

 

And now the moral bar has been set how many employers support vaping or other things that prevent or delay death unrelated to work.

 

 

the employer isnt going to spend money on that sort of thing are they. and as mentioned 2k aint going to go far.

 

 

So we now have set the value of life - around $2,000


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  Reply # 1872110 24-Sep-2017 17:24
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minimoke:

 

sbiddle:

 

minimoke:

 

Yes, have one. Waste of money. Return on investment doesn't add up. If you are going to waste your money make sure you get one that doenst need people to be trained - that's even more money wasted.

 

 

What defib doesn't require people to be trained? 

 

Operating the defib itself is dead simple - anybody could use one of these with no training at all. The critical thing is how it's used - ensuring correct CPR is also in progress and that the pads are applied correctly and more importantly in the correct place to ensure the shock flows through the heart. If the pads are placed in the wrong place the defin will be absolutely useless.

 

I would have thought $2000 to save a life was a pretty massive ROI when you consider once you're dead you're dead for good.

 

 

 

 

 

 

That was my point - more money wasted if you are sending people on training courses to use it. You should get one that is one of the dead simple ones to use - with voice / picture instructions.

 

 

Every defib is dead simple to use and all have voice and pictures. With the number around in public ringing 111 will get you access to a number of public defib's with pinpad entry and staff will talk you through using it.

 

None of this changes the fact that the majority of people in the situation of having somebody in front of them who has suffered a cardiac arrest will be in a state of panic. Those who have had basic training will have the basic knowledge to know how to operate the defib and potentially save a life.

 

I just seriously can't believe there are people in this world who thing having basic medical skills is a wasted cost. I'd really hate to work for a place that has no value on life and has the view that sending people on a training course to save people's life is an effort. Do they share the same view in regards to upskilling of staff with workplace skills and knowledge?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


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  Reply # 1872122 24-Sep-2017 18:16
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minimoke:

 

 

 

So we now have set the value of life - around $2,000

 

 

no thats the price to increase the chances of saving someone's life because i can guarantee there would be few people around whos life is worth that little.


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  Reply # 1872127 24-Sep-2017 18:32
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minimoke:

sbiddle:


minimoke:


Yes, have one. Waste of money. Return on investment doesn't add up. If you are going to waste your money make sure you get one that doenst need people to be trained - that's even more money wasted.



What defib doesn't require people to be trained? 


Operating the defib itself is dead simple - anybody could use one of these with no training at all. The critical thing is how it's used - ensuring correct CPR is also in progress and that the pads are applied correctly and more importantly in the correct place to ensure the shock flows through the heart. If the pads are placed in the wrong place the defin will be absolutely useless.


I would have thought $2000 to save a life was a pretty massive ROI when you consider once you're dead you're dead for good.


 


 



That was my point - more money wasted if you are sending people on training courses to use it. You should get one that is one of the dead simple ones to use - with voice / picture instructions.



You fail to see the point of money.

Money is for its owner to spend. Not to keep.

When the owner of the money is dead, the money finds another master who will spend it.

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  Reply # 1883039 13-Oct-2017 15:14
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Employer has one, but currently we are not in that building due to quake repairs.  Current building apparently has one on a different floor.  Next to a Supermarket which apparently has one.

 

Rescue team I volunteer for has 7 and about to add two more.  Two have been used for real.  Big investment but for the two people who were on the receiving end of the jump starts, well worth it.

 

Agreed that they are very easy to use.  Just follow the instructions.  But can fully understand that if you haven't had the opportunity to see one in action or play with a training one it can be quite intimidating to use.  Like anything, if you are trained to use it and do the accompanying DRSABCD, then it becomes automated actions rather than panic and confusion.





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  Reply # 1883045 13-Oct-2017 15:26
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My company has 2 , the ones from st john





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