Geekzone Rugby (Union) Discussion Thread

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#2299141 14-Aug-2019 12:38

@N Very much so.

@B After the match what I heard was all the win gave them was a ticket to Auckland. That means a ticket to a possible win. A muted and appropriate response. You would need to bag a few top wins over the AB's before you can think about strutting

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TeaLeaf

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#2299373 14-Aug-2019 17:12

Who is the really heavy (fat) aussie commentator who know matter what happens thinks the penalties should go to Aus or the AB's are cheating? He reminds me of of Kerry Okeefe in the Aus cricket, just 120% 1 eyed. Never calls the Aus infringements. Well he got a few serves back from his fellow Aus commentators that last game.

His opinion was immediately the red card was justified (this is before anybody even got a second look at it) and he thinks, along with Kearns that the send off had no impact on the score line at all.

I have to admit I think it would have been a close one if AB's didnt lift at half time, but once down to 14 and behind on the scoreboard I felt that sealed it.

Im very torn on the red card, at first I thought it was just a penalty, then the next angle it looked worse because he didnt have "time" to get his arm from being smothered. I dont think he went into it thinking to not use his arm if you look at the replay.

Regardless it was the best the aussies have played in a long time. I think even posession and 15 vs 15 the score line would be a rather large loss though. Even with 20% or whatever it was for the first 30 the ABs were in the lead.

One thing it was good for is Union in WA. It beat SoO League and the Warriors League game there this year, it beat all AFL games. And I thought it looked 70% AB jerseys and definitely AB chants, but still good for Aus rugby.

I enjoyed the game, the only part I didnt like is the Aus handbag of a hooker, always whinging and crying foul. A bit like Munster for qld in RL. He just cant handle getting beat downs. Everybody has a player they dont like, Ive not liked him since he started. I know hes a good player, but hes such a wet paper towel, instead of just leading by example and getting on with it.

tdgeek

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#2299402 14-Aug-2019 18:39

TeaLeaf:

Who is the really heavy (fat) aussie commentator who know matter what happens thinks the penalties should go to Aus or the AB's are cheating? He reminds me of of Kerry Okeefe in the Aus cricket, just 120% 1 eyed. Never calls the Aus infringements. Well he got a few serves back from his fellow Aus commentators that last game.

His opinion was immediately the red card was justified (this is before anybody even got a second look at it) and he thinks, along with Kearns that the send off had no impact on the score line at all.

I have to admit I think it would have been a close one if AB's didnt lift at half time, but once down to 14 and behind on the scoreboard I felt that sealed it.

Im very torn on the red card, at first I thought it was just a penalty, then the next angle it looked worse because he didnt have "time" to get his arm from being smothered. I dont think he went into it thinking to not use his arm if you look at the replay.

Regardless it was the best the aussies have played in a long time. I think even posession and 15 vs 15 the score line would be a rather large loss though. Even with 20% or whatever it was for the first 30 the ABs were in the lead.

One thing it was good for is Union in WA. It beat SoO League and the Warriors League game there this year, it beat all AFL games. And I thought it looked 70% AB jerseys and definitely AB chants, but still good for Aus rugby.

I enjoyed the game, the only part I didnt like is the Aus handbag of a hooker, always whinging and crying foul. A bit like Munster for qld in RL. He just cant handle getting beat downs. Everybody has a player they dont like, Ive not liked him since he started. I know hes a good player, but hes such a wet paper towel, instead of just leading by example and getting on with it.

I don't know, but what I see is if AB's win they all whine that AB's get favoured. When we lose we dont get favoured so we whine. It tells me that the sport needs to sort a few things out. Tennis has these issues, but the TMO (the camera) resolves these 99% and they play on. While we dont want refs and TMO interjecting every 4 minutes there needs too be a better system. Its not working as when team A loses its a problem. When team B loses its a problem.

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#2299701 15-Aug-2019 11:32

tdgeek:

I don't know, but what I see is if AB's win they all whine that AB's get favoured. When we lose we dont get favoured so we whine. It tells me that the sport needs to sort a few things out. Tennis has these issues, but the TMO (the camera) resolves these 99% and they play on. While we dont want refs and TMO interjecting every 4 minutes there needs too be a better system. Its not working as when team A loses its a problem. When team B loses its a problem.

I don't see much whining after this loss. I see a request for consistency, which seems reasonable. There will always be controversy over Red Cards (or in fact Yellow in most cases) as it has such a major impact of the game. It's rare to see AB's get red cards and the last two weren't contested by them. Fans, maybe a different story, but everyone sees things differently.

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#2299702 15-Aug-2019 11:34

I heard a strange thing on the radio last night I was going to run by people... When do the Team/players get told who is playing on Saturday night? One of the commentators said GB was starting this week, before the team was public, based on "handshakes" seen on Tuesday!

Batman

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#2299717 15-Aug-2019 12:01

Most find out during the media release. Those who may be disappointed about not starting get a phone call the night before.

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#2299766 15-Aug-2019 13:05

Wow some big selection calls this week. Owen Franks Reiko Ioane and Ben Smith not even in the match day 23! (Probably all pretty much haven't been at their

Reece and Bridge are our wings and Jordie Barrett at his preferred 13 position with SBW.

Somewhat risky in my view. JB has hardly been Mr Reliable, especially under pressure of which I expect there to be plenty, Reece has question marks over his defence, though he did OK last test he played and GB I really rate as a player, but to have him and Reece on the field at the same time is losing a fair bit of test level experience.

It's almost certainly going to be wet and cold, so potentially running rugby is probably off the table and they have stacked the forwards, so they are probably preparing based on this.

Whilst I am a little nervous, I applaud Steve Hansen being bold/brave if he feels like the tried and true hasn't been up to scratch. We haven't really suffered too much in the past having newbies on the field, it usually hasn't cost us a match. Where we do tend to suffer most is where we play players out of position. Lots of stuff online about Ben Smith playing fullback, but for my money, his issues aren't positional.

We risk dropping to 6th place with a 15 point loss, and may lose number one on the back of a strong Welsh or English performance, even with a decent win.

Steve Hansen insists his selections are not form based, but rather the choice to give their newbies high pressure game time in prep for the world cup. That does make sense.

GV27

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#2299810 15-Aug-2019 14:29

Dropping Franks is a discipline thing. I suspect Hansen would have dropped Moody too if he had other options. But Franks and Moody are sometimes worth more points to the opposition than they are to us and I think Hansen doesn't want to take that risk, given we will be under the spotlight even more so this week.

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#2299812 15-Aug-2019 14:32

GV27:

Dropping Franks is a discipline thing. I suspect Hansen would have dropped Moody too if he had other options. But Franks and Moody are sometimes worth more points to the opposition than they are to us and I think Hansen doesn't want to take that risk, given we will be under the spotlight even more so this week.

I'd be surprised if that comment were true given they have been our two primary props and a good part of our forwards dominance for so long if they were giving away more points than they were giving us.

MileHighKiwi

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#2299858 15-Aug-2019 15:44

The recent performances have convinced me that razor should get the gig, and definitely not Foster. I don't want continuity, I want a fresh start with a new team being developed for the 2023 WC.

A bunch of players won't make it that far due to form, age, overseas contract etc, like Coles, Read, Franks, Moody, A Smith, Perenara, B Smith, SBW and Crotty to name a few.

I'll feel the same way if we win the WC and I think the team can still get up for it. But this is a team in decline and its time for a rethink.

tdgeek

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#2299913 15-Aug-2019 18:20

MileHighKiwi:

The recent performances have convinced me that razor should get the gig, and definitely not Foster. I don't want continuity, I want a fresh start with a new team being developed for the 2023 WC.

A bunch of players won't make it that far due to form, age, overseas contract etc, like Coles, Read, Franks, Moody, A Smith, Perenara, B Smith, SBW and Crotty to name a few.

I'll feel the same way if we win the WC and I think the team can still get up for it. But this is a team in decline and its time for a rethink.

My take is:

Since the last RWC we have not been great. We beat Samoa and Fiji, after Richie, Dan and many others left we became the best AB team in history. Thats an insult. Ive said this before. We remain at No.1, deservedy. But us, were good but not great. The other big teams were average to poor. IMHO we had a "nice" team, but not great. We were protected as the big names arent great. 2 years ago, ENG looked big. No more. IRE looked awesome, no more. Now we find WAL is No.1 1! For a day.

Look, we are not great. ARG is a threat then tire, we beat them by 4. RSA is solid as our resident expert @N says correctly, and we draw with them. AUS is rubbish but they have found something. This exposes us. The last 3 games have been consistent as far as AB;'s are concerned. ARG, RSA, AUS. AUS played awesome. They looked like us, we have skill lets run the ball, score will look after itself, they won. If there was no red card they probably would have won, but closer, or a draw, or we won a close match. We are NOT dominant. We are used to being dominant, but rubbish sides made us look that good but we weren't. We were the best of an average lot, I feel thats now borne out.

Its been mentioned that had we had more possession we would have won. Correct. But we didn't. Why is that? As the others side controlled the game. Why didnt the AB's just take possession and win? The other side prevented that, ups to them.

I always saw the post last RWC as a rebuild. Perhaps other sides had the same issue, retirements, lets go to Japan? But its been a rebuild for most teams.

I favour the changes, young guns, show us what you can do. Experience is great, but you can get get to a point where too much experience means too little enthusiasm, speed is lost. In the sports I watch, age and experience and solid and reliable, often is a barrier. You need youth, speed, keenness with a balance of experience to get a fast but balanced side.

If we were able to have a side of the 35yo legends of the past, we lose. We need youth and speed and x factor, and "some " experience to help the x factor ones coming through.

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#2300056 15-Aug-2019 21:43

Who should be at 15? Think RWC knockout. Think RWC semifinal.

Ben Smith or BB

(I have never seen BS as a great winger, for that position you want someone who is a true winger, not play someone out of position just coz you want both your flyhalfs on the field.)

Handle9

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#2300066 15-Aug-2019 22:12

Batman:
Who should be at 15? Think RWC knockout. Think RWC semifinal.

Ben Smith or BB

(I have never seen BS as a great winger, for that position you want someone who is a true winger, not play someone out of position just coz you want both your flyhalfs on the field.)

Are you serious? Smith is one of the greatest winger/fullbacks ever to play for New Zealand. In 2012-2014 he was the best winger in the world.

He's not playing his best football at the moment but the guy is one of the true All Black greats.

Edit: dates

MileHighKiwi

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#2300067 15-Aug-2019 22:13

Based on form, if it continues I think Barrett gets the fullback spot. He's faster and more dynamic than Smith and he runs great lines. Mounga looks to be the 10.

Does Smith make the bench? my bench (backs) would be Perenara, ALB, J Barrett/B Smith???

SBW and Goodhue centers. Not what I want, I prefer Laumape but I think they'll go with Sonny-Bill.

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#2300070 15-Aug-2019 22:30

Handle9:
Batman:

Who should be at 15? Think RWC knockout. Think RWC semifinal.

Ben Smith or BB

(I have never seen BS as a great winger, for that position you want someone who is a true winger, not play someone out of position just coz you want both your flyhalfs on the field.)

Are you serious? Smith is one of the greatest winger/fullbacks ever to play for New Zealand. In 2012-2014 he was the best winger in the world.

He's not playing his best football at the moment but the guy is one of the true All Black greats.

Edit: dates

Exactly. Ben Smiths Winger credentials are beyond question. Sadly right now as Handle9 has alluded, he isn't having the best time, but it's not a position issue.

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