Geekzone Rugby (Union) Discussion Thread

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Networkn
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#2528084 24-Jul-2020 11:15

Brett Cameron worries me a little. He has been all over the show every time I've seen him play. I was surprised he was invited to the AB's tour relatively recently, but given that, and the fact the Crusaders have kept him in the wings for such a long time, they clearly see something in him.

I know all good things come to an end, but CHCH has been a fortress for them for a long time. If we could beat the Canes in Wellington, then, in theory, it's less likely they would tip them over at home, though they are clearly in better form now.

I have the Crusaders by 7.

MileHighKiwi

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#2528086 24-Jul-2020 11:19

Aussie are playing hardball!
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/super-rugby/122235935/australia-to-rebuff-nzs-super-rugby-invitation

"The expression of interest I'm not interested in and if they send it over I won't open it," RA chairman Hamish McLennan said.

They want 5 teams, how ridiculous!

networkn

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#2528093 24-Jul-2020 11:28

I've said it before, but a competition without SA/Arg is quite a bit less compelling to me. 5 Teams out of Australia is a bit crazy in my opinion. I think 2 is probably not enough (presuming the Warratahs and Brumbies).

It feels like there is something going on that isn't visible with NZR for them to take the approach they are. I wonder if it's some form of long play for what they actually want.

Has anyone here actually read the NZR report on Super Rugby?

Hammerer

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#2528113 24-Jul-2020 12:17

networkn:

It feels like there is something going on that isn't visible with NZR for them to take the approach they are.

I'm mystified. I don't think that it will be worthwhile as a means to gain a stronger bargaining position in SANZAAR.

My opinion count for nothings but I would rather watch NZ provincial rugby than Super Rugby if the new competition omits Australian teams. My favourite games have been tight trans-Tasman games.

Why not let Australia have five teams and then work on options to make them more competitive? They could, for example, allow more imports to strengthen team rosters.

On a different topic, I've appreciated Bernadine Oliver-Kirby on Sky Sports. I haven't noticed that she is as authoritative on rugby but she is a sharp presenter in general.

networkn

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#2528196 24-Jul-2020 13:42

The thing is, at the risk of sounding arrogant, Australia playing each other, and perhaps Japan, isn't likely to result in them improving to the point they get their higher rankings in test rugby back. You need to be challenged and for Australia that's likely SA, NZ, Argentina.

On the flip side, if they can only field 2 teams as per NZR's proposal, then that leaves a lot of pretty good Rugby players with not a lot to do next season.

This all feels terribly poorly thought out, but seems to have come off the back of a long period of SAANZAR not listening to the bodies they govern. None of what is being proposed seems to indicate a financially healthy future for Rugby.

I'd like to see a competition that helps the US improve. I really don't know what the answer is, but this doesn't feel like it.

I guess it doesn't help the full picture isn't available so we can only guess at motivations. A little less ego on all sides as well would probably help.

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#2528235 24-Jul-2020 14:57

MileHighKiwi:
Aussie are playing hardball!
https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/super-rugby/122235935/australia-to-rebuff-nzs-super-rugby-invitation

"The expression of interest I'm not interested in and if they send it over I won't open it," RA chairman Hamish McLennan said.

They want 5 teams, how ridiculous!

NZ want them to publicly beg to join the competition with 2 teams after the All Blacks coach publicly said they shouldn't support Australia. Then their proxy (Hansen) brought up a screw up by NZR from 20 years ago and said it was Australias fault, despite a high court judge putting the responsibility with NZR

NZs on the field product doesn't give them any ability to dictate to anyone else. They just don't seem to get it.

RA are responding to ridiculous demands in kind.

networkn

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#2528256 24-Jul-2020 15:50

What does NZ really get out of what you are suggesting? Having ARU beg if they even would, what would this actually achieve? Pro Sports is about money, how would this make them any ? I think there is more to this than you are indicating. NZR has determined for whatever reason that 2 Australian teams make them more money than 3, 4 or 5, the question is why?

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Handle9

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#2528261 24-Jul-2020 15:55

Hammerer:

networkn:

It feels like there is something going on that isn't visible with NZR for them to take the approach they are.

I'm mystified. I don't think that it will be worthwhile as a means to gain a stronger bargaining position in SANZAAR.

I haven't seen any evidence that NZR is capable of playing nicely with others for a long long time. This seems to be yet another in their long list of over estimations of their own importance.

NZs on field product doesn't give them any particular claim over other countries and they have no financial power due to market size and time zone. T

I've been disappointed in them for a long time but their behaviour in this episode has been disgusting. Instead of working together to give their supposed partners a leg up they have behaved in the most venal way possible. Hansen, in particular, has gone a long way down in my estimation.

Handle9

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#2528262 24-Jul-2020 15:57

networkn:

What does NZ really get out of what you are suggesting? Having ARU beg if they even would, what would this actually achieve? Pro Sports is about money, how would this make them any ? I think there is more to this than you are indicating. NZR has determined for whatever reason that 2 Australian teams make them more money than 3, 4 or 5, the question is why?

What has NZ gotten out of any of it's attempts to get more money out of the rest of the world over that last 5 years? Nothing.

I think you are grossly over estimating NZRs competence. I'd like to be wrong but I don't think I am.

networkn

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#2528805 25-Jul-2020 21:22

Congrats to the Canes for a game well played. Peter Umaga-Jensen was rightly man of the match. Canes scored some good tries.

Jack Goodhue had a first half to forget, our lineout continues to shake, but our scrum was a monster.

Bridges try was unbelieveable.

Handle9

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#2528821 26-Jul-2020 06:13

I only caught the last 15 minutes but it seemed like a fun game. Jordie Barrett just gets better and better. He's probably 2 seasons away from his peak but he's really maturing into a pretty special player.

linw

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#2528824 26-Jul-2020 07:49

Being a Wellingtonian, I was very happy with the result last night!! But it was great rugby from both sides. It feels like the game is freer with the ruck enforcements in place now.

itxtme

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#2528826 26-Jul-2020 08:31

Couple things about the Crusaders.

- They are winning by offloads, the sheer number of these they get to stick means they have many more opportunities than other teams. Teams need to do what England did in Japan and target the ball.

- They are experts at interfering with defensive lines. The number of dummy runners and sheperding throughout a game are ridiculous. Its something that needs more scrutiny, as they do it a phase before a breakout, which leads to the defensive line unable to reset. They are the best team because they are the best at getting away with the rule bending. The penalty against Ben May is a prime example of this, the Crusaders scored from this penalty kick. Replays clearly show the Crusaders player interfering in the defensive line, and he got pinged (and injured) for a no arms tackle even though he was going for the ball carrier.

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#2528830 26-Jul-2020 09:18

itxtme:

- They are experts at interfering with defensive lines. The number of dummy runners and sheperding throughout a game are ridiculous. Its something that needs more scrutiny, as they do it a phase before a breakout, which leads to the defensive line unable to reset. They are the best team because they are the best at getting away with the rule bending. The penalty against Ben May is a prime example of this, the Crusaders scored from this penalty kick. Replays clearly show the Crusaders player interfering in the defensive line, and he got pinged (and injured) for a no arms tackle even though he was going for the ball carrier.

Im glad I’m not the only one who thinks this. Fair enough to have dummy runners to draw defenders, but I believe that they are running lines to be deliberately obstructive. The May penalty could have just as easily gone against Moody because he was a pace ahead of his team mate and running an obstructive line (and he Hollywood-Ed off what was a glancing blow imo). Still, they aren’t getting pinged for it, so it must be within the rules.

No one has mentioned George Bridge’s freakish try. Amazing skill, a fair bit of luck and the bounce of the rugby ball all coalescing to produce a sensational try.

The Crusaders pack outweighed the Hurricanes by almost 30kg.

“We’ve arranged a society based on science and technology, in which nobody understands anything about science technology. Carl Sagan 1996

networkn

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#2528876 26-Jul-2020 10:04

I mentioned his try :) I could have gone on about it all night long. I have watched a lot of Rugby in my life, and that was one of the most unbelievable things I've seen :)

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