Geekzone Rugby (Union) Discussion Thread

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Networkn
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#2955167 16-Aug-2022 08:50

networkn:

Canterbury and Auckland are really showing dominance in the NPC this year.

Wow, what a massive difference a season makes for Southland. Auckland were pretty fortunate to win that game against them. Southland were within a hair of beating them. Auckland were probably a bit fortunate not to concede a yellow card in the last stanza of defense against their own red zone.

networkn

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#2955187 16-Aug-2022 09:33

Robinsons language (or lack of it perhaps) seems to indicate Foster is to be sacked IMO, but equally, how do you fire a guy who was in charge of a team that won at Ellis Park against all odds? I am not arguing for or against the actual decision, but if nothing less than 2-0 was the only way to save his job, and 1-1 isn't enough to save it, then they should have made that clear to him before leaving. Whilst the loss in the first match wasn't pretty, there *were* signs of improvement. NZR are damned if they do and if they don't. I don't think it's reasonable to tell him he can play against Argentina before making a decision, but I can understand that potentially there isn't enough data to definitively say he has turned things around as yet. Two losses or two wins might have been. As has been mentioned in the press, whilst Argentina are capable of beating us, we are expecting to win against them, even if we played the way we did against Ireland, I think we would likely squeak a win. Australia could shock us, but in their reduced state due to injury, that would seem unlikely. The next real test is the Northern Tour and by then it will be too late to change course (in my opinion).

itxtme

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#2955197 16-Aug-2022 09:51

Handle9:

itxtme:

I dont get it, they are deciding that later in the week. There is no sack him or dont... How are they making him live week to week?

Read Robinsons press statement after the Ireland series, his interview with Jason Pine and his comments on Sunday.

I literally have - the two of you are the delusional ones! Actually paste per vatim what he said that you are talking about. 2 pages of this discussion the best that you or Networkn have put forward is telling others to go back and listen to this or that. Just paste it here for us to all read! Networkn even referred to a tabloid article, like it held any inkling of balance. Then references to Mils Muliaina who paraphrased

"if he doesn't win this game the expectation is he gone if he doesn't win this game he's gone and it's week and week out"

"oh we're not sure really whether fozzie's going to be the man we're going to come back again and meet with the board and then have a decision"

But they never said those things, just that they were following the predetermined path after the Irish series loss that would see a reassessment after the SA tour. On the news last night Wayne Smith played down the reviews admitting they review after every tour, which is what I have been saying. You are 100% buying into the media BS hook line sinker. Prove me wrong, please

GV27

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#2955201 16-Aug-2022 09:56

itxtme:

On the news last night Wayne Smith played down the reviews admitting they review after every tour, which is what I have been saying. You are 100% buying into the media BS hook line sinker. Prove me wrong, please

I got the feel this was more a reflection on the nature of professional sport itself, in that you're always going through an analysis process of what could be done better.

His comment immediately after that was totally at odds with the idea that any of this was par for the course.

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#2955205 16-Aug-2022 10:00

There is a difference between a strategic review (talking about what worked well, what needs improvement, talking about logistics, general direction) and the fact you are reviewing whether the head coach (and assistants) is keeping his job every week or so.

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#2955238 16-Aug-2022 10:29

itxtme:

But they never said those things, just that they were following the predetermined path after the Irish series loss that would see a reassessment after the SA tour. On the news last night Wayne Smith played down the reviews admitting they review after every tour, which is what I have been saying. You are 100% buying into the media BS hook line sinker. Prove me wrong, please

You are hearing what you want to hear, and it's pretty obvious there is no further point in discussing so I suggest for the sake of avoiding further escalation, everyone drops it.

itxtme

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#2955265 16-Aug-2022 10:50

networkn:

itxtme:

But they never said those things, just that they were following the predetermined path after the Irish series loss that would see a reassessment after the SA tour. On the news last night Wayne Smith played down the reviews admitting they review after every tour, which is what I have been saying. You are 100% buying into the media BS hook line sinker. Prove me wrong, please

You are hearing what you want to hear, and it's pretty obvious there is no further point in discussing so I suggest for the sake of avoiding further escalation, everyone drops it.

Nothing irritates me more than a passive aggressive comment followed by a suggestion that we all drop it. How about you drop it, or come to the party with some actual evidence? The problem is you do not understand that quoting opinion pieces does not reflect reality, it is a point of view of someone. So to throw Robinson under the bus based on what was never said means you lack the ability to think critically about what you are consuming, because here we are again with you not willing to back up your view with anything.

GV27, you should watch it again, and see how the cut the scene to that second half response - I kid you not, its not part of the original answer but cut in. And this has been my point, there is a narrative being played out, but that narrative was different before the last SA win..

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networkn

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#2955277 16-Aug-2022 11:11

itxtme:

Nothing irritates me more than a passive aggressive comment followed by a suggestion that we all drop it. How about you drop it, or come to the party with some actual evidence? The problem is you do not understand that quoting opinion pieces does not reflect reality, it is a point of view of someone. So to throw Robinson under the bus based on what was never said means you lack the ability to think critically about what you are consuming, because here we are again with you not willing to back up your view with anything.

You not being willing to accept evidence isn't the same as me/handle9 not providing any.

You accuse me of not thinking critically, so consider this;

1) The press has been negative toward Foster since before he was appointed, even when winning, they have criticised him. They have been vicious and almost entirely one-sided the whole way through. Why would they now 'side' with Foster unless there was something amiss?

2) NZR has a long long history of behaving badly, from it's handling of it's relationship with Australia, to it's dealings with SA and many other things.

3) Foster has never seemed less than honest, and what seems more likely based on what you've seen from both parties? That Foster made up the story of them going to his house to tell him to quit if he didn't win in SA, or NZR did exactly that? Have you ever seen Foster anything less than genuine and professional? His coaching may be less than expected, but I don't think he has given anyone reason to doubt his integrity, intent or desire to see the best for the AB's.

After the win, why did Robinson not present WITH Foster to talk about how proud he was? He was never short of criticism when we lost. (His press release post-Ireland series was poor to say the least.) Instead, he held a press conference from the same hotel, a while later, to announce exactly nothing. By not standing WITH Foster (in general) he has effectively stood against him and undermined him in the view of the public. He could have stood up and supported him and still let him go based on performance. The way he has handled it has further fed the negativity around Foster, and that is *not* what a reasonable employer does. If Foster is sacked he would have a very good case with the ERA for mental harm and hostile workplace.

itxtme

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#2955309 16-Aug-2022 12:20

networkn:

After the win, why did Robinson not present WITH Foster to talk about how proud he was? He was never short of criticism when we lost. (His press release post-Ireland series was poor to say the least.) Instead, he held a press conference from the same hotel, a while later, to announce exactly nothing. By not standing WITH Foster (in general) he has effectively stood against him and undermined him in the view of the public. He could have stood up and supported him and still let him go based on performance. The way he has handled it has further fed the negativity around Foster, and that is *not* what a reasonable employer does. If Foster is sacked he would have a very good case with the ERA for mental harm and hostile workplace.

Because its professional sport mate, and while at the helm, the team has preformed poorly! A decision was made prior to SA to review after the tour, Robinsons press conference just reiterated that. What are you struggling with there?

"If Foster is sacked he would have a very good case with the ERA for mental harm and hostile workplace. " Another example of rhetoric without an inkling to support it. You realise that the ERA wouldn't accept that Herald article you keep referring to as evidence right?

Its OK to hold a well payed head coach accountable.

artbloke

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#2955310 16-Aug-2022 12:20

If anything is going to save Fosters job it's going to be Ryan, he's drilled the forwards brilliantly - in the 2nd test we had good solid platforms from our lineouts & scrums, and made big improvements in the breakdown area, so our backs were getting much more front foot ball, giving them more time & space to operate well... ideally though would like to see the two Crusaders blokes heavily involved with the ABs.

artbloke

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#2955341 16-Aug-2022 14:17

itxtme:

Its OK to hold a well payed head coach accountable.

Exactly, if anyone in a top position, whether that's in sport, business or in any type of job isn't performing well over a pretty long period they should be held accountable.

Handle9

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#2955348 16-Aug-2022 15:01

Everything is normal. Nothing to see.here.

networkn

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#2955572 17-Aug-2022 13:39

2:30pm press conference no doubt to advise the decision around Fosters future.

Whatever it is, I hope they treat him better than up to this point.

A ridiculous article showing Robertson riding a bike this morning trying to make out like it was related in some way to the decision on Fosters future. Laziest and most misleading 'journalism' I've seen in a while.

tdgeek

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#2955578 17-Aug-2022 13:49

networkn:

2:30pm press conference no doubt to advise the decision around Fosters future.

Whatever it is, I hope they treat him better than up to this point.

A ridiculous article showing Robertson riding a bike this morning trying to make out like it was related in some way to the decision on Fosters future. Laziest and most misleading 'journalism' I've seen in a while.

Unbelievable how low they can be. If I was Foster and was sucked into that article (as I was), I'd be fuming. I wouldn't even call it lazy, I'd call it stoking the fire to squeeze the last drops of clickbait out

networkn

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#2955582 17-Aug-2022 13:53

If they have given Robertson the job, does he have it regardless of results and for how long? He is retained guaranteed past the current RWC? If they don't give him the job, are they going to give it to him post RWC, or will the process be opened up for applications from anyone?

Language from Robinson in my mind clearly showed *his* preference was Foster gone, but the board could override him, he only makes a recommendation.

Is the press conference going to be televised?

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