Geekzone Rugby (Union) Discussion Thread

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#1361560 9-Aug-2015 15:29

My team for Auckland

1. Crockett
2. Coles
3. Franks
4. Retallick
5. Whitelock
6. McCaw
7. Cane
8. Read (he needs to pull finger!)

9. Perenara (he needs more than 3 mins at the end)
10. Carter ( As much as it pains me knowing there is better avaliable he needs game time. Blackadder should be shot for playing him out of position)
11. Savea
12. Nonu
13. Smith
14. Piutau
15. NMS - Assuming concussion rules out Smith

16. Taylor
17. Laulala
18. Franks
19. Vito
20. Kaino
21. Smith
22. Barrett
23. Fekitoa

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#1361570 9-Aug-2015 15:51

tdgeek: Barrett to not be on the bench. And what is the desire to send Richie and Dan to their last RWC, over and above the best team that can be named. I feel that they are included no matter what.

i don't have too much of a problem with Richie, I can understand how leadership is important. you can have the best 15 individuals and have a second best team.

but i have always had a problem with 2 people with VIP express passes before they've even kicked a ball.

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#1361581 9-Aug-2015 15:52

tukapa1: That was an awful game to watch. Both side made so many errors that there was no flow at all.

Congratulations to the Wallabies who did enough to win.

I'm troubled by both props. I don't know if Woodcock and Franks are up to it and would like to see Laulala get more game time. I'm happy with Coles at hooker.

Whitelock has to come back in to partner Retallick in the second row. Romano wasn't up to it last night.

Uncharacteristically poor game for the back row last night. Read was sloppy, Kaino was too tied up in the tight stuff and Richie was outplayed and pretty ineffective. This back row must remain as the number one starting combination though as there are no options better than Read and Kaino, and even though Cane would provide us with more in the rucks and in general play, Richie has to stay for his captaincy and experience.

Aaron Smith had an uncharacteristically bad night at halfback, hampered somewhat by the laboured ball he was receiving.

Dc showed that he is just no longer up to it at this level. He missed two conversions, a kick for touch to set up an attacking line out and duffed a couple of restarts that didn't go ten meters. On top of that his defence was average and I only recall him attacking the line once. Yes, it led to a try, but it was a poor pass into traffic that was intercepted. The try only came about because Ben Smith was strong enough to rip it out of the Aussie payers grasp before offloading to Milner-Skudder.

SBW was atrocious and should not be taken to the RWC as he has done nothing to suggest he adds anything to the All Black backline.

Conrad Smith is starting to show his age, but as the conductor of the back line he needs to stay, especially as he is likely to be paired with Nonu and they have a proven combination.

Savea was strangely out of kilter but I liked what I saw from Milner-Skudder, however it is only one game and I would like to see more of him before deciding whether my starting right winger would be Milner-Skudder or Piutau.

It was a breath of fresh air having Ben Smith at fullback and I thought he played well, considering what he had in front of him. It was a comfort knowing we had someone at the back that would make those one-on-one tackles and the one that brought down Folau close to the line was special.

I find it interesting (and perhaps a bit disingenuous) the lack of comment yet on this forum about DC from those that consistently attack Cruden and Barrett when they miss a kick or two in test matches, claiming they aren't up to it and demanding DC be reinstated.

Starting XV for Auckland;

Prop - Laulala on one side and pick anyone else for the other side.
Hooker - Coles
Locks - Retallick, Whitelock
Flankers - Kaino, McCaw
No 8 - Read
Halfback - Smith
1st 5/8 - Sopoaga
2nd 5/8 - Nonu
Centre - Smith
Wings - Savea, Milner-Skudder
Fullback - Smith (if fit)

Reserves, Any remaining two props, Taylor, Romano (because there really is nobody else), Cane, Perenara, Barrett, Fekitoa

Again, on their day they are all pretty darn good. But it wasn't their day. Can't drop the entire team just coz they lost by underperforming.

The key is finding out who fits and who doesn't fit in the 15, 22, 31.

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#1361661 9-Aug-2015 18:35

tdgeek: Barrett to not be on the bench. And what is the desire to send Richie and Dan to their last RWC, over and above the best team that can be named. I feel that they are included no matter what.

Seriously? You want Richie out in favour of someone else?

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#1361662 9-Aug-2015 18:38

I find it interesting (and perhaps a bit disingenuous) the lack of comment yet on this forum about DC from those that consistently attack Cruden and Barrett when they miss a kick or two in test matches, claiming they aren't up to it and demanding DC be reinstated.

Heh you must have trouble with reading then, I see PLENTY of comments suggesting Carter had a very average night and one of his worst performances. Perhaps go re-read the last 2 pages.

I am far less worried about his goal kicking than the tactical parts of his kicking which were mistake ridden.

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#1361664 9-Aug-2015 18:41

Before everyone goes off sacking our most senior players and leaving us with 23 guys with under 200 caps between them....

52-47 NZ beats Australia in the Netball. For only the 4th time at a world cup.

Can happen in in any sport on any day depending on who fronts.

Look at Australia's consistency over the past 10 years, it's been rubbish, let's not all go off the deep end.

They certainly do look a lot better under Chieka however..

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#1361678 9-Aug-2015 19:13

networkn:
tdgeek: Barrett to not be on the bench. And what is the desire to send Richie and Dan to their last RWC, over and above the best team that can be named. I feel that they are included no matter what.

Seriously? You want Richie out in favour of someone else?

My point was that Richie and Dan are in the squad. No matter what. Not that there is any opportunity left to prove they are the ones for the 7 and 10. Yes Richie has great value as captain but this is their swansong, if dan had another off game Saturday that song matter. My concern is their star quality now deserving of the 7 and 10 in general play?

Hatch

Trade NZ and US shares and funds with Hatch (affiliate link).

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#1361686 9-Aug-2015 19:30

tdgeek:
networkn:
tdgeek: Barrett to not be on the bench. And what is the desire to send Richie and Dan to their last RWC, over and above the best team that can be named. I feel that they are included no matter what.

Seriously? You want Richie out in favour of someone else?

My point was that Richie and Dan are in the squad. No matter what. Not that there is any opportunity left to prove they are the ones for the 7 and 10. Yes Richie has great value as captain but this is their swansong, if dan had another off game Saturday that song matter. My concern is their star quality now deserving of the 7 and 10 in general play?

DC has been kicking reasonably well and has loads of experience. He had a pretty bad night last night, no one disputes it, but do you think he is going to not do everything he can to fix in the coming week? They will take some other 10's but for my money, if it comes down to the winning kick in the final, I'd rather have Carter there ahead of ANY other 10 in the world.

Richie got beaten at the break down this week but otherwise was excellent on defence, certainly one of the better forwards, but he can't do everything on his own. Otherwise he has had pretty good performances overall. No doubt in my mind he deserves the #7 jersey. Woodcock and Franks had VERY average performances. They haven't had good performances up to standards displayed even last year. To suggest Richie hasn't earned the right to be the first guy selected in any AB's team is just crazy.

South Africa got beaten by Argentina for goodness sakes, are they going to sack all the players, of course not. Sometimes teams lose, it happens.

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#1361698 9-Aug-2015 20:06

networkn:

I find it interesting (and perhaps a bit disingenuous) the lack of comment yet on this forum about DC from those that consistently attack Cruden and Barrett when they miss a kick or two in test matches, claiming they aren't up to it and demanding DC be reinstated.

Heh you must have trouble with reading then, I see PLENTY of comments suggesting Carter had a very average night and one of his worst performances. Perhaps go re-read the last 2 pages.

I am far less worried about his goal kicking than the tactical parts of his kicking which were mistake ridden.

No - I read the comments that said he had a poor night.

What those comments weren't followed up with is that he should be replaced with "insert your favourite players name here" because missed kicks will lose us a vital match at the RWC.

Of course the problem being is that DC is the player people like to promote as being someone who won't miss shots at goal or duff general kicks in play. This of course follows any game that Cruden or Barrett miss a kick in.

DC will go down as one of the AB's greatest. No doubt. But that was in the past. He doesn't attack the line any more and just shovels the ball on. Don't say that could be the game plan because Hansen made it clear a week or so ago that he wanted DC to do more running at the line and less shoveling of the ball. His defence is not as strong as it used to be either. It certainly used to be a strength.

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#1361724 9-Aug-2015 21:12

DC will go down as one of the AB's greatest. No doubt. But that was in the past. He doesn't attack the line any more and just shovels the ball on. Don't say that could be the game plan because Hansen made it clear a week or so ago that he wanted DC to do more running at the line and less shoveling of the ball. His defence is not as strong as it used to be either. It certainly used to be a strength.

Interesting because week after week he plays his defence is mentioned time and time again (Commentators and the stats articles). Agreed his isn't still at his best but he is no worse than the other players you mention AS A PACKAGE. I agree he isn't taking the line. I am not sure why, lack of confidence perhaps, worrying about not being included due to injury perhaps?

You are choosing one of his rare bad nights, but his kickoffs are thing of legend, even as recently as Pumas games and mentioned during his last few weeks playing 10 for the Crusaders (and ad infinitum thoughout his career. Usually his in game kicking is excellent, and one bad night should not cause you any concern. Problem is you won't be convinced no matter how well he plays, you want someone else.

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#1361743 9-Aug-2015 21:15

tukapa1:
networkn:

I find it interesting (and perhaps a bit disingenuous) the lack of comment yet on this forum about DC from those that consistently attack Cruden and Barrett when they miss a kick or two in test matches, claiming they aren't up to it and demanding DC be reinstated.

Heh you must have trouble with reading then, I see PLENTY of comments suggesting Carter had a very average night and one of his worst performances. Perhaps go re-read the last 2 pages.

I am far less worried about his goal kicking than the tactical parts of his kicking which were mistake ridden.

No - I read the comments that said he had a poor night.

What those comments weren't followed up with is that he should be replaced with "insert your favourite players name here" because missed kicks will lose us a vital match at the RWC.

Of course the problem being is that DC is the player people like to promote as being someone who won't miss shots at goal or duff general kicks in play. This of course follows any game that Cruden or Barrett miss a kick in.

DC will go down as one of the AB's greatest. No doubt. But that was in the past. He doesn't attack the line any more and just shovels the ball on. Don't say that could be the game plan because Hansen made it clear a week or so ago that he wanted DC to do more running at the line and less shoveling of the ball. His defence is not as strong as it used to be either. It certainly used to be a strength.

This is the point I was putting forward in my recent posts

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#1361747 9-Aug-2015 21:20

networkn:
tdgeek:
networkn:
tdgeek: Barrett to not be on the bench. And what is the desire to send Richie and Dan to their last RWC, over and above the best team that can be named. I feel that they are included no matter what.

Seriously? You want Richie out in favour of someone else?

My point was that Richie and Dan are in the squad. No matter what. Not that there is any opportunity left to prove they are the ones for the 7 and 10. Yes Richie has great value as captain but this is their swansong, if dan had another off game Saturday that song matter. My concern is their star quality now deserving of the 7 and 10 in general play?

DC has been kicking reasonably well and has loads of experience. He had a pretty bad night last night, no one disputes it, but do you think he is going to not do everything he can to fix in the coming week? They will take some other 10's but for my money, if it comes down to the winning kick in the final, I'd rather have Carter there ahead of ANY other 10 in the world.

Richie got beaten at the break down this week but otherwise was excellent on defence, certainly one of the better forwards, but he can't do everything on his own. Otherwise he has had pretty good performances overall. No doubt in my mind he deserves the #7 jersey. Woodcock and Franks had VERY average performances. They haven't had good performances up to standards displayed even last year. To suggest Richie hasn't earned the right to be the first guy selected in any AB's team is just crazy.

South Africa got beaten by Argentina for goodness sakes, are they going to sack all the players, of course not. Sometimes teams lose, it happens.

I didn't say that, I asked that question. And you answered. If the general consensus is that their age, slowing down, and Dans gameplay in recent times, is still a better option than younger, hungrier players, then I would go along with that. But, there is a line where the gameplay isn't matching the past wonderful efforts, they are both in the twilight of international rugby. Perhaps last night brought that point more to the fore front

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#1361764 9-Aug-2015 21:35

But, I am hoping many of us will be munching a bit of humble pie next Satdee!

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#1361772 9-Aug-2015 21:53

tdgeek: But, I am hoping many of us will be munching a bit of humble pie next Satdee!

I'd really like to see them give Australia another 30 point hiding, but I suspect Steve Hansen is keeping his killer moves till the knockout stages of the RWC. I am hoping that pays off.

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#1361775 9-Aug-2015 22:00

networkn:
tdgeek: But, I am hoping many of us will be munching a bit of humble pie next Satdee!

I'd really like to see them give Australia another 30 point hiding, but I suspect Steve Hansen is keeping his killer moves till the knockout stages of the RWC. I am hoping that pays off.

Thats a very good point.

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