I got 2650km out of my 12 speed XT chain on my Electric Trek Rail. Alll muc off dry lube.

Good enough for me

I did the whole wax thing for about a year. Crock pot, a KG of paraffin wax (turns out a KG is a lot 😂) and various thinners. It kept everything lovely and clean but honestly I'd get about 50kms out of it. Plus I'd kill quick links quite quickly. 

I bought a bottle of something my local shop mixes up (I think). Not cheap but I just squirt it quite liberally. I mainly ride at Woodhill which is sand based and will murder drivetrains. I tend to try brush the cassette and chain after a ride. Then lube maybe every two to three weeks. 

The smell alone makes it seem it will combust if the garage gets too hot. Not sure how it works. Squirt on to degrease/clean. Wipe down. Then reapply, then wipe down. 

Thinking of parts and drivetrains, one thing that has really got my goat of late is the slow, but obvious shift to using cheaper and lower quality parts on new bikes, while simultaneously raising the prices. 

Recently, there's been a bit of online outrage about Norco's new MTB range (one model in particular, but can't recall which one)  - they have increased the price by about 20%, while reducing the quality of the parts all over the bike - to take it from a high-mid-range bike to probably the equivalent of an entry-level full-suspension bike. Premium pricing, budget components. 

It's obvious that the cost of doing business has risen, but the bike industry is in crisis right now - surely ripping off consumers or ruining the legacy of certain models/brands is not the way to go about staying afloat? 

I've noticed that there are bikes from the likes of Giant, which are priced in the $5-7k range that are sporting Shimano CUES  - a range that Shimano touted as being a new modern entry-level drivetrain to replace everything from Tourney to Acera and Alivio, through to the bottom end of Deore. 

When I am paying $5-7k for a bike, I'd be excpecting SLX at the very least. Seems like they;re using hard times as an excuse to rip off consumers. 

Case in point: 

Last year's Super-enduro offering from Giant - the Reig nSX (I have an older version): https://www.giant-bicycles.com/nz/reign-sx

• Shifters Shimano Deore SL-M4100, 1x10
• Front Derailleur N/A
• Rear Derailleur Shimano Deore RD-M5120
• Brakes SRAM Code R, hydraulic, CenterLine rotors [F]220mm, [R]200mm

This year's version of the same bike: https://www.giant-bicycles.com/nz/comparison/gc@3534-gc@3254

• Shifters Shimano CUES SL-6000-10R, 1x10
• Front Derailleur N/A
• Rear Derailleur Shimano CUES RD-U6000, Shadow+
• Brakes SRAM Code R, hydraulic, CenterLine rotors [F]220mm, [R]203mm

I understand a park bike such as this having Deore, perhaps, as it's a drivetrain that is relatively cheap to replace if brutalised (and this bike is designed for hard riding), but to drop down to a groupset that is at best one level below, at worst 2-3? Not good enough for a $7k mountain bike. 

As I said - for that price I'd want at least SLX, probably XT. 

And I was mildly disappointed to get a combo of SLX and Deore with an XT rear derailleur on my $5k Trek Slash in 2022.

Just replaced the drivetrain with XT as part of routine maintenance.  And wondering how to justify replacing the otherwise perfectly good shifter to get the XT multi shift feature that SLX does not have.

It was bad enough that due to parts supply issues at that time, the speced Shimano brakes were replaced with Tektro Orion.  They got immediately swapped with the Magura's I had on my other bike.

geoffwnz:

 

And I was mildly disappointed to get a combo of SLX and Deore with an XT rear derailleur on my $5k Trek Slash in 2022.

 

Just replaced the drivetrain with XT as part of routine maintenance.  And wondering how to justify replacing the otherwise perfectly good shifter to get the XT multi shift feature that SLX does not have.

 

It was bad enough that due to parts supply issues at that time, the speced Shimano brakes were replaced with Tektro Orion.  They got immediately swapped with the Magura's I had on my other bike.

 

I thought modern SLX had the multi-shift that XT has had for a while? 
I have SLX shifters and XT RD, but have SLX brakes - I am actually pretty happy with it, but it's all older tech - 11-speed XT. 

Handsomedan:

 

I thought modern SLX had the multi-shift that XT has had for a while? 
I have SLX shifters and XT RD, but have SLX brakes - I am actually pretty happy with it, but it's all older tech - 11-speed XT. 

 

12 Speed SLX can shift 3 multiple gears in one press, 12 speed XT can do 4.

The previous M7000 SLX 11 speed can do 3 shifts as well

JPNZ:

 

Handsomedan:

 

I thought modern SLX had the multi-shift that XT has had for a while? 
I have SLX shifters and XT RD, but have SLX brakes - I am actually pretty happy with it, but it's all older tech - 11-speed XT. 

 

 

12 Speed SLX can shift 3 multiple gears in one press, 12 speed XT can do 4.

 

The previous M7000 SLX 11 speed can do 3 shifts as well

 

Up the cassette (easier gears) yes, down, no.  I'm used to the XT 11 speed shifter on the other bike that can go up 3 or 4 and down 2 (or 3 I can't recall).

geoffwnz:

 

JPNZ:

 

12 Speed SLX can shift 3 multiple gears in one press, 12 speed XT can do 4.

 

The previous M7000 SLX 11 speed can do 3 shifts as well

 

 

Up the cassette (easier gears) yes, down, no.  I'm used to the XT 11 speed shifter on the other bike that can go up 3 or 4 and down 2 (or 3 I can't recall).

 

Ah I see. 

I know for a fact (2016-2020) XT M8000 11 speed does 4 up and 2 down as I just tested it on my hardtail. Technically IMO going up the cassette is harder for the chain than going down so goodness knows why shifters do less that way?

If it makes you feel better, the bike I bought at the end of 2022, I'd waited 13 months for, got all NX, and is now 40% off.

I think there a combination of things, general inflation, there was a chronic shortage for Shimano and brands specced whatever they could get their hands on. Realistically the mid level is probably nearer to five figures now. The issue for me is I like particular brands (suspension and brakes) that weren't on any of the builds. So if I'd spent more I'd got maybe a nicer drivetrain and wheelset but would have to have bought fork/shock/brakes etc anyway.

As it was, I made myself wait one year before replacing anything. And that's up. So new fork went on this week, brakes last month, shock a couple of months ago, new cassette, chain, bars and stem 🤣

Oh and just ordered another dropper. 

Yeah, that was more or less my plan also.  Take it as it came with the intention to upgrade the components as they came up for normal replacement. 

I'm happy enough with the Rockshox pairing or the Yari up front and the Deluxe Select+ rear shock so while I'd like to replace with something "better", for the riding I do, the cost/benefit is not there to justify it.

A better wheelset would be a higher priority I think.

What dropper did you go for?  Mine ended up with some random TransX brand instead of whatever it was supposed to have.  It's got some play in it and I can't seem to find any sort of rebuild info/kit so it might be destined for the junk sooner than later.

geoffwnz:

 

What dropper did you go for?  Mine ended up with some random TransX brand instead of whatever it was supposed to have.  It's got some play in it and I can't seem to find any sort of rebuild info/kit so it might be destined for the junk sooner than later.

 

Ah a second One Up dropper post. I actually bought one for the bike straight away at 180mm (came with 150mm). But never actually measured the insertion depth as the One Up website had a frame calculator, IE put your brand and size etc in and recommended the longest that it would fit.

So I've spent a year with quite a high post even when dropped not realising that I had another 5cm or so of insertion. Which of course with a 180mm post, means it wouldn't be high enough. It's performed fine I just would like more drop for the DH. So ordered a 210mm

I've had Reverbs and a Manitou Jack on my second bike which has been really good. They all seem to wobble or rotate a little at least. I've never come across one without some play. 

geoffwnz:

 

Up the cassette (easier gears) yes, down, no.  I'm used to the XT 11 speed shifter on the other bike that can go up 3 or 4 and down 2 (or 3 I can't recall).

 

Yeah I can push through a few gears at a time on a pinch climb and it even works quite well under load (SLX shifter/XT derailleur) but as soon as I want to rip throug the gears on a descent, it's one at a time. That's something I'd like to change one day - assume an 11-speed XT shifter would allow it? 

Handsomedan:

 

geoffwnz:

 

Up the cassette (easier gears) yes, down, no.  I'm used to the XT 11 speed shifter on the other bike that can go up 3 or 4 and down 2 (or 3 I can't recall).

 

 

Yeah I can push through a few gears at a time on a pinch climb and it even works quite well under load (SLX shifter/XT derailleur) but as soon as I want to rip throug the gears on a descent, it's one at a time. That's something I'd like to change one day - assume an 11-speed XT shifter would allow it? 

 

An M8000 XT 11 speed would yes. 

Handsomedan:

 

geoffwnz:

 

Up the cassette (easier gears) yes, down, no.  I'm used to the XT 11 speed shifter on the other bike that can go up 3 or 4 and down 2 (or 3 I can't recall).

 

 

Yeah I can push through a few gears at a time on a pinch climb and it even works quite well under load (SLX shifter/XT derailleur) but as soon as I want to rip throug the gears on a descent, it's one at a time. That's something I'd like to change one day - assume an 11-speed XT shifter would allow it? 

 

Yep, as confirmed by JPNZ above, XT 11 Speed is 4 up, 2 down.  Just checked mine is the same. 

12 speed seems to be 3 up, 1 down for SLX and according to research, 3 up and 2 down for XT.