Relocating to the Gulf

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#3060795 10-Apr-2023 07:01

I stopped posting in this thread when the pandemic started for a variety of reasons.

Is there any interest in me posting again? A few things have changed in the last 3 years ;)

johno1234

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#3060800 10-Apr-2023 08:06

Always fascinating to hear about life in such different places. Post away!

Wombat1

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#3060809 10-Apr-2023 09:03

Been there, done it for a few months. Did not enjoy it, kids really struggled to adapt. Culturally it’s just so different. Oh that heat is crazy. We settled for “cool” Brisbane instead.

Dingbatt

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#3060812 10-Apr-2023 09:17

Handle9:
Is there any interest in me posting again? A few things have changed in the last 3 years ;)

Yes.

My opportunity passed me by 20 years ago, but the next generation of the family is seriously looking at a move to Dubai. So any insight on life there, particularly in our brave new world, would be valuable.

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#3060816 10-Apr-2023 09:41

Please, keep us updated. I've transited through the gulf dozens of times (Dubai, Abu Dhabi & Doha) but never left the airport. I've always wondered what it was like on the other side of those doors.

Handle9

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#3061024 10-Apr-2023 15:44

Ok seeing there is some interest here we go.

The Dubai and middle eastern economies are pumping at the moment. Oil prices are high so there's a ton of money being spent. Saudi in particular has an insane number of huge projects happening at the moment, from huge airport projects to whole cities. They are trying to reduce their dependence on oil and making big changes. Saudi Arabia is very different so some other countries in the gulf as it has a very large and young population. You'd never see an Emirati in the UAE driving a cab or working in a supermarket whereas it's normal in Saudi or Oman.

Dubai property in particular has gone berserk. The UAE is neutral in the Ukraine conflict which has resulted in massive Russian immigration and investment in Dubai. Dubai property has always been volatile but it's gone to the next level in the last 18 months.

In a combination of (mostly) good fortune and (a little) good management, we bought a house here at the beginning of last year. We wanted a bigger house than we were renting and some money invested that we could use for a deposit so decided to go for it. We'd seen rents rapidly going up and were keen to decouple ourselves from that mess. There are rent controls here but also a lot of unscrupulous landlords who try and take the p&ss. Rents in popular areas have gone up between 50-75% in the last 2 years which is problematic for a lot of people.

Expats can borrow up to 80% of the property value here and we were able lock in 2.99% for 5 years which meant our cashflow was similar to renting. The process of buying with a mortgage is pretty slow and expensive. From making an offer to taking possession took around 3-4 months, which was OK for us. We had to pay around 7% of the property value on top, with 4% to the local government, 2% to the agent and around 1% in miscellaneous fees. We moved in during April last year and we're very happy here.

The house is big, with 5 bedrooms and something around 300m2 if you assessed it in the way we would in NZ. The kids had been sharing a bedroom at our old house and are happy having their own rooms again. Our oldest is 11 now so getting to a point where having her own space is desirable.

The other major cost with the house is "service fees." The house is in a gated community, which almost all property available to expats is in Dubai. There is security, a gym, a pool etc which we get to pay for based on the size of the property. This is roughly equivalent to a 13th mortgage payment (actually a bit more.)

In the last year we've replaced the kitchen (Ikea), installed LVT flooring, landscaped and we're replacing the AC units at the moment. Hopefully the last one will be commissioned today, the unit is showing errors so Fujitsu has had to come to site and they are coming back today. We've got roughly 55kw of cooling across 4 ducted units so moving from ancient units to modern R32 inverters will give us decent efficiency gains.

We are currently trying to figure out our next career moves, my wife has been studying towards her masters in education for the last 2 years. She's been able to do this part time while working full time, which has been a challenge for all of us. It's been good though and she's really enjoyed it.

I think it's reasonably likely that I'll be able to get another posting with work which means we'd sell the house here and move to another country. If the property market continues to boom for another 6 months we'll be able to walk away with a nice return as well as living in a house we have enjoyed. If we can pay off our NZ mortgage I'd be pretty happy.

Handle9

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#3061028 10-Apr-2023 16:05

Dingbatt:
Handle9:
Is there any interest in me posting again? A few things have changed in the last 3 years ;)

Yes.

My opportunity passed me by 20 years ago, but the next generation of the family is seriously looking at a move to Dubai. So any insight on life there, particularly in our brave new world, would be valuable.

Please feel free to DM us there’s anything specific you’d like to ask. You can have a great life here but it’s certainly not all sunshine and rainbows.

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Handle9

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#3061077 10-Apr-2023 16:16

This was the guys craning two of the outdoor AC units onto our roof

k1w1k1d

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#3061099 10-Apr-2023 16:34

Due to the lack of helmets and restraints worn on the roof, I take it that H&S is not a high priority?

Handle9

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#3061101 10-Apr-2023 16:38

k1w1k1d:

Due to the lack of helmets and restraints worn on the roof, I take it that H&S is not a high priority?

The majority of people working in construction and trades are from developing countries. They tend to import their practices from their home countries. Certainly this is the case in domestic trades. The amount of wiring I’ve found joined with tape is nuts.

The rules and what happens in practice are pretty different.

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#3061203 10-Apr-2023 20:05

I assume Dubai is a bit like Bahrain. And most of the workers are Indian? And the temperature never hits 50 degrees (when work would stop)

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#3061209 10-Apr-2023 20:30

davidcole: I assume Dubai is a bit like Bahrain. And most of the workers are Indian? And the temperature never hits 50 degrees (when work would stop)

Half of the UAE population is south Asian.

Getting to 50 degrees is pretty unusual, I’ve never seen it on my outside air sensor. 43-45 is hot enough.

In summer it’s illegal to work in construction between 12:30 and 3pm anyway. It gets reasonably adhered to IME.

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#3061320 11-Apr-2023 08:38

k1w1k1d:

Due to the lack of helmets and restraints worn on the roof, I take it that H&S is not a high priority?

The UAE and africa has their own way of doing things 🤣 H&S is more of a guideline then anything else.

johno1234

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#3061322 11-Apr-2023 08:48

Silvrav:

k1w1k1d:

Due to the lack of helmets and restraints worn on the roof, I take it that H&S is not a high priority?

The UAE and africa has their own way of doing things 🤣 H&S is more of a guideline then anything else.

Not one of the Emirates, Qatar seem to be particularly bad, based on the scandals around FIFA World Cup stadium construction and the number of fatal accidents.

Handle9

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#3065853 20-Apr-2023 04:29

The Eid Al Fitr holiday starts tonight.

Ramadan is a nice time here. The working day is reduced by 2 hours and work decided to give us Friday afternoons off.

Islamic holidays are fun. It’s all driven around the lunar calendar and moon sightings. If the moon is seen before midnight tonight we’ll have a 4 day weekend, if it gets sighted after midnight it’ll be a 5 day weekend. We won’t know until tomorrow.

It’s a real mind bender when you move here having so much uncertainty about public holidays but it’s part of the fun.

Next week will be back to reality, school will be back to starting at 7:40am and finishing at 2:50pm. During Ramadan it was 8am-1pm which is lovely for Mrs Handles and the mini Handles. Next week will hurt.

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