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  # 1704125 16-Jan-2017 13:53
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Fred99:

 

networkn:

 

*He* was a sh*te President, or his Presidency was sh*te because he was blocked every step of the way from doing what he wanted by bone headed Republicans who tried to stop him "just because'?

 

 

 

I think you meant that for someone else. I was disputing the fact he was a sh*te President.

 

 

 

 

 

 


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  # 1704128 16-Jan-2017 14:04
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Fred99:

 

;

 

; Drivel deleted for the sake of brevity

 

;

 

 

 

 

Great graphs but once again... you're trying to force-feed the idea that because of "X", "Y" occurred.  Post hoc ergo proctor hoc is the fallacy in your argument (look it up).  Consider this... my brother moved to the US on the same dates Obama took office... therefore, my brother moving to the US changed the economy.  Pretty stupid logic, yeah?

 

Let's agree that Bush did no favours to the US economy.  Against the backdrop of the wars and the $700bn bank bailout, the economy was in the toilet.  Where else could it have possibly gone?  Any further down and everybody would have starved.  Still though, after 8 years, Obama couldn't break 3% GDP?  He was a shi*te president, mate :)  I hate to break it to you but, he was just not in touch with reality.  His crappy little plans worked well in community service arena but, not for a country.

 

Let's see what the billionaire can do  :)  Everybody is judging him for everything without seeing if he can produce.  Let's just chill and watch.


 
 
 
 


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  # 1704132 16-Jan-2017 14:17
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JimsonWeed:

 

Fred99:

 

;

 

; Drivel deleted for the sake of brevity

 

;

 

 

 

 

Great graphs but once again... you're trying to force-feed the idea that because of "X", "Y" occurred.  Post hoc ergo proctor hoc is the fallacy in your argument (look it up).  Consider this... my brother moved to the US on the same dates Obama took office... therefore, my brother moving to the US changed the economy.  Pretty stupid logic, yeah?

 

Let's agree that Bush did no favours to the US economy.  Against the backdrop of the wars and the $700bn bank bailout, the economy was in the toilet.  Where else could it have possibly gone?  Any further down and everybody would have starved.  Still though, after 8 years, Obama couldn't break 3% GDP?  He was a shi*te president, mate :)  I hate to break it to you but, he was just not in touch with reality.  His crappy little plans worked well in community service arena but, not for a country.

 

Let's see what the billionaire can do  :)  Everybody is judging him for everything without seeing if he can produce.  Let's just chill and watch.

 

 

 

 

It's actually "post hoc ergo propter hoc".

 

Use it to dismiss Obama's achievements, then state "lets see what the billionaire can do etc..." 

 

Yup - that's pretty stupid logic.

 

 


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  # 1704133 16-Jan-2017 14:18
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JimsonWeed:

 

Fred99:

 

;

 

; Drivel deleted for the sake of brevity

 

;

 

 

 

 

Great graphs but once again... you're trying to force-feed the idea that because of "X", "Y" occurred.  Post hoc ergo proctor hoc is the fallacy in your argument (look it up).  Consider this... my brother moved to the US on the same dates Obama took office... therefore, my brother moving to the US changed the economy.  Pretty stupid logic, yeah?

 

Let's agree that Bush did no favours to the US economy.  Against the backdrop of the wars and the $700bn bank bailout, the economy was in the toilet.  Where else could it have possibly gone?  Any further down and everybody would have starved.  Still though, after 8 years, Obama couldn't break 3% GDP?  He was a shi*te president, mate :)  I hate to break it to you but, he was just not in touch with reality.  His crappy little plans worked well in community service arena but, not for a country.

 

Let's see what the billionaire can do  :)  Everybody is judging him for everything without seeing if he can produce.  Let's just chill and watch.

 

 

The problem is, the consequences of him (Trump) staying in office and you being wrong, are so much vastly worse, than if he is removed and you are right :) 

 

I am of the wait and see variety to some degree, but I also agree that my hopes he would start acting more Presidental have been dashed, that he continues to fail to understand when to stop speaking.

 

Also if you used the logic you have above, then anything good (or bad) that happens on Trumps watch, could just be co-incidence?

 

 

 

 


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  # 1704136 16-Jan-2017 14:26
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JimsonWeed:

 

Fred99:

 

; Drivel deleted for the sake of brevity

 

 

 

Those were charts based on verifiable facts - not "drivel".

 

Either get some manners if you want to continue discussion - or get lost.


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  # 1704137 16-Jan-2017 14:27
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networkn:

 

The problem is, the consequences of him (Trump) staying in office and you being wrong, are so much vastly worse, than if he is removed and you are right :) 

 

I am of the wait and see variety to some degree, but I also agree that my hopes he would start acting more Presidental have been dashed, that he continues to fail to understand when to stop speaking.

 

Also if you used the logic you have above, then anything good (or bad) that happens on Trumps watch, could just be co-incidence?

 

 

 

 

To quote the great economists of our day... "It depends"  :)

 

If Trump says, "I'm going to do X, Y, and Z", and he does those things then... what do you think?  Coincidence, happenstance, or maybe just a stroke of luck?  Who knows but... the Captain goes down with the ship.  Accountability is the name of the game.  This is what is lost on a global scale... not only presidents but, corporate executives off-loading their failures onto their subordinates.

 

I hear you :)   and yeah... excellent question.  We can't really see into the future at this point in time but... you're spot on by asking that.


gzt

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  # 1704139 16-Jan-2017 14:35
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JimsonWeed:

gzt:
JimsonWeed:


gzt: That's a good question. While Fred99 is checking sources, you can explain to me why you believe the mainstream media is morally corrupt. It's a serious question.


Both have an agenda and it's become acceptable for them to throw whatever they want into the wind regardless of any substantial backing.  There's a saying in the legal arena; A skunk having entered the courtroom and subsequently removed, none can deny it's smell.  It means, you can taint logic and reason with foul information and it cannot be forgotten.  It's nothing new but, it's far more prevalent today.



I can guess you would put the many allegations of Trump's sexual assaults and inappropriate behaviour in that category:

http://nymag.com/thecut/2016/10/all-the-women-accusing-trump-of-rape-sexual-assault.html

That list was current in October it's likely a few more came forward since then. These are not unsubstantiated rumors, these are sourced reports. News organisations would not be fulfilling thier responsibility to the public if they did not report these allegations.


Ah well, he's in good company with Kennedy and Clinton then.  BTW, did you see the Swedish woman he allegedly groped?  Woah!  Go Donald :)


I assume then that you are now agreeing it was appropriate to print these allegations. I am not familiar with the instance you speak of.

The media has published these and you have been able to form your own opinion of the allegations. Ie; a very similar situation to allegations regarding Kennedy and Clinton.

Then after that, you appear to be encouraging Trump to commit assaults. That really crosses a line if that is your intention.


 
 
 
 


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  # 1704141 16-Jan-2017 14:38
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Fred99:

 

JimsonWeed:

 

Fred99:

 

; Drivel deleted for the sake of brevity

 

 

 

Those were charts based on verifiable facts - not "drivel".

 

Either get some manners if you want to continue discussion - or get lost.

 

 

 

 

Well, at least TRY to understand what I am saying about "relevance".  I'm not trying to be insulting here but, mate... really... I've mentioned this a dozen times.  Correlation does not substantiate causation.  Remember.... I got up this morning and did not eat breakfast.  It rained.  Therefore, if I don't eat breakfast, it will rain.  That is idiotic logic. Obama enters office and suddenly "things" shift.  Great, wonderful... where is the relationship between those two instances?

 

I'll grow some manners but, please try to be open-minded to what I am saying to you as well.  In my opinion, unsubstantiated charts, graphs, statements, etc., are all drivel.  Sorry... Ditch the charts and throw some facts into the mix.  If you are one of those that believes everything that is printed in the media then well... you're right, let's just not talk  :)  There will never be any winning between us.


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  # 1704142 16-Jan-2017 14:38
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Fred99:

 

JimsonWeed:

 

Fred99:

 

; Drivel deleted for the sake of brevity

 

 

 

Those were charts based on verifiable facts - not "drivel".

 

Either get some manners if you want to continue discussion - or get lost.

 

 

Everyone could stand to get a little more "polite" in my opinion. 

 

Very little respect for others point of view in a topic of this nature. 

 

 


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  # 1704144 16-Jan-2017 14:44
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gzt:

 

I assume then that you are now agreeing it was appropriate to print these allegations. I am not familiar with the instance you speak of.

The media has published these and you have been able to form your own opinion of the allegations. Ie; a very similar situation to allegations regarding Kennedy and Clinton.

Then after that, you appear to be encouraging Trump to commit assaults. That really crosses a line if that is your intention.

 

 

 

Posting allegations is one thing but, NZ has a law which allows a person to be accused but also, remain anonymous until such time as guilt or innocence is proved (among other stipulations).  Take for example Michael Jackson and what he was accused of.  Whether he did it or not, the stigma followed him from that day forward.  Some allegations are just damaging by their very nature and unfortunately, there are people who will exploit that.

 

When someone posts and allegation though, it should be more than hear-say and editorial.  Make the complaint and let the courts have it.  Trying someone in the media is the wrong way to support democracy and freedom.

 

No, no... I don't support any aspect of one human taking advantage or exercising leverage over another human.  Absolutely not... it is one thing that really sets me off.  You can bank on that one!


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  # 1704150 16-Jan-2017 14:59
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Also there is only so much influence one person can have on global geopolitics. Yes you could argue that the POTUS is the most powerful position you can hold, but there are even limits of power imposed on a president. And remember the republicans will probably hold most control, most probably more than Trump. 

 

You will find that he will be driven by other forces more than he is able to drive them. 


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  # 1704154 16-Jan-2017 15:06
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darylblake:

 

Also there is only so much influence one person can have on global geopolitics. Yes you could argue that the POTUS is the most powerful position you can hold, but there are even limits of power imposed on a president. And remember the republicans will probably hold most control, most probably more than Trump. 

 

You will find that he will be driven by other forces more than he is able to drive them. 

 

 

 

 

Agreed but, POTUS still holds the power of "Executive Order" which basically gives him a really long reach in multiple directions. It's the very thing that will see Obama's legacy undone.  Overturning an Executive Order is easier than introducing and/or ratifying legislation.  Still though, you're right... there are limits as to what he can do.  That's why there is a split between the Judicial, Legislative, and Executive branches.  A balance of power is quintessential to democracy.


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  # 1704177 16-Jan-2017 15:25
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Geektastic:

 

I might have to nominate this thread for " Most Pointless Thread On Geekzone, Ever."

 

 

 

Trump WILL be president. Our opinions have as much relevance as those of my dogs and nothing short of his death will change him being POTUS between now and his inauguration.

 

Clearly a lot of people are of differing views but, at page 110, we're just running round in circles between the "Yay Trump is POTUS" gang and the "No way should Trump be POTUS" gang.

 

 

I know, right! Should easily win "longest" most pointless thread.





Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


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  # 1704181 16-Jan-2017 15:28
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JimsonWeed:

 

A balance of power is quintessential to democracy.

 

 

'Essential' would be the correct word choice here. A balance of power is essential to democracy. 'Quintessential' is an adjective and doesn't add anything because you can't get more essential than 'essential'. Here is a good example from http://english.stackexchange.com/: 'An essential chocolate cake is one you can't get by without, even if other chocolate cakes are actually better. A quintessential chocolate cake is a perfect example of a chocolate cake, but not necessarily important or needed. – Kate Gregory'





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 


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  # 1704185 16-Jan-2017 15:33
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Rikkitic:

 

JimsonWeed:

 

A balance of power is quintessential to democracy.

 

 

'Essential' would be the correct word choice here. A balance of power is essential to democracy. 'Quintessential' is an adjective and doesn't add anything because you can't get more essential than 'essential'. Here is a good example from http://english.stackexchange.com/: 'An essential chocolate cake is one you can't get by without, even if other chocolate cakes are actually better. A quintessential chocolate cake is a perfect example of a chocolate cake, but not necessarily important or needed. – Kate Gregory'

 

 

 

 

Laddie wants to play semantics with me :)   Hahahahaha...  I'll give it to you, mate :)   I'm not going to split hairs.  It's an adjective to overemphasize the relevance of something. 

 

I like that :)   Another verbal bada$$  :)


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