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  # 1725544 24-Feb-2017 10:07
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I don't agree with the mass deportations as that does not address the root cause why these folk are so desperate to leave their home. Mexico and the US have a responsibility to address this in a moral way.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

There is no planet B

 

 


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  # 1725548 24-Feb-2017 10:14
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MikeB4:

 

Fred99:

 

MikeB4:

 

I don't believe the "rules" and definitions for political leaders apply to Mr Trump, he is not and never will be a politician. He is a showman, a salesman and a risk taker, he is a savvy boardroom operator and knows how to operate in the corporate environment extremely well. He is a very politically naive leader and as such is open to covert management by others and that is apparent and that is the real danger.  I do not consider him a Fascist he more fits the Populist badge.

 

 

You need to research Bannon - not Trump.  Yes - I agree Trump is a populist and a fool.  When I refer to Trump, I really refer to the whole Trumpist thing.  And it is "a thing" which is unprecedented in western democracies for a very long time.

 

Trump (and his antics) is a distraction, a tool for Bannon's alt:right, which is absolutely fascist.

 

 

 

 

I know all about Bannon and others hence "very politically naive leader and as such is open to covert management by others and that is apparent and that is the real danger"  The unelected and those not accountable to the electorate that pose the real threat.

 

 

That includes Putin (and/or other russian "influence") for whatever hold they may have over the US administration.

 

 

 

 


 
 
 
 


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  # 1725550 24-Feb-2017 10:19
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Fred99:

 

That includes Putin (and/or other russian "influence") for whatever hold they may have over the US administration.

 

 

 

 

 

 

My feeling is that Mr Putin holds considerably less influence than Mr Putin believes he has. I feel it is mostly smoke and mirrors.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

There is no planet B

 

 


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  # 1725551 24-Feb-2017 10:21
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MikeB4:

 

I don't agree with the mass deportations as that does not address the root cause why these folk are so desperate to leave their home. Mexico and the US have a responsibility to address this in a moral way.

 

 

Was defined in the once compulsory "Social Studies" curriculum in NZ schools as "the search for El Dorado".

 

Of course compulsory "Social Studies" got canned as part of the NZ curriculum, coinciding with the rise of market ideology.

 

 


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  # 1725558 24-Feb-2017 10:47
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MikeB4:

 

Fred99:

 

That includes Putin (and/or other russian "influence") for whatever hold they may have over the US administration.

 

 

 

 

 

 

My feeling is that Mr Putin holds considerably less influence than Mr Putin believes he has. I feel it is mostly smoke and mirrors.

 

 

I'm not sure - but also stated "and/or other russian influence". 

 

I am very confident that Putin is as clever and cunning as Trump (the person) is stupid and impetuous.

 

Apart from kompromat and/or dirty business deals, Putin is working against constitutional religious freedom, introducing laws to protect the church from criticism.  Now while in theory that would protect other (than christian orthodox) religions from criticism, of course that's not going to happen.  Bad luck for atheists and agnostic - they're open targets.

 

Bannon will like this.  I'm sure he was behind Melania's reciting of the Lord's prayer at Trump's rally. It was a very clever move.


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  # 1725567 24-Feb-2017 11:01
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Many US government functions as well as NZ Government functions start with prayer, blessing, Karakia etc. My time in Government it was common however I refused to do it with any of the teams I managed despite being pressured from above. I don't support as Government and church should be seperate.





Mike
Retired IT Manager. 
The views stated in my posts are my personal views and not that of any other organisation.

 

There is no planet B

 

 


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  # 1725575 24-Feb-2017 11:15
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MikeB4:

 

Many US government functions as well as NZ Government functions start with prayer, blessing, Karakia etc. My time in Government it was common however I refused to do it with any of the teams I managed despite being pressured from above. I don't support as Government and church should be seperate.

 

 

Yes - I agree about separation.  Caution needed before criticising institutional karakia, removing Christian religious reference would have been a great idea that wasn't going to happen in our constitutional monarchy.  You'd p*ss too many people off, royalists, traditionalists, not just churchgoers. TOW affirms the right for karakia, and there's not a valid argument against while Christian ideology gets special mention/privilege.

 

Trumpism (and Putinism) shares something with religion - facts really aren't as important as faith.


 
 
 
 


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  # 1725585 24-Feb-2017 11:34
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Rikkitic:

 

And he has already claimed his first victim. One deportee was so distressed he jumped to his death off the border crossing bridge.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/feb/23/mexican-man-deported-suicide-trump-tijuana

 

 

Aside from the fact that he had been deported 5 times previously, he had only snuck back into the US the day prior to his final deportation. He was not living and working in the USA and rounded up by a Trump good squad and kicked out. The article talks about him working as a gardener in California, but I think that must have been before a previous deportation.

 

I am no fan of Trump, but (the way I read it) this guy was essentially caught entering illegally and rightfully sent back the next day.


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  # 1725747 24-Feb-2017 16:33
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DarthKermit:

 

Just to piss Mexico off even more, he's planning on dumping all the undocumented aliens they remove from the USA, back in Mexico. Regardless of whether or not they are Mexicans.

 

 

Presumably if it's good enough for America to dump undocumented Hondurans and Guatamalans and whatever in Mexico, it's equally good for Mexico to dump undocumented Hondurans and Guatamalans and whatever in the USA. Which is essentially what's happening already, (unofficially) with many Central Americans passing through Mexico en route to the USA).

 

 


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  # 1725751 24-Feb-2017 16:46
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  # 1725754 24-Feb-2017 16:50
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frankv:

 

DarthKermit:

 

Just to piss Mexico off even more, he's planning on dumping all the undocumented aliens they remove from the USA, back in Mexico. Regardless of whether or not they are Mexicans.

 

 

Presumably if it's good enough for America to dump undocumented Hondurans and Guatamalans and whatever in Mexico, it's equally good for Mexico to dump undocumented Hondurans and Guatamalans and whatever in the USA. Which is essentially what's happening already, (unofficially) with many Central Americans passing through Mexico en route to the USA).

 

 

 

 

"Guatemala is the top remittance recipient in Central America as a result of Guatemala's large expatriate community in the US. These inflows are a primary source of foreign income, equivalent to over one-half of the country's exports or one-tenth of its GDP."

 

As if we (in NZ) have much to fear from "MAGA" policies.

 

 


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  # 1725764 24-Feb-2017 16:58
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dclegg:

 

The NRA is calling opposition to Trump "a war".

 

 

Embedded link to the NRA "advertisement":

 

 

Unbelievable?  


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  # 1725767 24-Feb-2017 17:04
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dclegg:

 

The NRA is calling opposition to Trump "a war".

 

 

At some point you just run out of words. I am so grateful I don't live there. 

 

 





I don't think there is ever a bad time to talk about how absurd war is, how old men make decisions and young people die. - George Clooney
 




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  # 1725775 24-Feb-2017 17:19
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Just when you think this whole situation couldn't get any more farcical, it does.

 

I see the man who pulls Trump's strings (Bannon) has been speaking at a rally about their grand plans to conquer the world.

 

If this was a sci fi movie, Trump = Vader and Bannon = The Emperor.

 

Edit: And The NRA = The Stormtroopers.


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  # 1725777 24-Feb-2017 17:56
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Rikkitic:

 

dclegg:

 

The NRA is calling opposition to Trump "a war".

 

 

At some point you just run out of words. I am so grateful I don't live there. 

 

 

 

 

Nothing to worry about...

 

NRA's just a group of 5 million, with about $350 million to spend on "informing the public", a lot of rednecks, with guns, stirred up with fury that the leader of their cult is being undermined and that society is falling apart, and that it's time for them to rally and do their part to "restore order", firstly by releasing a video that the Taliban would be proud to call their own.

 

Madonna should probably up her security though.


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