What will happen to National now?

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#3089832 14-Jun-2023 06:52

gzt:
Imo GE and GM is not a good move for New Zealand, or the National Party. It's going to be unpopular among many primary producers, aka farmers.

Then don't allow GM crops. Or animals, or whatever. But if the farm community is given the choice between crops that require less nitrates or result in less emissions and then still choose to be GE-free, then make it clear that there won't be an ETS exemption.

GE/GMO is a thing and the sooner we embrace it, the better off we'll be. We're pretty clearly not going to be making inroads into our health or productivity through any other meaningful investments so IMO the state has an obligation to unshackle things in this regard.

tdgeek

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#3089837 14-Jun-2023 07:09

GV27:

No, this one is legitimately funny and actually worth making fun of.

I mean their talking about about 'funding Teslas' was pretty shit to begin with, although that's mostly been Bishop and (ugh) Brown pushing that angle.

But it's almost certain this is coming from within the party itself at this point, so something is up.

Your minimising it. He should have ordered the car (good for climate change), declined the $8625 (assuming you can) or donated it to Starship anonymously (so as not to be seen as milking the transaction) Had he got "caught", then he comes up roses, nothing to see here. Just another example that he has no clue and no political nous.

GV27

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#3089962 14-Jun-2023 11:47

tdgeek:

Your minimising it. He should have ordered the car (good for climate change), declined the $8625 (assuming you can) or donated it to Starship anonymously (so as not to be seen as milking the transaction) Had he got "caught", then he comes up roses, nothing to see here. Just another example that he has no clue and no political nous.

I'm not minimizing it, a lot of the crap that gets posted here is low-effort stuff that isn't even actually an issue. The comments about having more kids, for instance, was a total non-event.

I said this one is worth making fun of him for. He's made a cock-up, but the fact this is starting to come out out now as we reach the 'pre-election leader change sweet-spot' is making me think the clock is ticking.

I expect hostile and borderline ridiculous focus on a National leader from the media that goes far and above whatever standard they are prepared to hold the actual government to - regardless of who the National leader actually is - but this is staring to get messy and things will be being said in not-so-hushed tones about whether this is really the horse they want to run with.

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#3089975 14-Jun-2023 12:37

GV27:

I'm not minimizing it, a lot of the crap that gets posted here is low-effort stuff that isn't even actually an issue. The comments about having more kids, for instance, was a total non-event.

I said this one is worth making fun of him for. He's made a cock-up, but the fact this is starting to come out out now as we reach the 'pre-election leader change sweet-spot' is making me think the clock is ticking.

I expect hostile and borderline ridiculous focus on a National leader from the media that goes far and above whatever standard they are prepared to hold the actual government to - regardless of who the National leader actually is - but this is staring to get messy and things will be being said in not-so-hushed tones about whether this is really the horse they want to run with.

Just a cock up, ok, its funny. Not to me, if the potential next PM screw ups can be written off as giggles on a regular basis, its a concern.

I don't see any media difference between how they handle National and Labour, both have been targeted as and when needed. Hostile and borderline ridiculous focus? That's a bit over the top. Should Luxon act more like a Statesman with NZ at his heart, these ongoing discussions about his silly comments and rollbacks would not be happening

GV27

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#3089985 14-Jun-2023 13:27

tdgeek:

Just a cock up, ok, its funny. Not to me, if the potential next PM screw ups can be written off as giggles on a regular basis, its a concern.

It's not just anything. He did something dumb. He should be mocked for it. I'm not 'writing anything off', the only person here suggesting that is you.

tdgeek:

I don't see any media difference between how they handle National and Labour, both have been targeted as and when needed. Hostile and borderline ridiculous focus? That's a bit over the top. Should Luxon act more like a Statesman with NZ at his heart, these ongoing discussions about his silly comments and rollbacks would not be happening

We had daily specials from RNZ on the plight of those in emergency accommodation during the National Govt. Ministers were regularly described as 'not willing to come on' on Checkpoint. Now, you still have no ministers fronting for these things, but that's OK because they don't even get talked about despite being those exact same issue same at best and worst in many, if not most cases. Remember child poverty? Homelessness? Housing affordability? Those are all still problems, you're just not hearing about them all the time anymore.

The reality is the NZ media speak the truth to power only if and when it suits. Otherwise they are picking sides, and they generally pick the same one over and over again.

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#3089987 14-Jun-2023 13:46

GV27:

It's not just anything. He did something dumb. He should be mocked for it. I'm not 'writing anything off', the only person here suggesting that is you.

Minimising yet another faux pas as humourous is pretty much writing it off. IMO. He keeps messing up, so he will be negatively media or others, commented on as always, and as is the case for the other side, that's politics

GV27

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#3089992 14-Jun-2023 14:04

tdgeek:

Minimising yet another faux pas as humourous is pretty much writing it off. IMO. He keeps messing up, so he will be negatively media or others, commented on as always, and as is the case for the other side, that's politics

I have no problems with him getting dragged for this. He deserves.

Some of the other things that have been called 'messing up' are ridiculous.

'It's politics' isn't really a good enough reason for people to keep holding the leader of the opposition to a higher standard than the sitting government of the day that is nearly a complete and total policy and governance failure on all fronts. That's just sheer tribalism.

If I could vote negatively against them both, I would.

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Free kids accounts - trade shares and funds (NZ, US) with Sharesies (affiliate link).

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#3089993 14-Jun-2023 14:16

GV27:

I have no problems with him getting dragged for this. He deserves.

Some of the other things that have been called 'messing up' are ridiculous.

'It's politics' isn't really a good enough reason for people to keep holding the leader of the opposition to a higher standard than the sitting government of the day that is nearly a complete and total policy and governance failure on all fronts. That's just sheer tribalism.

If I could vote negatively against them both, I would.

To be fair, the "messing up" has been a regular number of issues week in and week out. He is supposed to be gunning for leadership, and these instances are becoming a farce, due to volume

If Labour has had a "nearly a complete and total policy and governance failure on all fronts" that will play out in the election.

Everyone in politics is held to account, Luxon doesn't get special or extra treatment, make 5 gaffes expect 5 responses, same for everyone.

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#3090000 14-Jun-2023 14:35

OMG

Asked what reception he's received at the Mystery Creek event, Hipkins responded: "It's been mostly positive. I haven't met anyone who's wet, I haven't met anyone who's whiny, I haven't met anyone who's inward-looking, I haven't met anyone who's really negative."

"Admittedly, I haven't run into Christopher Luxon yet."

A competing person makes the whiny comment, so now the other competing person does the same as a back at yah. This is US politics

Rikkitic

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#3090011 14-Jun-2023 15:06

Pretty good cut though.

Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

GV27

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#3090013 14-Jun-2023 15:11

tdgeek:

To be fair, the "messing up" has been a regular number of issues week in and week out. He is supposed to be gunning for leadership, and these instances are becoming a farce, due to volume

If Labour has had a "nearly a complete and total policy and governance failure on all fronts" that will play out in the election.

Everyone in politics is held to account, Luxon doesn't get special or extra treatment, make 5 gaffes expect 5 responses, same for everyone.

The 'volume' of these farces becomes a lot smaller once you start applying the same level of scrutiny that the current government gets away with. Then it's... well pretty much nothing. Let me know when he's advocating for abandoning basic democratic principles, like some cabinet ministers have been with relatively little fanfare in the last couple of years.

But sure, decontextualising every little thing Luxon says and melting down about is totally the same standard total and complete policy failure that a government with an absolute majority gets away with, because of course it is.

I would be over the moon if the government got held to same standards people are so zealous about holding National too. As long as you do it with your fingers in your ears, it looks like it could be a lot of fun.

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#3090095 14-Jun-2023 18:44

Rikkitic:

Pretty good cut though.

It is

But I've spent a good amount of time in the US, not just at Disneyland, when its about this crap its poor. US dirty laundry politics. Hipkins could have taken the high road but he didnt. I criticise past National leaders as criticise for the sake of it, i.e. Simon and Luxon, but Hipkins is doing the same. Issues and problems are seeming to take a back seat.

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#3090097 14-Jun-2023 18:53

GV27:

The 'volume' of these farces becomes a lot smaller once you start applying the same level of scrutiny that the current government gets away with. Then it's... well pretty much nothing. Let me know when he's advocating for abandoning basic democratic principles, like some cabinet ministers have been with relatively little fanfare in the last couple of years.

But sure, decontextualising every little thing Luxon says and melting down about is totally the same standard total and complete policy failure that a government with an absolute majority gets away with, because of course it is.

I would be over the moon if the government got held to same standards people are so zealous about holding National too. As long as you do it with your fingers in your ears, it looks like it could be a lot of fun.

Maaaaate. Labour has been bagged for 6 years, and going by your recent post has literally done almost nothing. I assume Covid, Covid support measures, Ukraine and global inflation are just a tad annoying?? If Hipkins had been acting as an amateur not in the loop, has no clue that would have been well and truly exposed. Luxon, he's "just" the Opposition leader so it really doesnt matter? But he is also the possible and probable leader, so it does matter.

As we all know, Luxon has been groomed as JK 2.0. IMO he is not JK 0.2. I posted not long ago that Luxon is a liability, I still stand by that and more. Should National win in October, I wont be eating humble pie, I will be buying popcorn. National need a cohesive and knowledgeable leader, pure and simple . Id rather see Simon or Crusher leading right now, and no, Im not taking the p1ss

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#3090124 14-Jun-2023 20:27

GV27: We had daily specials from RNZ on the plight of those in emergency accommodation during the National Govt. Ministers were regularly described as 'not willing to come on' on Checkpoint. Now, you still have no ministers fronting for these things, but that's OK because they don't even get talked about despite being those exact same issue same at best and worst in many, if not most cases. Remember child poverty? Homelessness? Housing affordability? Those are all still problems, you're just not hearing about them all the time anymore.

I expect some of that has eased related to increased emergency accommodation and reduced migration and the like still following on from Covid. Likewise driving around town I can see a fair bit of new construction completed lately and more coming to completion very soon. Some of it is planned social housing, and I'm guessing some of the smaller private developments follow from the cross party planning accord. Even so, I tend to agree. Substantial broadcast followup on those issues of concern is something I've been looking out for and have not noticed.

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#3090136 14-Jun-2023 21:49

gzt:
GV27: We had daily specials from RNZ on the plight of those in emergency accommodation during the National Govt. Ministers were regularly described as 'not willing to come on' on Checkpoint. Now, you still have no ministers fronting for these things, but that's OK because they don't even get talked about despite being those exact same issue same at best and worst in many, if not most cases. Remember child poverty? Homelessness? Housing affordability? Those are all still problems, you're just not hearing about them all the time anymore.

I expect some of that has eased related to increased emergency accommodation and reduced migration and the like still following on from Covid. Likewise driving around town I can see a fair bit of new construction completed lately and more coming to completion very soon. Some of it is planned social housing, and I'm guessing some of the smaller private developments follow from the cross party planning accord. Even so, I tend to agree. Substantial broadcast followup on those issues of concern is something I've been looking out for and have not noticed.

Kainga Ora need to be able to be sued for distress etc etc etc when they fail to move on bad tenants that threaten and harass the neighbours.

They are building new Dixon St flats because they will have all the same problems.

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