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pdh



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#16623 19-Oct-2007 04:25
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Gazing into your crystal balls, any guesses as to our NZ DVB-T set-top boxes having HDMI or component outputs ?

Presumably they will also have S-video or composite down-scaled connections for older AVRs or TVs.

Would there be any advantage – other than the single cable – in feeding the 720p signal via HDMI ?


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  #91634 19-Oct-2007 07:56
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pdh:

Gazing into your crystal balls, any guesses as to our NZ DVB-T set-top boxes having HDMI or component outputs ?

Presumably they will also have S-video or composite down-scaled connections for older AVRs or TVs.

Would there be any advantage – other than the single cable – in feeding the 720p signal via HDMI ?



1. SVideo/Composite will only do 576i

2. If the broadcaster requests HDCP then only the HDMI cable with provide 720p

3. HDMI provides much better quality picture than composite/svideo/component.

Steve




Generally known online as OpenMedia, now working for Red Hat APAC a Technology Evangelist and Product Manager. Still playing with MythTV and digital media on the side.


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  #91638 19-Oct-2007 08:30
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They would be nuts supplying a STB without HDMI in this day and age..




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Old3eyes


 
 
 
 


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  #91647 19-Oct-2007 09:16
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I'll just wait for that chinese clone to enable hi-res through component (until I can afford a 1080p tv for hi-res dvds)

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  #91656 19-Oct-2007 09:52
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old3eyes: They would be nuts supplying a STB without HDMI in this day and age..


Official terrestrial STBs will have HDMI.

Steve




Generally known online as OpenMedia, now working for Red Hat APAC a Technology Evangelist and Product Manager. Still playing with MythTV and digital media on the side.


pdh



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  #91675 19-Oct-2007 11:02
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OK - no real surprises there.

How do you see the audio being treated ? Obviously there should be a feed through the HDMI - not perhaps obvious what flavour will be chosen, or if it will just vary according to source material. HDMI 1.3a can cary a lot of weight - but there are a number of TVs & AVRs already out there with lesser HDMI versions. Interesting.

For those wanting 5/6/7.1 without HDMI, I guess they'll want digital audio and maybe 7x analog as well ?

And then we have the good folks with DVRs... Leaving aside the future success of any HDCP-bypass measures, what will DVRs be looking for in the way of an input cable ? Will SCART still do it ?

The back of the new STBs is going to be busy.

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  #91681 19-Oct-2007 11:27
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I'd expect most Terrestrial STBs to have
  • HDMI
  • Composite
  • Svideo
  • Component
  • Stereo Audio
  • Digital Audio (optical or coax)
On some STBs the composite/svideo/component might be via scart.

Expect to see a mix of AC3 5.1 and MP2 Stereo audio over DTT

Steve




Generally known online as OpenMedia, now working for Red Hat APAC a Technology Evangelist and Product Manager. Still playing with MythTV and digital media on the side.


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  #91705 19-Oct-2007 14:37
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openmedia:
2. If the broadcaster requests HDCP then only the HDMI cable with provide 720p

3. HDMI provides much better quality picture than composite/svideo/component.

Steve


2. - HDCP can be done over DVI, though I doubt anyone will bother.

3. - HDMI offers almost negligable picture improvement over Component and totaly depends on the implimentation of both at both ends. I doubt anyone could tell the difference in a 'blind test' HDMI is more convinient tho carying Audio, it also has more compatability for 1080p tho thats irrelevant for DVB-T.

HDMI 1.3 is rare and irrelevant. No DVB-T will use Dolby TrueHD etc and 1.2 can cary multi channel uncompressed audio anyhow, likiwise the improved bandwidth for video, no display will render it, they struggle with 8bit colour let alone 24.

I'd go with Steve's assesment, adding the HDMI should carry the audio too.

 
 
 
 


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  #91712 19-Oct-2007 15:03
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RobDickinson: [

3. - HDMI offers almost negligable picture improvement over Component and totaly depends on the implimentation of both at both ends. I doubt anyone could tell the difference in a 'blind test' HDMI is more convinient tho carying Audio, it also has more compatability for 1080p tho thats irrelevant for DVB-T.


Afraid I disagree. I've looked at some 720p, 1080i and 1080p material on both 1080 native and 1080 capable screens over both HDMI/DVI and Component. Personally there is a huge difference when dealing with HD source material.

Steve




Generally known online as OpenMedia, now working for Red Hat APAC a Technology Evangelist and Product Manager. Still playing with MythTV and digital media on the side.


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  #91720 19-Oct-2007 15:33
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I guess just a round of the various manufacturers that might supply gear for FreeView certification might give an idea what to expect.


Zinwell and Humax and Kaon.


Note that both boast Composite, Component, and HDMI(HDCP) and also have spdif. Hard to tell if they support any audio over HDMI.

Its a bit hard to find DVB-T mpeg4 decoders, but there are plenty of DVB-S/S2 ones with mpeg4 and all have similar features, other than the tuner. I guess currently in Europe the demand is more for DVB-S/S2 rather than DVB-T.

Cyril

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  #91740 19-Oct-2007 18:01
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RobDickinson:

3. - HDMI offers almost negligable picture improvement over Component and totaly depends on the implimentation of both at both ends. I doubt anyone could tell the difference in a 'blind test' HDMI is more convinient tho carying Audio, it also has more compatability for 1080p tho thats irrelevant for DVB-T.


Isnt Component Video an analog signal?  If you hook up a hi-def DVD player and output via component, are you not sending a converted analog signal to your screen?  Whereas if you send DVI-D or HDMI  you send a digital signal to the screeen thus removing a whole digital-analog-digital conversion process?




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  #91769 20-Oct-2007 10:12
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Regs:
RobDickinson:

3. - HDMI offers almost negligable picture improvement over Component and totaly depends on the implimentation of both at both ends. I doubt anyone could tell the difference in a 'blind test' HDMI is more convinient tho carying Audio, it also has more compatability for 1080p tho thats irrelevant for DVB-T.


Isnt Component Video an analog signal?  If you hook up a hi-def DVD player and output via component, are you not sending a converted analog signal to your screen?  Whereas if you send DVI-D or HDMI  you send a digital signal to the screeen thus removing a whole digital-analog-digital conversion process?



Yes component is analog. But theres very little in the way of dignal loss etc, digital could & probably will look better, but by quite possibly a negligable amount.

And it depends on how both devices impliment each connector. I know people who prefer the component signal over the HDMI for certain devices, its not a cut & dry situation. HDMI is tho way more convinient.

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  #91774 20-Oct-2007 11:25
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RobDickinson:
Regs:
RobDickinson:

3. - HDMI offers almost negligable picture improvement over Component and totaly depends on the implimentation of both at both ends. I doubt anyone could tell the difference in a 'blind test' HDMI is more convinient tho carying Audio, it also has more compatability for 1080p tho thats irrelevant for DVB-T.


Isnt Component Video an analog signal? If you hook up a hi-def DVD player and output via component, are you not sending a converted analog signal to your screen? Whereas if you send DVI-D or HDMI you send a digital signal to the screeen thus removing a whole digital-analog-digital conversion process?



Yes component is analog. But theres very little in the way of dignal loss etc, digital could & probably will look better, but by quite possibly a negligable amount.

And it depends on how both devices impliment each connector. I know people who prefer the component signal over the HDMI for certain devices, its not a cut & dry situation. HDMI is tho way more convinient.


Component tends to look somewhat softer than HDMI which works with some source material. Personally I find the colours aren't as accurate.

Steve




Generally known online as OpenMedia, now working for Red Hat APAC a Technology Evangelist and Product Manager. Still playing with MythTV and digital media on the side.


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  #91780 20-Oct-2007 12:55
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Depends a lot on your setup.  Many plasmas for example wont give you 1:1 pixel mapping over HDMI due to overscan, but the component does, and can look better.  I think digital is not  > analog in every situation.

borgia

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  #91781 20-Oct-2007 13:07
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borgia: Depends a lot on your setup. Many plasmas for example wont give you 1:1 pixel mapping over HDMI due to overscan, but the component does, and can look better. I think digital is not > analog in every situation.

borgia


First of all component = analogue, so there aren't distinct pixels as such.

Secondly I've never seen a plasma that has no overscan on component so I'd be interested to know which models you have looked at.

Lastly most broadcast TV is still designed to overscan. Shame as the amount of overscan on some LCD/Plasma sets i've seen has been as high as 15% rather than 5%

Steve




Generally known online as OpenMedia, now working for Red Hat APAC a Technology Evangelist and Product Manager. Still playing with MythTV and digital media on the side.


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Master Geek


#91786 20-Oct-2007 14:04
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Hmm, I guess you are right, as I was confusing vga with component.  I have a media centre so I guess my analogue is not the same as a hd dvd analogue.  My pioneer is exactly 5% with dvi->hdmi, but dead on with vga (1280x768 vs 1216x730ish)

Ivan

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