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251 posts

Ultimate Geek


# 157265 25-Nov-2014 18:31
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19th December we take ownership of a house that already has UFB connection, the previous owner is with Orcon. We currently have Naked ADSL with Spark.

Today I rang Spark asking if when we move house can we transfer straight to UFB. This was possible but they suggested I transfer my ADSL to the house first, then upgrade to fibre as could be without fibre for 5 working days, this goes right into Xmas period. I can kind of understand the logic here but then they tell me it will be $63 reconnection fee.

So now I'm paying $63 to install ADSL when I don't even want it.

Why do they need 5 working days when the ONT is already installed? Shouldn't they at least waive the $63 since it is for a service that I don't want...

edit: So far dealing with the new Telecom/Spark in the last few years has been a great experience but this is an example of the old 90's Telecom shining through...

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597 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 1182961 25-Nov-2014 19:17
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Well don't get ADSL, it'll cost you money and isn't worth it.

The 5 days sounds more of a telecom issue than a UFB issue as I haven't heard of fibre taking that long to setup when the fibre already exists.




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Stefan Andres Charsley

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Uber Geek
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  # 1182970 25-Nov-2014 19:46
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There have been a number of issues when a house moves between ISPs. If you don't think being without broadband for a while as the LFC sorts it out then just get fibre connected.

As soon as the LFC has sorted the switch over then you get service straight away. I should know as I built the subscriber management system.

It's certainly not a limitation on our side. Experience has shown that being cautious is the right approach.

 
 
 
 




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Ultimate Geek


  # 1183010 25-Nov-2014 21:10
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plambrechtsen: There have been a number of issues when a house moves between ISPs. If you don't think being without broadband for a while as the LFC sorts it out then just get fibre connected.

As soon as the LFC has sorted the switch over then you get service straight away. I should know as I built the subscriber management system.

It's certainly not a limitation on our side. Experience has shown that being cautious is the right approach.




Thanks, I should have mentioned that no broadband at all is not an option.

I agree that being cautious is the right approach but why should I pay $63 to get ADSL connected while I wait for the fibre to be switched over?

Seriously considering moving to Orcon, get fibre from day 1 and no $63 charge to be on ADSL for a month (Spark advised that 5 working days from the 19th would push me into the new year).

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  # 1183011 25-Nov-2014 21:15
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Orcon would not be able to guarantee get you connected to UFB any quicker than Spark (or any other ISP). Moving into properties is a logistical problem both in the copper and UFB world. Until disconnection orders are processed (and people typically don't want to disconnect until the day they move out) it's not possible for new service orders to be lodged which means delays in this scenario are typical.





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  # 1183014 25-Nov-2014 21:21
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if no broadband is not an option, arrange to do what ever it is you need broadband for from another medium, or from a friend or families house

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Uber Geek


  # 1183021 25-Nov-2014 21:47
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Jase2985: if no broadband is not an option, arrange to do what ever it is you need broadband for from another medium, or from a friend or families house


This. Can you survive on 3G for a few days?



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Ultimate Geek


  # 1183030 25-Nov-2014 22:19
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RunningMan:
Jase2985: if no broadband is not an option, arrange to do what ever it is you need broadband for from another medium, or from a friend or families house


This. Can you survive on 3G for a few days?


Sure, at a push. What worried me was when Spark didn't seem confident of getting me connected to fibre before Xmas, so not really until the new year. 2-3 weeks on mobile broadband isn't going to work.

The 19th of December is a Friday, the following Thursday is Xmas... If they had some confidence of getting the fibre connected Monday-Tuesday then that would be fine.

 
 
 
 




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Ultimate Geek


  # 1183033 25-Nov-2014 22:23
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sbiddle: Orcon would not be able to guarantee get you connected to UFB any quicker than Spark (or any other ISP). Moving into properties is a logistical problem both in the copper and UFB world. Until disconnection orders are processed (and people typically don't want to disconnect until the day they move out) it's not possible for new service orders to be lodged which means delays in this scenario are typical.






The CSR implied (perhaps incorrectly) that if the existing connection was Spark then it wouldn't be a problem to have the fibre up and running almost straight away. I'll ring Orcon tomorrow and see what they say.

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Uber Geek


  # 1183048 25-Nov-2014 23:02
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why dont you tell spark to connect your UFB on port 2 of the ONT, so that the last owners connection doesn't matter?





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  # 1183076 26-Nov-2014 06:29
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hamish225: why dont you tell spark to connect your UFB on port 2 of the ONT, so that the last owners connection doesn't matter?


To me it's obvious that all the comments here from people who don't work at ISPs have no idea how UFB works. Knowing that for the most part it's entirely manual on the LFC side and human error mistakes are very frequent.

Feel free to find examples where the second UNI port was activated for another ISP. I think you will struggle to find any since none of the LFCs offer it.

It's not like Spark are saying the OP must get ADSL. It's that the OP said broadband was vitally important to him. Spark said the only way to guarantee service day one is to get DSL installed as it is an automated and well managed process

If it were me I would suck it up and use mobile data to check my emails. As it may get sorted quicker than 5 days. But if broadband is as important as electricity and water then getting a temporary DSL line is something the OP should choose to do.

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  # 1183078 26-Nov-2014 06:45
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If the OP wanted to email me "pl at spark.co.nz" with the new address plus phone number and current account number I can look into it. But the current process is in place for a reason.

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  # 1183082 26-Nov-2014 07:17
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hamish225: why dont you tell spark to connect your UFB on port 2 of the ONT, so that the last owners connection doesn't matter?


Because that's not an option. (It's only started a limited trial phase right now but with a few catches that go with it).



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  # 1183120 26-Nov-2014 08:48
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Internet is pretty much regarded as a utility these days along with power, water, and phone. Can you imagine the chaos if every time you moved house you had to go without water, power, and phone for 5 working days! And if you decide to switch power companies, this can be done without having to resort to candles and a generator for even a minute.
I've always thought it odd that your landline phone is ready to go the day you move, but your internet is going to take 1-2 weeks, even when they are with the same company.
No doubt there are many technical reasons for this, but wouldn't it be great if ISP's were working towards a system that would allow them to operate like the other utilities. 
Could we even dare to think that one day in the future they just might.




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  # 1183151 26-Nov-2014 09:19
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kiwifidget: Internet is pretty much regarded as a utility these days along with power, water, and phone. Can you imagine the chaos if every time you moved house you had to go without water, power, and phone for 5 working days! And if you decide to switch power companies, this can be done without having to resort to candles and a generator for even a minute.
I've always thought it odd that your landline phone is ready to go the day you move, but your internet is going to take 1-2 weeks, even when they are with the same company.
No doubt there are many technical reasons for this, but wouldn't it be great if ISP's were working towards a system that would allow them to operate like the other utilities. 
Could we even dare to think that one day in the future they just might.


A landline suffers from exactly the same issues as broadband - it is no different.

Quite simply, until a person at the property has their disconnection service order completed it's not possible to lodge a new service order against an address. This isn't anything new, it's always been that way.



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  # 1183199 26-Nov-2014 11:10
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sbiddle:
kiwifidget: Internet is pretty much regarded as a utility these days along with power, water, and phone. Can you imagine the chaos if every time you moved house you had to go without water, power, and phone for 5 working days! And if you decide to switch power companies, this can be done without having to resort to candles and a generator for even a minute.
I've always thought it odd that your landline phone is ready to go the day you move, but your internet is going to take 1-2 weeks, even when they are with the same company.
No doubt there are many technical reasons for this, but wouldn't it be great if ISP's were working towards a system that would allow them to operate like the other utilities. 
Could we even dare to think that one day in the future they just might.


A landline suffers from exactly the same issues as broadband - it is no different.

Quite simply, until a person at the property has their disconnection service order completed it's not possible to lodge a new service order against an address. This isn't anything new, it's always been that way.


And more importantly providing internet service is completely different and vastly more complex that providing core utilities such as Water/Power/Gas et al. With Water/Power/Gas it's "just a number" being the number of units the previous tenant used and where you start that the loosing and gaining retail providers need to agree on and the entire service is provided by the wholesaler to a lesser or greater extent.

Internet there is the customer IP Address management + local BNG + National and international connectivity + copyright compliance + billing + everything else needed.

To have a statement like "it should just be like power" completely disregards any of the technical complexities with providing internet.


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