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Rikkitic
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  #2153173 2-Jan-2019 12:24
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I grew up in the 1950s. This was before plastic supermarket bags existed. Yet somehow people managed to get through their daily shopping needs without them. How monumentally tough those brave pioneers must have been!

 

 





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dafman
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  #2153186 2-Jan-2019 14:39
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rugrat:

 

It’s not a minimally inconveniencing thing when don’t have own bag.

 

When have own bag fine, but I don’t plan every purchase, and I don’t take the car with me on every trip.

I can see times when I’ll have to for go buying stuff as have no way of carrying it, unless shops come up with alternative cheap bag alternative.

I know the reusable bags won’t be thrown away as often but I saw one on the road the other day.

 

If you plan on going shopping and not taking your car, then take a bag with you when you head out. Thinking ahead, it's not difficult.

 

Anyway, just back from a New World shop on the first day of no more single use bags. Apart from one tattered re-used Countdown plastic bag, everyone else were using non-plastic reusable bags. I saw one staff member packing a paper bag, so presumably this is an option as well. On my way in, a kid walked out holding two cans of coke - last week he would have been carrying a plastic bag with two cans of coke inside.

 

No discernible riots. I double checked outside: sky not falling and no plague of frogs. Early days, but I reckon we are going to survive this one (-;


vexxxboy
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  #2153189 2-Jan-2019 14:52
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i have shopped at paknsave for 30 odd years and have never brought a plastic bag or used my own bags at the store , they are set up so you dont need bags, just a trolley and some baskets in your boot to put things in. i now buy my plastic bags and i use the same amount as before they are just not free anymore. I didnt use any plastic bags before our council switched from big paper rubbish bags to those plastic bins and i need something to transfer my rubbish out to the bins and even Countdown have said the sale of plastic bags has increased a lot since the ban took hold. so swings and roundabouts.





Common sense is not as common as you think.




rugrat
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  #2153260 2-Jan-2019 15:20
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dafman:

rugrat:


It’s not a minimally inconveniencing thing when don’t have own bag.


When have own bag fine, but I don’t plan every purchase, and I don’t take the car with me on every trip.

I can see times when I’ll have to for go buying stuff as have no way of carrying it, unless shops come up with alternative cheap bag alternative.

I know the reusable bags won’t be thrown away as often but I saw one on the road the other day.


If you plan on going shopping and not taking your car, then take a bag with you when you head out. Thinking ahead, it's not difficult.


Anyway, just back from a New World shop on the first day of no more single use bags. Apart from one tattered re-used Countdown plastic bag, everyone else were using non-plastic reusable bags. I saw one staff member packing a paper bag, so presumably this is an option as well. On my way in, a kid walked out holding two cans of coke - last week he would have been carrying a plastic bag with two cans of coke inside.


No discernible riots. I double checked outside: sky not falling and no plague of frogs. Early days, but I reckon we are going to survive this one (-;



The thing is I don’t plan on going shopping, I’m just out for a walk.
So every walk now I’m expected to squash a bag in my pocket just in case.

Nah not going to happen, most supermarket visits are planned so can handle that one, but if I see clothes or electronics at a shop that gets my eye.... it includes all shops not just supermarkets.

If they come up with paper bags or something fine, it doesn’t have to be plastic.

Sky is not falling, just it’s going to be inconvient at times, there was a time that cars didn’t exist and people lived out their lives then too.

marej
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  #2153265 2-Jan-2019 15:42

Rikkitic:

 

I grew up in the 1950s. This was before plastic supermarket bags existed. Yet somehow people managed to get through their daily shopping needs without them. How monumentally tough those brave pioneers must have been!

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think its worth adding some context here.  I get you have you your view that this is part of a solution to a big problem.  In the 1950s and for a few decades beyond that, people bought their fruit and veg, booze, butchery items from separate stores.  Milk was delivered.  These stores wrapped up your stuff and put it in a box and customers walked out to their cars parked nearby.....nice and handy to where they shopped, so no real hassle.   Fruit and vege shops had paper bags.  Over time supermarkets expanded to include butcheries, bakerys, delicatessants, stationnery suppliers, alcohol outlets etc, and with it came the plastic bags.  It was a massive single place to get all your pantry needs in one shop and they will pack it all for  you in nice never used before plastic bags, and you could wheel your trolley out to your vehicle in the nicely organised carpark. No more separate trips and very hard for the butcheries etc to complete and so many of those small stores have closed and we wont see them or their paper bags and boxes again.  Shop owners often did deliveries for the elderley as well and they had a 'tab'.

 

Referring back to the 1950s is one thing, but when all else is not equal..........


gzt

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  #2153308 2-Jan-2019 16:13
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Large square bottom paper bags were used by supermarkets at that time.

TwoSeven
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  #2153309 2-Jan-2019 16:15
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marej:

Rikkitic:


I grew up in the 1950s. This was before plastic supermarket bags existed. Yet somehow people managed to get through their daily shopping needs without them. How monumentally tough those brave pioneers must have been!


 



 


I think its worth adding some context here.  I get you have you your view that this is part of a solution to a big problem.  In the 1950s and for a few decades beyond that, people bought their fruit and veg, booze, butchery items from separate stores.  Milk was delivered.  These stores wrapped up your stuff and put it in a box and customers walked out to their cars parked nearby.....nice and handy to where they shopped, so no real hassle.   Fruit and vege shops had paper bags.  Over time supermarkets expanded to include butcheries, bakerys, delicatessants, stationnery suppliers, alcohol outlets etc, and with it came the plastic bags.  It was a massive single place to get all your pantry needs in one shop and they will pack it all for  you in nice never used before plastic bags, and you could wheel your trolley out to your vehicle in the nicely organised carpark. No more separate trips and very hard for the butcheries etc to complete and so many of those small stores have closed and we wont see them or their paper bags and boxes again.  Shop owners often did deliveries for the elderley as well and they had a 'tab'.


Referring back to the 1950s is one thing, but when all else is not equal..........



I think this is a rathey myopic view of the past and doesnt take into the technology of the present.

Plastic bags didnt become popular until the 80s and supermarkets were around - Woolworths being one of them. Paper bags didnt have handles on them like they do now. I can remember when doing the shopping, the paper bags stacked neatly in the trolly.

People forget technology exists - these days paper bags can have quite complex designs, strong flat bases and robust handles etc. they can also be made a lot cheaper now than ever before.

I believe the phase out of single use plastic bags was part of the UNCCC/COP23 - it isnt only this country.

My feeling is that it will take a year or two for the supermarkets to refine the bag designs to regain the knowledge lost from the past.





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Rikkitic
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  #2153311 2-Jan-2019 16:20
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Actually, supermarkets existed in the 1950s, at least in some places. In fact, the first one opened in 1916. Plastic bags came later, as did the problems they caused. Getting all your stuff in one place does not mean it has to come with plastic. Supermarkets also used to have 'bag boys', who put your shopping into paper bags for you and brought it to your car. Yes, times have changed, but none of those changes require the use of plastic bags.

 

 





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MikeB4
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  #2153318 2-Jan-2019 16:42
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@Rikkitic I have surrendered trying on GZ about anything environmental or protecting wildlife. It's a case of none so blind......

amiga500
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  #2153322 2-Jan-2019 16:44
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I've used re-usable bags for at least the last ten years so I have no problem with this.   However what is this ban really going to achieve?  It will stop oil being used to make plastic bags - surely far less harmful than burning the stuff as petrol, diesel, or Jet A1, etc.  The huge majority of those single use bags finished up in landfill not in the ocean.   Meanwhile all the oil industry experts seem to be predicting that oil will stay down in price for 2019 as Opec, Russia and others don't want to cut production.  So with cheaper oil and petrol people will use their cars more, do more overseas flights and have a far greater impact on the climate and ecological system than the tiny percentage of plastic bags getting into the ocean.  For example, if petrol was at $2.60 a litre how much enthusiasm would there have been by the boy racers to do their 4 avenues invasion stuff in Christchurch a few days ago?  It will make people feel good and virtuous though.

 

Another example of a mobilisation of the populace towards a common goal was in Britain during WW2.   They ran a campaign for people to bring spare pots and pans to make Spitfires.   Hardly any of the pots and pans brought to collection centres was the right type of high quality aluminium that would have been any use at all to the war effort - but it made people feel they were doing their bit while in fact they were only creating another problem with the mounds of useless scrap metal.

 

 


rugrat
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  #2153323 2-Jan-2019 16:47
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Happy Chappie, just got back from Fresh Choice.

Low and behold out of habit forgot reusable bag, they sold me a paper bag for 20 cents, 2 handles to hold it by and looks like it may hold slightly more then plastic bag as twice the height.

Back to old paper bag days it is, long live the 🐢 (turtle)

Zippity
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  #2153329 2-Jan-2019 16:53
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What pisses me off is the fact that 80% or more of the grocery items we purchase are packaged in plastic.

 

 

 

PC madness at its best!!


Rikkitic
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  #2153370 2-Jan-2019 17:05
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amiga500:

 

I've used re-usable bags for at least the last ten years so I have no problem with this.   However what is this ban really going to achieve?  It will stop oil being used to make plastic bags - surely far less harmful than burning the stuff as petrol, diesel, or Jet A1, etc.  The huge majority of those single use bags finished up in landfill not in the ocean.   Meanwhile all the oil industry experts seem to be predicting that oil will stay down in price for 2019 as Opec, Russia and others don't want to cut production.  So with cheaper oil and petrol people will use their cars more, do more overseas flights and have a far greater impact on the climate and ecological system than the tiny percentage of plastic bags getting into the ocean.  For example, if petrol was at $2.60 a litre how much enthusiasm would there have been by the boy racers to do their 4 avenues invasion stuff in Christchurch a few days ago?  It will make people feel good and virtuous though.

 

Another example of a mobilisation of the populace towards a common goal was in Britain during WW2.   They ran a campaign for people to bring spare pots and pans to make Spitfires.   Hardly any of the pots and pans brought to collection centres was the right type of high quality aluminium that would have been any use at all to the war effort - but it made people feel they were doing their bit while in fact they were only creating another problem with the mounds of useless scrap metal.

 

 

 

 

Honestly, I don't understand the point of posts like this. What are you saying - that no-one should try to do anything because it only has symbolic value? My earlier point was that at least it's a start, even if only a false start. It raises public awareness of the issue and  - who knows? - possibly even does a tiny bit of good. What is the problem with that? More important, what alternative do you propose? If you think the ban is a wasted effort, what have you got that is better? What is the point of undermining a well-intentioned effort if you don't have anything else to put in its place?

 

 





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Rikkitic
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  #2153372 2-Jan-2019 17:06
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Zippity:

 

What pisses me off is the fact that 80% or more of the grocery items we purchase are packaged in plastic.

 

 

 

PC madness at its best!!

 

 

Pisses me off as well. Still no reason to cart it home in a plastic bag. Maybe next year, or the year after, something will start to be done about all that packaging. It has to begin somewhere.

 

 





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davidcole
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  #2153395 2-Jan-2019 17:30
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Rikkitic:

Zippity:


What pisses me off is the fact that 80% or more of the grocery items we purchase are packaged in plastic.


 


PC madness at its best!!



Pisses me off as well. Still no reason to cart it home in a plastic bag. Maybe next year, or the year after, something will start to be done about all that packaging. It has to begin somewhere.


 



And while supermarkets used to take their junk packaging plastic back, with the ban coming in force yesterday all our local have taken it upon themselves to reverse soft plastics recycling bins.

So we need to start leaving it at the checkouts so they get the message.




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