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oldbusdriver
45 posts

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  #2251544 4-Jun-2019 21:13
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I stumbled on this discussion by accident and wonder if any of you have done any serious reading on the subject.

 

When you have read, understood and made your decision about the attached article, get back to me.

 

Until then, keep warm, it is getting cold this winter.

 

 

 

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/06/03/reporting-the-fraudulent-practices-behind-global-warming-science/

 

 

 

 


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Talkiet
4574 posts

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  #2251588 4-Jun-2019 21:27
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oldbusdriver:

 

I stumbled on this discussion by accident and wonder if any of you have done any serious reading on the subject.

 

When you have read, understood and made your decision about the attached article, get back to me.

 

Until then, keep warm, it is getting cold this winter.

 

 

 

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/06/03/reporting-the-fraudulent-practices-behind-global-warming-science/

 

 

SMH.

 

We really need a section here just for conspiracy theories.

 

N.

 

 





--

 

Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


Fred99
13684 posts

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  #2251597 4-Jun-2019 21:38
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oldbusdriver:

 

I stumbled on this discussion by accident and wonder if any of you have done any serious reading on the subject.

 

When you have read, understood and made your decision about the attached article, get back to me.

 

Until then, keep warm, it is getting cold this winter.

 

 

 

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/06/03/reporting-the-fraudulent-practices-behind-global-warming-science/

 

 

 

 

 

 

If you expect me to read a blog entry in climate change denial website, written by a nutcase conservative politician unqualified on the subject, then think again.

 

He's a charlatan - best ignored.




Rikkitic
Awrrr
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  #2251604 4-Jun-2019 21:49
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oldbusdriver:

 

I stumbled on this discussion by accident and wonder if any of you have done any serious reading on the subject.

 

When you have read, understood and made your decision about the attached article, get back to me.

 

Until then, keep warm, it is getting cold this winter.

 

 

 

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/06/03/reporting-the-fraudulent-practices-behind-global-warming-science/

 

 

 

 

 

 

More reactionary BS. A favoured tactic of right-wing psuedo-intellectuals is to kill argument by overwhelming with an avalanche of spurious 'facts' and 'figures' and other supposed data that takes forever to verify. The great majority of real scientists in the world agree that climate change is a very real threat. But of course you know better. Enjoy the floods, famine, tornadoes and tropical plagues about to come your way. 

 

 





Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

 


 


Geektastic
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  #2251615 4-Jun-2019 22:05
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Mistenfuru:

Geektastic: Why is it important whether humanity survives or not?


I think Elon Musk put it best, "We have a duty to protect the light of consciousness"



You'd need an ego the size of a planet to think that.





Aredwood
3885 posts

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  #2251689 5-Jun-2019 02:17
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Rikkitic:

nzrock:


the point i am trying to make is that the suns ability to effect our climate is magnitudes greater than what man can do (except by nuking the planet) but you never here the sun mentioned by any climate scientist.



It is hard to take you seriously but I will try to give you the benefit of the doubt. Most scientists and other rational people believe anthropogenic climate change is real. A few dissenters and some uninformed people dispute that. Those who question climate change seem to think there is some kind of vast scientific conspiracy to convince us there is a problem when there isn't. I think that is silly but I guess people are free to believe that if they want to.


Yes, the sun has cycles and solar activity goes up and down and of course this influences life on the earth. Hell, the seasons do that. Crops grow in summer and die in winter. That is normal and natural. 


The point is, we can't do much about what the sun gets up to, except pray it doesn't go nova on us. What is the point in mentioning it? It is what it is and will do what it does. The sun is beyond our ability to influence it. Nor do we really need to. Life on earth has functioned fine with the sun as it is for billions of years.


Human industrial activity is another matter. The effect of that is real and measurable. We know how it has added carbon to the atmosphere and now we are starting to experience the effects of that. Research strongly suggests that this will lead to catastrophic changes if allowed to continue on the current course. 


Several years ago science discovered that chemicals known as CFCs were destroying atmospheric ozone and creating a hole that was allowing harmful radiation through. New Zealand was particularly affected by this. At the time there was no Internet, no trolls, no conspiracy theories. Everyone agreed that CFCs were bad and they were banned. This stands as an example of one of the most successful international agreements ever made. There was a danger, it was recognised, and steps were taken to remedy it. Since then the ozone hole has been shrinking. A great result.


Something like this needs to happen with carbon. Unfortunately that affects a lot more people in a lot more ways than banning CFCs did, so there is a lot more opposition to it. Some are desperate to make the issue go away by pretending it doesn't really exist. That is a lot easier than drastically changing our lifestyles and economic system.


What it comes down to is that we cannot affect what the sun does, but we certainly can change what we do. That is what it is about.


 


 


 



CFCs were easily banned. As alternative refrigerant gasses were developed, allowing everyone to continue to enjoy refrigeration and air conditioning.

And of course, large companies were only too happy to sell you a new fridge, air conditioning system etc. When you could no longer regas your old unit, without having to pay to have it converted to a newer gas.

Ozone hole (almost) fixed, without any reduction in living standards.

But there are no workable alternatives to fossil fuel emissions, without everyone having to suffer a big drop in living standards. Sure, there are little things that everyone can do. But they are little things. (especially when you include air travel and overseas manufactured goods)

Is anyone here willing to make a big sacrifice to their own living standards, just to reduce carbon emissions? I'm definitely not myself, and I doubt that anyone else would be willing as well.

As for domestic natural gas usage. The government actually needs to build more renewable generation. As burning Natural gas at your house is still far more efficient than burning coal in a power station. But the Green party is on the record for opposing large scale hydro generation. And it was the Helen Clark Labour/ Green government that introduced the electricity low user regulations. Which are the reason why domestic Natural gas and LPG are cheaper than electricity for most people.

Labour/ Greens are not willing to admit that they were wrong. Meaning that politics is more important than helping reduce carbon emissions.






nzrock
113 posts

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  #2251704 5-Jun-2019 05:18
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As I tried to outline in my original post there is a fatal flaw in the current climate change models.
below is a link to a you tube video by Ben Davidson. It explains the flaw much more clearly than i could ever do.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYoOcaqCzxo&fbclid=IwAR1CsRShg0sILIooCt7Mz0zpu4U7xmtVzjlgDMqryTBc0X0F_3uuymdn7lM

 


a wise man once said
a man with a closed mind will disagree with anything that does not align with his point of view, whereas a man with an open mind will investigate all possibilities until his own research proves otherwise.




Dratsab
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  #2251707 5-Jun-2019 06:32
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Geektastic:

 

Mistenfuru:

 

Geektastic: Why is it important whether humanity survives or not?

 

I think Elon Musk put it best, "We have a duty to protect the light of consciousness" 



You'd need an ego the size of a planet to think that.

 

And there he is, with a pain in the diodes down his left side, parking cars. [/depressed voice]


Dratsab
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  #2251709 5-Jun-2019 06:38
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nzrock:

 

As I tried to outline in my original post there is a fatal flaw in the current climate change models.
below is a link to a you tube video by Ben Davidson. It explains the flaw much more clearly than i could ever do.

 

Ah, someone who's making a nice living out of promoting the heck out of conspiracy theories to all the people out there stupid enough to believe them...


tdgeek
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  #2251713 5-Jun-2019 07:14
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oldbusdriver:

 

I stumbled on this discussion by accident and wonder if any of you have done any serious reading on the subject.

 

When you have read, understood and made your decision about the attached article, get back to me.

 

Until then, keep warm, it is getting cold this winter.

 

 

 

https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/06/03/reporting-the-fraudulent-practices-behind-global-warming-science/

 

 

 

 

 

 

I expect many of us have. When you have, get back to us


Geektastic
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  #2251734 5-Jun-2019 08:34
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If you want a simple thing to do, Air NZ offer the opportunity to fly carbon neutral by adding a calculated amount that will be used to pay for planting trees to offset your flight. A return to London via LAX is $111 on top of the fare to offset.






eracode
Smpl Mnmlst
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  #2251741 5-Jun-2019 08:48
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Geektastic:

If you want a simple thing to do, Air NZ offer the opportunity to fly carbon neutral by adding a calculated amount that will be used to pay for planting trees to offset your flight. A return to London via LAX is $111 on top of the fare to offset.



So you do that?




Sometimes I just sit and think. Other times I just sit.


NzBeagle
936 posts

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  #2251748 5-Jun-2019 08:57
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Geektastic:

 

If you want a simple thing to do, Air NZ offer the opportunity to fly carbon neutral by adding a calculated amount that will be used to pay for planting trees to offset your flight. A return to London via LAX is $111 on top of the fare to offset.

 

 

What's the uptake on this I wonder ...


Rikkitic
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  #2251749 5-Jun-2019 08:58
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The thing is, every time you drill down into one of those anti-fluoride anti-vaccination ant-climate change links, they all take you to pretty much the same place, which is usually some alt-right alt-fact conspiracy site where two or three extremists create a veneer of authenticity by quoting each other's drivel back and forth until it seems like there is a mass of 'evidence' supporting their particular fantasy.

 

The vituperous viscount is not really any different in this respect, though he is able to generate a degree of credibility due to his created-especially-for-him title and past role in the British government. He is also able to mix some actual facts into his rants, making it seem like he actually has a point and actually knows what he is talking about. Oh, and lots of graphs and mathematical formulae to dazzle the ignorant. 

 

Here is a point by point refutation of many of Monckton's lies and distortions. And this is a  point by point refutation by the very scientists he has cited. The overwhelming majority of reputable scientists throughout the world, whether that is 97% or not, say that anthropogenic climate change is real. You can choose to believe them, as I do, or you can join Alice in the rabbit hole and believe that it is all some vast conspiracy to benefit a secret society of green fascists out to take over the world.

 

 





Plesse igmore amd axxept applogies in adbance fir anu typos

 


 


Talkiet
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  #2251780 5-Jun-2019 09:32
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nzrock:

 

As I tried to outline in my original post there is a fatal flaw in the current climate change models.
below is a link to a you tube video by Ben Davidson. It explains the flaw much more clearly than i could ever do.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NYoOcaqCzxo&fbclid=IwAR1CsRShg0sILIooCt7Mz0zpu4U7xmtVzjlgDMqryTBc0X0F_3uuymdn7lM

 


a wise man once said
a man with a closed mind will disagree with anything that does not align with his point of view, whereas a man with an open mind will investigate all possibilities until his own research proves otherwise.

 

 

Googled his name. Won't be watching that rubbish.

 

N





--

 

Please note all comments are the product of my own brain and don't necessarily represent the position or opinions of my employer, previous employers, colleagues, friends or pets.


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