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187 posts

Master Geek


#143630 21-Apr-2014 21:35
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Hi,

Does anyone know if anything has changes with the streaming protocols for TVNZ on Demand in the last month or two?

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gzt

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  #1028793 21-Apr-2014 22:14
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Did something break?

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  #1028814 21-Apr-2014 22:39
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Not sure about tvnz, but I had heard that some on demand type services maybe implementing paywalls in the near future, which may require changes in the way it is being delivered. I do recall originall tvnz did charge years ago when it was first introduced, but that was removed.

 
 
 
 


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Ultimate Geek


  #1028821 21-Apr-2014 23:01
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I doubt they will move to a paid system as their revenue comes from advertisement, no one will use their service if it becomes paid.




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Stefan Andres Charsley

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Ultimate Geek


  #1028830 21-Apr-2014 23:18
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I don't use it even without a paywall. It barely ever works and the quality isn't great.

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Ultimate Geek


  #1028832 21-Apr-2014 23:20
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benokobi: I don't use it even without a paywall. It barely ever works and the quality isn't great.


I never have a problem with it and quality is reasonable. Try changing the quality setting to 1500. If it spends too long loading then your internet isn't capable of handling the demands and you should look at your options for upgrading.




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Stefan Andres Charsley

824 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #1028833 21-Apr-2014 23:24
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I can handle everything else.

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  #1028836 21-Apr-2014 23:50
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benokobi: I don't use it even without a paywall. It barely ever works and the quality isn't great.

 

A lot of people use it on mobile devices, so a lot of people use on demand services, and have got into a habit where they may now be prepared to pay. I can see them charging for the app version, and the website version remaining free. People say the same thing about online papers, but that hasn't stopped them slowly moving that way. Most app versions of papers and mags on mobile devices are now paid subscriptions, so the mobile platform is what is being used to monetize the services.

 
 
 
 


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  #1028847 22-Apr-2014 01:45
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charsleysa:
I never have a problem with it and quality is reasonable. Try changing the quality setting to 1500. If it spends too long loading then your internet isn't capable of handling the demands and you should look at your options for upgrading.


Both TVNZ and TV3 streaming quality even at its highest setting is seriously wanting.
TV3s highest quality setting of 1465kbps gives me a picture quality setting comparable to youtube 360p yet it often sutters during playback.
I have plenty of bandwidth and can happily stream 720 or 1080 content from youtube, and don't get any buffering issues from any major streaming companies.
TVNZ seems better than TV3 in regards to reliability but its picture quality certainly couldn't be called "good"

597 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #1028849 22-Apr-2014 02:05
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farcus:
charsleysa:
I never have a problem with it and quality is reasonable. Try changing the quality setting to 1500. If it spends too long loading then your internet isn't capable of handling the demands and you should look at your options for upgrading.


Both TVNZ and TV3 streaming quality even at its highest setting is seriously wanting.
TV3s highest quality setting of 1465kbps gives me a picture quality setting comparable to youtube 360p yet it often sutters during playback.
I have plenty of bandwidth and can happily stream 720 or 1080 content from youtube, and don't get any buffering issues from any major streaming companies.
TVNZ seems better than TV3 in regards to reliability but its picture quality certainly couldn't be called "good"


Please do note that in order to keep such a low bitrate of 1500 kbps extreme compression is used and is indeed a good quality video for the amount of compression it goes through. The stuttering is caused by either your computer not being able to handle the decompression or your internet connection being able to handle the throughout.

It's more likely that your computer can't handle the aggressive decompression. There are so many factors that come into play when streaming video such as on demand TV, especially since it uses a different streaming method than YouTube (as far as I know, YouTube downloads the video and is technically not streaming in the strict sense of the word, while on demand is not downloading the video, it is streaming).

Streaming video is quite a big topic and I invite you to spend some time understanding some of the differences between types of streaming.




Regards
Stefan Andres Charsley

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  #1028865 22-Apr-2014 02:39
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charsleysa:

Please do note that in order to keep such a low bitrate of 1500 kbps extreme compression is used and is indeed a good quality video for the amount of compression it goes through. The stuttering is caused by either your computer not being able to handle the decompression or your internet connection being able to handle the throughout.

It's more likely that your computer can't handle the aggressive decompression. There are so many factors that come into play when streaming video such as on demand TV, especially since it uses a different streaming method than YouTube (as far as I know, YouTube downloads the video and is technically not streaming in the strict sense of the word, while on demand is not downloading the video, it is streaming).

Streaming video is quite a big topic and I invite you to spend some time understanding some of the differences between types of streaming.


both TVNZ and TV3 encode using H264. They should be able to provide a much better quality video that can be streamed over an adsl connection without stuttering.
(my connection is a 100 down / 50 up fiber connection on a high spec computer)
H264 encoding at 1500kbps would not be considered low - it should provide a pretty good quality output.

I can assure you that my internet connection and computer system are not the reason for stuttering.

Of course Youtube is streaming video - it is perhaps in many instances cached to a local server by a users isp - but that is still streaming content . . . and in any case, youtube is just one example. I have no problem with other streaming services that are not cached by local isps.

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Ultimate Geek


  #1028866 22-Apr-2014 02:45
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farcus:
charsleysa:

Please do note that in order to keep such a low bitrate of 1500 kbps extreme compression is used and is indeed a good quality video for the amount of compression it goes through. The stuttering is caused by either your computer not being able to handle the decompression or your internet connection being able to handle the throughout.

It's more likely that your computer can't handle the aggressive decompression. There are so many factors that come into play when streaming video such as on demand TV, especially since it uses a different streaming method than YouTube (as far as I know, YouTube downloads the video and is technically not streaming in the strict sense of the word, while on demand is not downloading the video, it is streaming).

Streaming video is quite a big topic and I invite you to spend some time understanding some of the differences between types of streaming.


both TVNZ and TV3 encode using H264. They should be able to provide a much better quality video that can be streamed over an adsl connection without stuttering.
(my connection is a 100 down / 50 up fiber connection on a high spec computer)

I can assure you that my internet connection and computer system are not the reason for stuttering.

Of course Youtube is streaming video - it is perhaps in many instances cached to a local server by a users isp - but that is still streaming content . . . and in any case, youtube is just one example. I have no problem with other streaming services that are not cached by local isps.


As I have said, I invite you to learn about the differences in streaming types.

Real streaming is not utilized by YouTube. They utilize a form of streaming that makes it appear to be streaming but is actually downloading it and temporarily caching it locally.




Regards
Stefan Andres Charsley

1051 posts

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  #1028867 22-Apr-2014 02:56
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charsleysa:

As I have said, I invite you to learn about the differences in streaming types.

Real streaming is not utilized by YouTube. They utilize a form of streaming that makes it appear to be streaming but is actually downloading it and temporarily caching it locally.


I'm not going to get into a debate here about who knows what (I'm very comfortable with my years of acquired knowledge about video compression technology).
As I said, youtube is just one example.
The indisputable fact is that both TVNZ and TV3s streamed content is of a poorer quality than it needs to (and should) be.

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Ultimate Geek


  #1028868 22-Apr-2014 03:04
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farcus:
charsleysa:

As I have said, I invite you to learn about the differences in streaming types.

Real streaming is not utilized by YouTube. They utilize a form of streaming that makes it appear to be streaming but is actually downloading it and temporarily caching it locally.


I'm not going to get into a debate here about who knows what (I'm very comfortable with my years of acquired knowledge about video compression technology).
As I said, youtube is just one example.
The indisputable fact is that both TVNZ and TV3s streamed content is of a poorer quality than it needs to (and should) be.


Well your indisputable fact is disputable as the quality for 1500 kbps is of acceptable standard for that bit rate. If you would let them to offer higher bitrates then you should contact them about it but I wouldn't be surprised if the reason they don't offer it is due to licensing or cost.

There are a variety of reasons as to why your videos stutter but considering you have not mentioned any information other than your connection speed and the issue, it's safe to assume that the fault lies within your computer.




Regards
Stefan Andres Charsley

1051 posts

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  #1028871 22-Apr-2014 03:14
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charsleysa:

There are a variety of reasons as to why your videos stutter but considering you have not mentioned any information other than your connection speed and the issue, it's safe to assume that the fault lies within your computer.


assume all you like wink



187 posts

Master Geek


  #1028905 22-Apr-2014 08:14
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My question was related to how they stream or how they deliver their content... not what quality they deliver it at...

All the tools that used to work for me to download and watch later have stopped working.

i.e. StreamTransport ( http://www.streamtransport.com/web-video-downloader/) or GetFLV (www.getflv.net) or TubeDigger (http://www.tubedigger.com/)

All the programs now just crash when trying to detect and download the stream...

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