Following "zero downtime" steps to transfer a domain to a new registrar has resulted in downtime :-(

Forums › IT Pro and developers › Following "zero downtime" steps to transfer a domain to a new registrar has resulted in downtime :-(

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michaelmurfy

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#2907684 27-Apr-2022 20:25

Baboon: Metaname is the only registrar I've used over the years, out of about a dozen, that has a different convention for inputting zone records. And no email or web provider I've ever used has handed out their DNS record info in the format Metaname insists upon.

They follow RFC1035 which is actually _the_ standard... https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc1035

This same standard is in-use by DNS servers (such as Bind, which they likely use for their DNS server). Most sites automatically add the trailing dot as stated above but Metaname also do make this clear on their DNS management page:

Names that are fully-qualified such as www.meowied.nz. or ghs.google.com. should have a trailing dot

Michael Murphy | https://murfy.nz
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fe31nz

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#2907764 28-Apr-2022 00:37

Metaname have a test server where you can try out your new setup and make sure it works before you put it on their real systems. I found that very useful.

mattwnz

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#2907768 28-Apr-2022 01:04

If you were only transferring the NZ domain without also changing the DNS and nameservers, then it should have transferred quickly and easily with zero downtime. But you were also transferring the DNS hosting service too. So you were moving two things, and it was the DNS that was the problem. It can be handy to use a professional to transfer DNS hosting for you, especially as different DNS hosting services and settings can be quite different.. Also although some providers may free DNS hosting, as it is often free they may not provide much support with it and customisation.
It maybe an idea not to use the free DNS hosting from the same company that registers the domain, as it can complicate transferring a domain if you also have to transfer the DNS hosting service at the same time. I had a problem a few years ago transferring from a NZ register who immediately cancelled the DNS hosting as soon as the domain transferred resulting in downtime until the domain started loading from the new nameservers..

Baboon

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#2907780 28-Apr-2022 07:04

I'm not going to hire someone to enter a wee amount of DNS records to another DNS host. Not when it's been simple and hassle-free with a dozen other companies in the past. And there's no good reason it shouldn't be so again.

And avoiding downtime was precisely the point, see my original post on page 1.

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BlakJak

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#2907783 28-Apr-2022 07:27

So... You failed to read the support documentation provided by the vendor, you failed to create the DNS records that require a trailing don't correctly when setting up at the new host, you didn't test the DNS servers at your new host to confirm they were providing the expected answers before transferring your domain to them in the registry, and you're pissed off at yourself for making these mistakes, and at Metaname customer service for (apparently) not spelling this out when you asked for help .. do I have that right?

The vendor has been clear about the service they offer, it's not their fault you were unable to identify it yourself and prevent an impact to your service. It may well have been less than ideal customer service (again unclear) but just because you're grumpy about the fact you made a mistake (and that the system let you make that mistake), does not mean you are not responsible for it at the end of the day.

Just because self-service is available, does not mean that hiring an expert is not necessary if you want a level of assurance in your work. Or that, in the case of having not done so, you have anyone to blame but yourself.

By all means give Metaname feedback that they could change their UX to point out the potential problems. But their system complies with the published standards, and the UX provided by other DNS hosting vendors who assume you wanted a trailing dot, when maybe you didn't, may therefore be less compliant and offer less flexibility due to the fact it helps out in a more common use-case... I for one appreciate Metaname giving us more complete control, even if that does also expose us to a slightly higher risk of breaking things. Because the experience is similar to if you were actually modifying a zone file record on a server, and not just using a "helpful" point and click UI...

No signature to see here, move along...

Baboon

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#2907784 28-Apr-2022 07:48

I should be happy about contacting their support twice and getting an unhelpful response twice, that didn't directly address my query? That didn't just spell out my mistake in not realising I needed to append a trailing dot to FQDNs in the data field as well? That didn't just HELP me?

Call me crazy, but after some arrogant years as a teenager and early 20's, nowadays I try to both tell people what they did wrong, _and_ specifically what to do to do it right. Rather than arrogantly trying to force them to work out their mistake, as if that's such a noble goal when a client is stressed and needing it to just work as soon as possible.

But YMMV…

"The surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that it has never tried to contact us."

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1101

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#2908125 29-Apr-2022 09:20

Baboon: I should be happy about contacting their support twice and getting an unhelpful response twice, that didn't directly address my query? That didn't just spell out my mistake in not realising I needed to append a trailing dot to FQDNs in the data field as well? That didn't just HELP me?

pay a bit more
use a service with GOOD phone support , and help desk techs who speak Eng as their 1st language

When I make DNS changes & something isnt working or the DNS change menu is ambiguous, I ring the help desk, they go in & fix any issues for me (eg missing the '. ' and the end , )
pay more, get real phone support .

If you are unhappy with the support level , go somewhere else.
Why persist with a service provider you obviously arnt happy with ?

michaelmurfy

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#2908196 29-Apr-2022 10:50

@1101 Metaname have great support. You can't help somebody who fails to read documentation on the page and doesn't do basic troubleshooting. Metaname have no idea what the records are supposed to be - they may need to be under the domain as they may be self hosted (eg mx1.titan.email.domain.nz.) or they may need to be fully qualified (mx1.titan.email.). The thing is even myself being a professional wouldn't be confident to make that call on behalf of a customer as this can cause the customer to become reliant on me, and make me accountable for any mistakes and also I would expect the customer to read the documentation on the page too which does literally highlight what they were doing wrong. I wouldn't want to make a mistake that makes things worse or do stuff for the customer at all given it isn't a managed service.

When you phone, or email Metaname you get the owner who is the same guy who wrote the site. He knows it inside and out and has made changes on the back of customer feedback or feature requests. He also follows standards and treats all his customers as knowing what they're doing. Metaname isn't a service designed for a novice person - it is a service designed to give customers full flexibility and all the bells and whistles but is engineered compared to the simpler providers like iwantmyname.

Baboon

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#2908200 29-Apr-2022 11:00

So you're telling me "the owner who is the same guy who wrote the site" wouldn't be able to look at the DNS records provided by a popular email hosting site, in the same format as they are provided by so many other hosts, and tell a customer: you need to enter it 'this way', instead of as all the hosts tell you, because my site is strict with syntax?

Seriously?

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michaelmurfy

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#2908203 29-Apr-2022 11:09

What? Re-read my post. Just admit to your mistake and move on. It is very, very clear on the page. There is also testing guidelines on the DNS Records page also:

Baboon

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#2908215 29-Apr-2022 11:24

And again, I didn't realise that applied to all fields. I had the completely wrong idea it only applied to the hostname field. I was wrong. I just needed their support to tell me specifically how I'd mistakenly thought myself into a goof-up.

I'm sorry that is such a grave imposition. But don't worry - what could've been a simple resolution via a couple lines of text in an email, on day one, has been turned into something far, far more important: a lesson. And I've been taught that lesson. Hurrah for me.

"The surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that it has never tried to contact us."

- Calvin and Hobbes (Bill Watterson)

zespri

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#2908342 29-Apr-2022 13:40

I've also been with metaname for years, and I was never disappointed with the customer support, which I had to use on ocasion. It was always to the point.

> I just needed their support to tell me specifically how I'd mistakenly thought myself into a goof-up.

So what Michael is saying above, is that they cannot read your mind, do not know about your infrastructure and requirements and do not want to insult your intelligence. I also should note that the thing about the trailing dot was the first thing that was pointed out to you by the support answer, you rejected it, then was pointed out to you here in this thread and you rejected it again. It is really, really hard to help someone if they appear resistant to your advice. If I experience someone resistant to my advise, I assume this is because some information that they have and I don't, e.g. their infrastructure and requirements, I usually do not assume that they are wrong. I'm sorry you eneded up with all this frustration.

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