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Topic # 112687 17-Dec-2012 15:16
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So the greens have just released a discussion paper that recommends $100 million investment in a for-profit venture to create a new overseas cable.

http://www.greens.org.nz/sites/default/files/ict_green_paper_17_12_12_final.pdf

There are also ideas around smarter government procurement and improving education so that we produce better ICT professionals here in NZ. 

You can discuss the points in the paper in this thread.




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  Reply # 733703 17-Dec-2012 16:26
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Brilliant.  So the Green's now want to subsidise Australian users internet access...

It still staggers me that people who should have some fundamental understanding of economics (ie our government) seem to be blinkered as to the desires or some plutocrats like Rod Drury et al.

If it was being positioned as a "we know it's never going to return a profit but we're going to put money in it anyway" I could understand it.. But they're talking about it being a for-profit exercise.





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  Reply # 733712 17-Dec-2012 16:33
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Lol greens.





 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 733722 17-Dec-2012 16:43
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Doesn't history show that there isn't a business case for a second cable. Apparently the current cable has the capacity we need anyway. The main problems are redundancy(but being a loop it is lower risk) and competition (which regulation can fix).
The greens do speak a lot of sense sometimes though.

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  Reply # 733724 17-Dec-2012 16:49
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Wasn't there a fairly major phase of the previous attempt to get this project kicked off, which involved asking people to invest?
Why were there no takers?
Also, another noteworthy comment from the Greens, that they will remove the ability to patent software....




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  Reply # 733731 17-Dec-2012 16:58
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mattwnz: Doesn't history show that there isn't a business case for a second cable.


What history, pacific fibre? Didn't they just show that global politics is a b*tch? :)



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  Reply # 733732 17-Dec-2012 17:02
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MikeSkyrme: Wasn't there a fairly major phase of the previous attempt to get this project kicked off, which involved asking people to invest?
Why were there no takers?
Also, another noteworthy comment from the Greens, that they will remove the ability to patent software....


Pacific fibre failed to get enough investor interest with many parties saying a lack of government backing was the reason. 

I think removing the ability to patent software can only be a good thing considering how much companies worldwide are spending on patent portfolios and lawsuits instead of on research & development. Removing patents on software does not affect copyright of software. 






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  Reply # 733735 17-Dec-2012 17:04
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sidefx:
mattwnz: Doesn't history show that there isn't a business case for a second cable.


What history, pacific fibre? Didn't they just show that global politics is a b*tch? :)


Definitely. Competition in this space can only mean good things for NZ - if you've been following the mobile Telco space this is especially apparent. I think redundancy is pretty important too. 

Several OECD studies and recommendations have shown that investment in infrastructure is a key contributor to economic success. 




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  Reply # 733787 17-Dec-2012 18:22
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It's fine having intercational capacity, but those bits and bytes still need to be moved around NZ.

The cost of backhaul both up and down NZ and domestic transit are significant, and with more and more internet traffic heading West, not East as Australia becomes a CDN hub, connectivity to Australia is IMHO as important as connectivity to the US.

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  Reply # 733799 17-Dec-2012 18:43
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sorry i cant take anything the greens propose seriously, not after there defence spokesman said the army shouldn't patrol at night in Afghanistan because it was to dangerous.



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  Reply # 733993 17-Dec-2012 22:57
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vexxxboy: sorry i cant take anything the greens propose seriously, not after there defence spokesman said the army shouldn't patrol at night in Afghanistan because it was to dangerous.


I am unsure if anyone will take you seriously with your terrible spelling and grammar. 




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  Reply # 736788 24-Dec-2012 09:45
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I started writing up a comment but only just got back to it. The paper has been taken down for some reason.

The Greens have a fair chance of having a small to medium role in the next government so it is worth taking the general direction of it seriously. The cable thing got all the attention in this thread but there is a lot more in the paper than that. I'm not completely convinced international data is killing us at present. I'd like to see some really nice graphs with current capacity and demand curves, proportion of costs, etc. The paper is misleading about the nature of the SX issue in November - bad idea.

The Green software patent policy is exactly what the industry in NZ wanted and thought it was getting from the current government until last minute lobbying from Microsoft etc got the proposed law swung towards patents instead.

The paper proposes including ICT in the apprenticeship and training scheme. A lot is dependent on the details but it is an interesting idea which could increase the total value of skills available in NZ and the value of our enterprises.

There are hints in the paper the Greens would work to extend the reach of graduate and pre-graduate programs as well. To state the obvious - these are underused in NZ. The university resources allocated to this goal are meagre. As a result grad and pre-grad programs are aimed only at large corporations. As we all know the reality is most innovation in NZ occurs on a far smaller scale. Pre-grad programs would make a huge difference to this sector where most of our innovation comes from. These programs need to be program managed by people who are familiar with both university and small/medium innovation environments.

There is one thing missing from this paper. It is the nature of this industry that many enterprises started here are purchased and developed further overseas. This will always be the case. Some thought needs to be given to a strategic position which will result in the maximum benefit. OTTOMH, service based enterprises have a good record in this area but all that deserves a closer look.

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  Reply # 737372 26-Dec-2012 14:39
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sbiddle: It's fine having intercational capacity, but those bits and bytes still need to be moved around NZ.

The cost of backhaul both up and down NZ and domestic transit are significant, and with more and more internet traffic heading West, not East as Australia becomes a CDN hub, connectivity to Australia is IMHO as important as connectivity to the US.

I agree that US is not thte only major internet destination anymore, but there won't be a business case for a long time that involves simply replicating any of the SX landing points. The other proposal at the moment sounds like has a better chance because it won't compete directly with SX. Or perhaps linking up to the proposed Leighton cable or something, instead of San Jose & Sydney?

I didn't think it was possible to patent software in NZ anyway, so good luck if the greens want to outlaw american software patents... and maybe copyright along with it. More of a murky foreign policy issue I would have thought.




Qualified in business, certified in fibre, stuck in copper, have to keep going  ^_^

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  Reply # 737397 26-Dec-2012 15:34
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lokhor:
vexxxboy: sorry i cant take anything the greens propose seriously, not after there defence spokesman said the army shouldn't patrol at night in Afghanistan because it was to dangerous.


I am unsure if anyone will take you seriously with your terrible spelling and grammar. 


sorry didnt no yo we th spelig polce an grammr

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