Deadlocked trying to get refund, will lodge a complaint with Telecommunications Disputes Resolution in the morning.

Forums › Spark New Zealand (including Skinny and BigPipe) › Deadlocked trying to get refund, will lodge a complaint with Telecommunications Disputes Resolution in the morning.

dwilson

162 posts

Master Geek

#280536 21-Dec-2020 17:17

Strange day, I'm collecting up transcripts, dates, screenshots, about to lodge a complaint to Telecommunications Disputes Resolution, regarding Spark. Pretty sure I'll be lodging tomorrow morning.

The summary is:

Purchased 2x Spark Smart Mesh products, online from the Spark website.
Discovered the products do not provide functionality that was advertised and presented in the UI.
Spark online chat confirmed the functionality is not possible and instructed me to return them.
Returned both products to Spark Dunedin store, received a 'receipt' email from the store employee for the meshes with a promise of a refund back to my card.

It's coming up two weeks and I am many conversations deep with Spark Online support, and getting nowhere.

This response is the best I have gotten:

00:30:30 Olivia : I understand. We apologize about it. I'll send you an email once received feedback from the direct fulfilment team.

Which is similar to all the other responses I have received, and never get an answer.

As time goes from days to weeks, I begin to wonder why does it take so long for fulfilment to receive two Spark Meshes?

Who saw them last? They were received by the Spark Dunedin store manager.

And then I begin to wonder about that exchange I had with him. At the time I physically returned the products to Spark Dunedin store, the manager was a little aggressive and incredibly resistant to receiving the items, despite showing him the printed transcript from Spark Online Chat instructing me to return them to the store. He was offering partial refunds, offering to send someone to my house - all sorts of behaviour that I'd expect from a dodgy Trademe vendor, not Spark. It was like he was somehow personally invested in the refund. Only once I pointed out his obligations under the CGA did he relent, saying he would courier them and I would get a refund to my card at a later time.

I had put that exchange out of my mind until this morning, as this drags on and the non-response from Spark looks odder and odder, I begin to wonder, what is going on?

This is not the Spark I know and love and have advocated for to friends and family.

My patience is at an end, I'll go through Telecommunications Disputes Resolution in the morning. Should have a result in six weeks.

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BDFL - Memuneh
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Geekzone

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#2625050 21-Dec-2020 17:22

Contact your credit card issuer and start a cashback process now.

Quic Broadband

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tdgeek

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#2625090 21-Dec-2020 19:35

Ouch. Its not in my area, but PM me your account number, I'll have a look, and try to progress it. It doesn't need to be hard

Oops, Im "Trusted" But not labelled Spark. Ill PM you

johny99

495 posts

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#2625096 21-Dec-2020 20:56

Have to say Spark Retail Whanganui don’t Understand the CGA well at all either, They told an elderly pensioner that the CGA ends when the warranty does, Although he is elderly he is as sharp as a chisel, but sadly he is also of the generation that doesn’t want to make a fuss.

dwilson

162 posts

Master Geek

#2625170 22-Dec-2020 05:35

Thanks for the suggestions. Charging back a credit card is not something I would consider for a professional organisation like Spark. I have to have faith they will do the right thing. They wouldn't just take the products and the money and say 'nah ah', would they?

I'm giving them another day to initiate the refund before lodging my claim with TDR, because one of the support crew has been ever so nice in trying to help.

I think I met the criteria for a TDR claim, but it's not so clear, I purchased two products from an online store that just happen to be telecommunications products (Spark Smart Mesh) from a telecommunications company (Spark), I might need to go through Disputes Tribunal because this is a simple CGA claim. I don't have an account with Spark, I am an online retail customer. I'll lodge with TDR, I assume they'll tell me if I am talking to the wrong crowd.

As mentioned in private chat tdgeek, appreciate the offer but I'm going to let this play out, it's ruining my Christmas, doesn't need to ruin yours :P

dwilson

162 posts

Master Geek

#2625171 22-Dec-2020 05:48

johny99: Have to say Spark Retail Whanganui don’t Understand the CGA well at all either, They told an elderly pensioner that the CGA ends when the warranty does, Although he is elderly he is as sharp as a chisel, but sadly he is also of the generation that doesn’t want to make a fuss.

Thats the thing, if this can happen to me, I wonder what's happening to everyone else? This kind of behaviour is what I get when the baby gate I order off Trademe is missing a plastic bit, and the guy is trying to pull swift-ones to avoid having to send a replacement part or refund the gate.

Do the managers of the Spark stores have a personal investment in them or something? Is there some monetary reward system for meeting targets?

Bung

6394 posts

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#2625174 22-Dec-2020 06:22

Maybe the system requires someone to check that the returned items are still in working order before refunding you.

dwilson

162 posts

Master Geek

#2625175 22-Dec-2020 06:26

Bung: Maybe the system requires someone to check that the returned items are still in working order before refunding you.

Built into the 3-5 day return/refund policy I would wager. We're coming up on 2 weeks.

premiumtouring

355 posts

Ultimate Geek

#2625189 22-Dec-2020 07:02

dwilson:

Thanks for the suggestions. Charging back a credit card is not something I would consider for a professional organisation like Spark. I have to have faith they will do the right thing. They wouldn't just take the products and the money and say 'nah ah', would they?

Glad to hear you're holding off on the advice of charging back. When it comes to service based companies, only use the credit card "charge back" facility as an absolute last resort - even when dealing with "less professional" organisations (or small businesses). The last thing you want is to be blacklisted for life by an operator like Spark - which is what more and more people are discovering happens when they get impatient with service companies (Google is a real classic in this domain). If you do intend to go ahead, there's some information about the charge back process here: https://www.consumer.org.nz/articles/credit-card-chargebacks

As a side note, most organisations have monthly (and more rarely, weekly) pay runs where they aggregate non-standard refunds for direct deposit into customer's accounts. These things are triple checked and take forever in large organisations. I imagine Spark is processing this transaction manually. From what you've described, it sounds like the goods needed to be returned from your store location to a central distribution warehouse (probably somewhere in the north island) where they are assessed and deemed to be in resalable condition. Once that happens, I'm certain there is paperwork that needs to be filed and then passed up the chain to the credit team who then manually process your refund. For a typical DOA or Warranty return, you wouldn't notice any of these types of delays as a customer because they just swap out your goods for a working unit on the spot.

These processes are slow and cumbersome not to piss off the customers (which is the unintended consequence), but to ensure there are checks and balances in place to prevent internal fraud.

Unfortunately where a lot of large organisations fail, is in communicating this process to customers and employees.

Regardless, good luck and I'm sure Spark will sort you out it just probably won't be this month!

sbiddle

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#2625191 22-Dec-2020 07:11

dwilson:

Thanks for the suggestions. Charging back a credit card is not something I would consider for a professional organisation like Spark. I have to have faith they will do the right thing. They wouldn't just take the products and the money and say 'nah ah', would they?

I'm giving them another day to initiate the refund before lodging my claim with TDR, because one of the support crew has been ever so nice in trying to help.

I think I met the criteria for a TDR claim, but it's not so clear, I purchased two products from an online store that just happen to be telecommunications products (Spark Smart Mesh) from a telecommunications company (Spark), I might need to go through Disputes Tribunal because this is a simple CGA claim. I don't have an account with Spark, I am an online retail customer. I'll lodge with TDR, I assume they'll tell me if I am talking to the wrong crowd.

As mentioned in private chat tdgeek, appreciate the offer but I'm going to let this play out, it's ruining my Christmas, doesn't need to ruin yours :P

IMHO this is the exact sort of case where a credit card charge back is the simplest, quickest and easiest approach. Why you'd go down the path of spending $40 on a DT case seems a little strange to me.

Out of curiosity what was the actual issue?

johny99

495 posts

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#2625193 22-Dec-2020 07:21

10 working days is long enough for a company of Sparks size to sort this issue, and why would it be acceptable for spark to blacklist the OP for initiating a failed charge back, as it’s Sparks employees that have not communicated with them? That is just bullying imo.

Senecio

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#2625202 22-Dec-2020 07:39

Out of curiosity, what was the functionality that was advertised but not available? It may help others to avoid going down the same path.

Bung

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#2625204 22-Dec-2020 07:40

dwilson:
Bung: Maybe the system requires someone to check that the returned items are still in working order before refunding you.

Built into the 3-5 day return/refund policy I would wager. We're coming up on 2 weeks.

The only returns policy I can find is the 7 day "Buyer's remorse" for mobile phones that requires the returned item to be in sealed unopened packaging.

They've had about 8 days to find someone to check your returns. To be honest these days Spark probably has to send it out.

dwilson

162 posts

Master Geek

#2625218 22-Dec-2020 08:29

The actual issue was the Guest Network only working on the Spark Smart Modem, not the Spark Smart Mesh products.

The manual says the Smart Mesh copies its WiFI config across from the Smart Modem, and then there is a shared interface that allows you to configure a Guest Network, but little did I know it only ever works on the Smart Modem. End result your guest network only works in one corner of the house.

I purchased one smart mesh a couple months ago to extend the network incrementally preparing for Christmas, but I never tested the Guest Network until I purchased a second unit few weeks ago while preparing for family to come to stay for Christmas. I purchased the second unit, put it in the guest unit out back, and then tested. And noticed problems. I used WiFi Anlyzer to track down what was broadcasting network and what was not. Modem broadcasting everything, Mesh units broadcasting the main network only.

End result was Spark support saying that there are internal limitations with the Smart Mesh and suggested that I return the two Smart Mesh to the local Dunedin store.

The shared interface is really deceptive, you could be configuring the modem but not the mesh products, I wonder what else is not shared.

I purchased the TP-Link Deco M5 on recommendations over in the LAN forums and everything solved from the networking perspective - works beautifully, family are busy browsing happily :)

1101

3121 posts

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#2625296 22-Dec-2020 09:44

johny99: Have to say Spark Retail Whanganui don’t Understand the CGA well at all either, They told an elderly pensioner that the CGA ends when the warranty does, A

They are breaking the law buy telling people that. Its now an offense to mislead people re CGA rights .

Unfortunately, management of so many companies(Incl where Ive worked) have a total disregard for the CGA . They make policies that go against the CGA & dont bother to train staff re the CGA

dwilson

162 posts

Master Geek

#2625299 22-Dec-2020 09:47

1101:

johny99: Have to say Spark Retail Whanganui don’t Understand the CGA well at all either, They told an elderly pensioner that the CGA ends when the warranty does, A

They are breaking the law buy telling people that. Its now an offense to mislead people re CGA rights .

Who should he complain too if this happens?

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