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blaXoid

30 posts

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#29161 26-Dec-2008 20:19
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Hi everyone,

In the lead up to Xmas I bought the Buzz game and buzzers off Trademe. The seller sent the items, but when it arrived I found out that the game was in NTSC. I emailed the seller and told him this, to which he stated that he tried it at home and it worked, saying his PS2 must have been chipped. He agreed to refund the money. I sent the item back to him with his original stamps, as the post hadn't stamped them, so he really only needed to refund the original amount + shipping(which I told him too).

He received it just before xmas, but then emailed me with the following (Note the game was $66 + $6 shipping  = $72 )

Refund amount will be:-

$66.00 Buzz

$00.00 postage, as you used my original stamps

-$4.55 Success fee

=====

$62.45 to be deposited.

my reply was:

Hmm i really think that I shouldn't have to pay for the success fee as you didn't state the game was from outside NZ.

I think it was fair of me to assume it was from here unless you mentioned otherwise, don't you agree?

Note the original auction below, makes no mention of anything NTSC, except for the photo(which looks like it was a straight google image grab)

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=192382929

His reply was the following:

Hmm I think that you looked at other buzz auctions to see which one had the best price and if you were observant you would have noticed that my picture was different from the others (which is the exact picture of the item you received) and if you clicked on the picture you would have seen the NTSC logo.

You did not ask any questions before clicking on the buy now icon, so you agree in buying the item in full including fees in whatever condition. 

This is some of the pitfalls with Trademe and I’m sure we have both learnt lessons with this.

So, if you are talking about being fair, how about splitting the cost 50/50  ($6+4.55=10.55 / 2 = $5.30).

------------------

So it seems kind of obvious from that that he's trying to refund as little as possible(now raising the price of what I should pay).  He more than likely just screwed up the auction without realizing it but is now not willing to pay the fees he has incurred. I realise it's really just $10 either way, but I think I'm getting screwed here.

2 things really jumped out at me:

-When he states what he's gonna refund me, he doesn't even want to refund shipping saying I used his stamps - duh, but obviously I had to pay for it to get to me first!!

-He's really grasping at straws with the 'if you have been observant' etc story

Anyone got any opinions/experiences on such events and how I should proceed??

 


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Mattv
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  #186199 26-Dec-2008 20:26
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As I understand it the seller can go to the auction details and make a claim for the refund of the success fee as the sale was not fully completed. Both you and the seller get a neutral feedback from trademe and you are free to place whatever feedback you like on each other.

Batman
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  #186211 26-Dec-2008 22:11
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you will not pay for the success fee as TM WILL refund it. the onus is on the seller.




Involuntary autocorrect in operation on mobile device. Apologies in advance.


 
 
 
 


blaXoid

30 posts

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  #186259 27-Dec-2008 13:28
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Thanks for the replies guys, I did some reading and came across this on TM:

When are you eligible for a refund?
You are eligble for a refund of the success fees charged if:
  • Your auction met reserve, sold by Buy Now, or a fixed price offer for the auction was accepted and;
  • You are unable to contact the buyer or they refuse to complete the sale and;
  • The success fee was incurred less than 28 days ago.
We do not give refunds when you have not described the goods accurately or are no longer willing to complete the sale.

The bold part is what applies to my situation, I think. The seller wants to argue that he listed it properly, so I think he will not want to apply for a refund since he can't get it, instead he wants to charge me for it.

Looking like threatening with bad feedback is the only option left?

freitasm
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#186260 27-Dec-2008 13:37
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And if he's an idiot like many I've seen then he will slap back with a bad feedback on your account - and Trade Me won't remove it.

Time to contact Trade Me and ask to them to put the seller in his place.




 

 

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CYaBro
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  #186262 27-Dec-2008 13:46
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blaXoid: Thanks for the replies guys, I did some reading and came across this on TM:

When are you eligible for a refund?
You are eligble for a refund of the success fees charged if:
  • Your auction met reserve, sold by Buy Now, or a fixed price offer for the auction was accepted and;
  • You are unable to contact the buyer or they refuse to complete the sale and;
  • The success fee was incurred less than 28 days ago.
We do not give refunds when you have not described the goods accurately or are no longer willing to complete the sale.

The bold part is what applies to my situation, I think. The seller wants to argue that he listed it properly, so I think he will not want to apply for a refund since he can't get it, instead he wants to charge me for it.

Looking like threatening with bad feedback is the only option left?


Just tell the seller to apply for the success fee refund and just say that the sale did not go through, both parties agreed.
TradeMe will then contact you to confirm and, if you do, then they get the refund.
The seller doesn't have to tell them the real reason for the refund request.

blaXoid

30 posts

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  #186620 30-Dec-2008 08:30
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So I emailed the Trader telling him about the success fee refund:

Hi Stephen,
 
I spoke to some people I know about this situation, and they suggest we do the following:
 
Just tell the seller to apply for the success fee refund and just say that the sale did not go through, both parties agreed.
TradeMe will then contact you to confirm and, if you do, then they get the refund.
The seller doesn't have to tell them the real reason for the refund request.

 
Inherintly, TM doesn't allow refunds for having items listed wrongly, but as long as we both agree that the sale wasn't completed you will still get refunded anyway.
 
That way, you get the success fee back, after which I think you should refund the original shipping cost (another $9.55 on top of $62.45 already deposited) After all is said and done, we both break even - which is fair.
 
More Info on success fee refunds:
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Help/Topic.aspx?help_id=113
 
Cheers,
Daniel

--------------------------------------------

Hi Daniel

 

If you can’t play fair and share the cost of only $5.30 each then quite frankly you disserve nothing.? I would rather loose the Trademe account than pay you now since you can’t play fair.

 

Have a nice life

Stephen

------------------------------------------------
My Reply:

I see, rather than address what I replied to you, you play ignorant to avoid giving anything back.

 

Hilarious, you think I'm not playing fair? You have stolen money from me. I paid you $72 for an item and I got $62.45 back when I returned it. You don't deserve $5.30 or whatever, you only deserve your success fee refund of $4.55 because that's all you paid - which TM will give you.

 

You stated on your refund:

$00.00 postage, as you used my original stamps.

So I get $0.00 even though, I paid $6 initially to get it shipped to me. I was then honest to you and said I returned it without having to pay extra, to save YOU another $6 - I could have easily lied and said shipping cost another $6!

 

I see who's being fair now, really. Don't worry, appropriate aciton will be taken, and quite frankly I am saddened that the situation had to come to this - but obviously there are always going to be bad apples on TM, just like you said. If you have to lose your account then so be it.


------------------------------------------------
So that's essentially what it's come down to. Obviously I will place bad feedback and am now contacting TM as well. Some real dicks out there :|

Thanks all for your help

tonyhughes
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#186621 30-Dec-2008 08:58
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To be fair, I think if you could actually see NTSC on the packaging in the photo, then the seller has a valid point (Note I say the seller has a valid point - not that you are totally in the wrong).

From a disinterested 3rd party point of view, i'd say the best thing would have been for him to apply for a success fee refund, and you to wear the shipping cost.

I don't know about others, but unless questioned, I don't think I would mention the format of games I am selling - it just wouldn't occur to me. I would tend to just photograph things well, and let buyer get own info from those.







 
 
 
 


blaXoid

30 posts

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  #186622 30-Dec-2008 09:07
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I can see how people would think that - just as the buyer would assume that it's a game he could play right here in NZ. That point is obviously a bit subjective.

Nevertheless, I think if the Trader had applied for the success fee refund and not got it, then I would have paid the shipping, but as I think is evident from the emails, he is not so inclined(as he charges me for both success fee & shipping).

As others have said, he would have more than likely got it back anyway - in that case, it's only fair we both just break even and chalk it up as a mistake, yet he refuses to even attempt the refund.

In the end all I wanted was for the item to be returned and for everyone to get their money back.



tonyhughes
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  #186629 30-Dec-2008 09:33
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blaXoid: I can see how people would think that - just as the buyer would assume that it's a game he could play right here in NZ. That point is obviously a bit subjective.

Nevertheless, I think if the Trader had applied for the success fee refund and not got it, then I would have paid the shipping, but as I think is evident from the emails, he is not so inclined(as he charges me for both success fee & shipping).

As others have said, he would have more than likely got it back anyway - in that case, it's only fair we both just break even and chalk it up as a mistake, yet he refuses to even attempt the refund.

In the end all I wanted was for the item to be returned and for everyone to get their money back.



I understand where you are coming from, but in situations like this, obviously NZ Post is not refunding anyone, so someone is gonna lose money, and both partys can clearly make a good case for it to not be them.

Sounds like he is a munter though.







mickmok
25 posts

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  #187108 3-Jan-2009 01:48
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Just having a photo with the NTSC logo on it is not enough to get away with it. That sort of information must be specified in the auction itself. As it is assumed that when purchasing a game or a movie for instance that it is the correct format/region as NZ. If the seller does not specify and leaves it to a photo then thats too bad for them. You could also get them with the fact that the game most probably did not have an NZ classification sticker on it, being an NTSC game. It is illegal to sell games and movies etc. without the proper rating sticker. Either way the seller is altogether being fraudulent and you should continue to pursue them through TM, in my opinion.

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