Intel Core 13th and 14th Gen Desktop Processors - Instability Reports Update- microcode patch in the works.

Forums › Desktop computing › Intel Core 13th and 14th Gen Desktop Processors - Instability Reports Update- microcode patch in the works.

Qazzy03

455 posts

Ultimate Geek

#315547 24-Jul-2024 17:37

It might be of interest to anyone running intel 13th or 14th gen.

Keep an eye out for a new bios update for 600-series and 700-series motherboards after mid-August as motherboard manufacturers will have to validate Intels new microcode for their motherboards.

Direct from intel

Based on extensive analysis of Intel Core 13th/14th Gen desktop processors returned to us due to instability issues, we have determined that elevated operating voltage is causing instability issues in some 13th/14th Gen desktop processors. Our analysis of returned processors confirms that the elevated operating voltage is stemming from a microcode algorithm resulting in incorrect voltage requests to the processor.

Intel is delivering a microcode patch which addresses the root cause of exposure to elevated voltages. We are continuing validation to ensure that scenarios of instability reported to Intel regarding its Core 13th/14th Gen desktop processors are addressed. Intel is currently targeting mid-August for patch release to partners following full validation.

Intel is committed to making this right with our customers, and we continue asking any customers currently experiencing instability issues on their Intel Core 13th/14th Gen desktop processors reach out to Intel Customer Support for further assistance.

https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/July-2024-Update-on-Instability-Reports-on-Intel-Core-13th-and/m-p/1617113

Techpowerup with some additional written context:

https://www.techpowerup.com/324823/intel-statement-on-13th-and-14th-gen-core-instability-faulty-microcode-causes-excessive-voltages-fix-out-soon

Wccftech with a timeline of articles on how the issue came into the public spotlight.

https://wccftech.com/intel-official-response-14th-13th-gen-cpu-instability-elevated-operating-voltages-root-cause-microcode-patch-in-august/

GN with a video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OVdmK1UGzGs

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2369 posts

Uber Geek

#3267869 3-Aug-2024 18:28

The story around highend Intel Gen13/14 CPU failures seems to be growing legs?
Possibly going back a year or two as well.
Though going back in time 11th Gen was reportedly not great either.

Intel cutting back on fitness counselling, fruit, private jets, people (mass layoffs).

Gamers Nexas really going for it with this title !

Scumbag Intel: Shady Practices, Terrible Responses, & Failure to A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b6vQlvefGxk

AMD has delayed their latest release as they requalify early silicon to be 100% sure they have positive product rollout while Intel is struggling.

Share price the vertical line at the end of graph below.
There goes some of my Kiwisaver :-)

Wise

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Batman

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#3267870 3-Aug-2024 18:54

will this bios update make my PC slower? if so I won't update, it seems to be fine

Jase2985

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#3267873 3-Aug-2024 19:10

Batman:

will this bios update make my PC slower? if so I won't update, it seems to be fine

Likely will be unnoticeable to you, but will prevent the CPU self-destructing.

cruxis

477 posts

Ultimate Geek

#3267887 3-Aug-2024 20:17

Why wont intel say which serial numbers have the manufacturing issues. The lawyers are on the hunt for a payout.

https://www.pcmag.com/news/intel-faces-potential-class-action-lawsuit-over-chip-bug-controversy

MaxineN

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#3267897 3-Aug-2024 21:54

I've asked PBtech what their stance is and what they will be doing as I own a 14700k that currently is fine and with some tweaks I have it under volted and is within Intel power limit (but has no timer and all cores are synced), but all they've responded with is with a return process...

That's not useful now...

I know many retailers would be getting the news maybe 24 hours earlier than the consumers would but this is a mess. Probably won't be buying new Intel for a very long time.

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jrdobbs

106 posts

Master Geek

#3267914 3-Aug-2024 23:18

Jase2985:

Batman:

will this bios update make my PC slower? if so I won't update, it seems to be fine

Likely will be unnoticeable to you, but will prevent the CPU self-destructing.

It will only stop CPU damage where there is currently no damage it seems. Those that are already affected may get worse.

SpartanVXL

1268 posts

Uber Geek

#3268072 4-Aug-2024 14:52

Batman:
will this bios update make my PC slower? if so I won't update, it seems to be fine

It’s a bad take to do an ostrich on this issue, if you don’t get instability now then you will later and have to reduce your clocks and lose performance anyway.

It’s bad enough that Epic has made an statement for Unreal Engine that if you have either of these CPU series then you need to take measures on your platform first before engaging support.

These things can run 1.5V and spike even higher. Intel really missed the mark in trying to catch the performance crown.

networkn

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#3268082 4-Aug-2024 15:45

Is there a tool that you can run that identifies:

1) Are you in the group of processors that are likely impacted by this issue?

2) Has any permanent damage occured so you can arrange a replacement under warranty?

My 14700K seems stable, but who knows if any of the issues I've had in the last 6 months is attributible or just something else like a bad update or whatever.

MaxineN

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#3268084 4-Aug-2024 16:08

networkn:

Is there a tool that you can run that identifies:

1) Are you in the group of processors that are likely impacted by this issue? No

2) Has any permanent damage occured so you can arrange a replacement under warranty? You could test yourself by pushing it in synthetic benchmarks and look at using HWInfo64 and look at vcore and VID to see if it's above 1.5v when it tries and those synthetic benchmarks are designed to stress. Cinebench R23 and R15 are very sensitive to bad overclocks and instability.

My 14700K seems stable, but who knows if any of the issues I've had in the last 6 months is attributible or just something else like a bad update or whatever.

Answered in quote.

I am also a 14700K and per my previous post PB Tech has not advised anything but "you can return it."

I know myself I look fine with my own tweaks to get within Intel defaults but have unlimited turbo timers and still have all core sync and I haven't lost any performance nor have I seen any instability but again... what's gonna happen in a year? I still don't know if I'm affected but I know for a fact out of the box this CPU was wanting more than 1.5V on idle.

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jrdobbs

106 posts

Master Geek

#3268096 4-Aug-2024 16:48

networkn:

Is there a tool that you can run that identifies:

1) Are you in the group of processors that are likely impacted by this issue?

AFAIK Intel aren't saying which particular CPU's are causing issues so there's no way of telling.

Undervolting can cause issues of stability when the CPU is processing heavy loads.

MaxineN

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#3268105 4-Aug-2024 17:23

jrdobbs:

networkn:

Is there a tool that you can run that identifies:

1) Are you in the group of processors that are likely impacted by this issue?

AFAIK Intel aren't saying which particular CPU's are causing issues so there's no way of telling.

Undervolting can cause issues of stability when the CPU is processing heavy loads.

Undervolting whilst it's requesting higher clock multipler will cause instability, let's just get this right. You can under volt and still maintain max turbo clock if you have a good chip and a motherboard that allows you to fine tune it. If your chip requires more voltage then yes you will lose stability. For the most part. 1.3V is the middle ground. 1.27 is conservative. 1.25 is now undervolting territory.

If you can sync all cores and under volt with an offset like I have done you'd probably be fine. You just need to be under 1.5 volts on vcore (1.5 and higher is going to reduce the life span of any Intel CPU and has been the case since Nehalem, that's first gen Core on 45nm back in 2008).

You can tweak even further with LLC. Default is level 3 but you might be able to get away with level 2.

Or you can update your UEFI and just use Intel Default Settings but after 56 seconds of 100% CPU load you will lose your max core turbo as it will drop as PL1 is 125W (post PL2 turbo timer where PL2 is 253W).

But then again. Not even Intel can clarify what the actual fudge the spec is meant to be. https://community.intel.com/t5/Processors/June-2024-Guidance-regarding-Intel-Core-13th-and-14th-Gen-K-KF/td-p/1607807?lightbox-message-images-1607807=56057i81282C3BCB9162A9

edit: also Intel HAVE stated what are affected.

https://www.pcgamer.com/hardware/processors/intel-has-no-plans-to-recall-those-crashing-13th-and-14th-gen-cpus-hasnt-halted-sales-and-the-damage-to-affected-chips-may-be-permanent/

Any part past 65W has this issue. So that's all Core i5s Core i7s Core i9s.

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jrdobbs

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#3268177 4-Aug-2024 19:24

If I ever put together a new PC in the future it will have an AMD CPU in it. Better bang (hopefully not) for the buck.

gzt

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#3268201 4-Aug-2024 21:26

Batman: will this bios update make my PC slower? if so I won't update, it seems to be fine

Don't know. Last time I looked into this Tom's Hardware I think.. their advice at that time was once you apply the microcode it can never be un-applied or reverted by another patch.

The 'prevent damage' angle is new to me. I hadn't seen that.

jrdobbs

106 posts

Master Geek

#3268203 4-Aug-2024 21:40

gzt:

The 'prevent damage' angle is new to me. I hadn't seen that.

I think "prevent damage" is Intel speak for a Hail Mary.

Scott3

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#3268220 4-Aug-2024 23:10

Who thinks the scope of this is going to expand?

Have a 13900H in my work laptop (45W TDP, but will happily boost up to 117W, and run for ~ 2 minutes 90+ Watts)

My thoughts is it is unlikely high end laptop process will get off somehow...

jrdobbs:

If I ever put together a new PC in the future it will have an AMD CPU in it. Better bang (hopefully not) for the buck.

Suspect you are not the only one.

At the high end of the (desktop) market, AMD seem to have the crown for gaming & multicore workloads, with Intel's remaining crown being single core workloads (but with a reputation for drinking power while doing so).

Suspect many intel buyers (such as myself), have been sticking with intel due as their dominance in the market means we are less likely to run into weird compatibility issues etc. Something that is way outweighed by a known & unaddressed stability issue.

Suspect there is going to be a sudden rush to AMD for & midrange higher end desktops.

While mobile CPU's aren't declared to be impacted by the stability issue, Intel is facing solid completion from both AMD and snapdragon.

All stacked with the economic recession & Low consumer spending, and things aren't looking great for Intel.

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