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75 posts

Master Geek


  # 1508377 8-Mar-2016 18:46
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tdgeek:

 

asjohnstone:

 

Doubtless they'll do the same for EPL coverage if they get it next year.

 

It's really crappy, just let me buy what I want at a fair price, don't force me to pay for everything in your bundle.

 

 

 

 

They do, it was called F1 Season pass, and now Fanpass

 

Whats a fair price?

 

 

 

 

Given that  the rights for NZ sold for less than at the last sale when PremierLeaguePass puchased them, something comparable to what I'm paying now, iirc that about $200 a year.


1690 posts

Uber Geek


  # 1508383 8-Mar-2016 18:56
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asjohnstone:

 

tdgeek:

 

asjohnstone:

 

Doubtless they'll do the same for EPL coverage if they get it next year.

 

It's really crappy, just let me buy what I want at a fair price, don't force me to pay for everything in your bundle.

 

 

 

 

They do, it was called F1 Season pass, and now Fanpass

 

Whats a fair price?

 

 

 

 

Given that  the rights for NZ sold for less than at the last sale when PremierLeaguePass puchased them, something comparable to what I'm paying now, iirc that about $200 a year.

 

 

Not true.  The USD price is reported to be less than last time.  But the exchange rate has fallen significantly in the 3 years since it was set.  It is likely to have increased from ~NZD4.2m per annum to ~NZD4.5m per annum.  Assuming no wholesale margin.  

 

http://www.throng.co.nz/2015/11/english-premier-league-rights-change-is-this-the-demise-of-lightbox-sports/

 

But much less of an increase than the Australian rights changed hands for.....


 
 
 
 


15 posts

Geek


  # 1511429 11-Mar-2016 15:43
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Regardless of the price, you're missing the fact that the 2015 F1 Season Pass let you watch Practice, Qualifying and the Race up on catch-up for up to a week after they actually aired!  Given that F1 is normally live in NZ during the wee hours this is a necessity.

 

The 'replacement' service of just paying for a day/week/month of Sky Sports is no substitute as there is no catch up facility.

 

I'm massively, totally, and absolutely gutted - the F1 Season pass was invaluable last year! I never had any problems with the streams - even watched them over 3G with no buffering or drop-outs (2degrees) - usually on catch up wherever I happened to be on the morning after a race.

 

I'm more than happy to pay $$$ for this service - last year was a bargain in my opinion.

 

Does anyone know why they've dropped catch-up?  I'd love to drop them an email to find out why they won't take my money for a service that they've already built and successfully implemented!  I'm seriously concerned about how I'm going to watch F1 this year.  Short of a $100pm Sky subscription, anyone got any ideas?


1690 posts

Uber Geek


  # 1511434 11-Mar-2016 15:54
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sherlock:

 

Regardless of the price, you're missing the fact that the 2015 F1 Season Pass let you watch Practice, Qualifying and the Race up on catch-up for up to a week after they actually aired!  Given that F1 is normally live in NZ during the wee hours this is a necessity.

 

The 'replacement' service of just paying for a day/week/month of Sky Sports is no substitute as there is no catch up facility.

 

I'm massively, totally, and absolutely gutted - the F1 Season pass was invaluable last year! I never had any problems with the streams - even watched them over 3G with no buffering or drop-outs (2degrees) - usually on catch up wherever I happened to be on the morning after a race.

 

I'm more than happy to pay $$$ for this service - last year was a bargain in my opinion.

 

Does anyone know why they've dropped catch-up?  I'd love to drop them an email to find out why they won't take my money for a service that they've already built and successfully implemented!  I'm seriously concerned about how I'm going to watch F1 this year.  Short of a $100pm Sky subscription, anyone got any ideas?

 

 

I agree.  Its totally crap that the season passes for the various sports have been dropped.  And totally agree that F1 given its nature is more suited to a season pass than offering streaming live feeds of the sports channels.

 

The structure of providing  stored, replayable sport content would have a different cost structure than pure playout of existing satellite feeds but that doesnt excuse the fact that there is a market segment that wants this service - and is willing to pay for it.  

 

Unclear if there are rights implications - what the broadcaster is/is not allowed to do with the content.  Is anyone aware of any other broadcaster offering anything remotely like last years F1 seasonpass?  Imagine the issues associated with people using unblockers to stream from NZ - for what is arguably the most expensive sports rights in the world.  


169 posts

Master Geek


  # 1511442 11-Mar-2016 16:05
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ockel:

 

 

 

Unclear if there are rights implications - what the broadcaster is/is not allowed to do with the content.  Is anyone aware of any other broadcaster offering anything remotely like last years F1 seasonpass?  

 

 

Premier League Pass is setup in a similar method (just for licensing reasons they can only store the games till the next round are played). NHL.TV, NBA Gamepass, MLB, MLS, NFL etc all have the model of "on demand" which is what consumers want.

 

The only reason I can see Sky scrapping that is due to financial reasons (e.g. the costs of doing so outweighed the revenue coming in) which really is another situation where the rights model is broken and big media aren't listening to what the consumer wants.


1690 posts

Uber Geek


  # 1511461 11-Mar-2016 16:27
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voy1d:

 

ockel:

 

 

 

Unclear if there are rights implications - what the broadcaster is/is not allowed to do with the content.  Is anyone aware of any other broadcaster offering anything remotely like last years F1 seasonpass?  

 

 

Premier League Pass is setup in a similar method (just for licensing reasons they can only store the games till the next round are played). NHL.TV, NBA Gamepass, MLB, MLS, NFL etc all have the model of "on demand" which is what consumers want.

 

The only reason I can see Sky scrapping that is due to financial reasons (e.g. the costs of doing so outweighed the revenue coming in) which really is another situation where the rights model is broken and big media aren't listening to what the consumer wants.

 

 

If the costs outweigh the revenue then the business model fails - not a function of the rights model being broken.  If I buy something to sell and I cant recoup the costs of doing business then I exit the market.  

 

If PremierLeaguePass cant afford the increase in value of the rights does that mean that big media arent listening to the consumer?  Or that the consumer just doesnt want to pay for it?  The Premier League will quite happily tell you, based on the total rights sales for the 2016-2018 period (and the resulting value increase) that the rights model doesnt seem to be broken.  


169 posts

Master Geek


  # 1511474 11-Mar-2016 16:42
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Poor choice of words.

 

From a consumers point of view the model is broken because it is not giving them what they want (funnily enough consumers will part with money for services) and the model for what a consumer wants is being driven by the media companies. They are telling the consumers what they want / not budging on the product and simply therefore for any consumer to get what they want you'd need to see a mass boycott, which won't happen.

 

Personally, I haven't kept up with the situation with the EPL rights, however I expect that if Sky pick up the rights then I just won't watch it. Why? Because I don't like being dictated to as to how I consume my media. That and I don't often get the chance to watch games live, the ability to watch them when I wake up is a huge drawcard - if I lose that ability then I will just go source the games via other methods.

 

To be honest, sporting organisations could do a lot to learn from the US model where the broadcasts are owned by the sports organisations and the like of Sky only buy the rights to rebroadcast it. They don't get exclusive digital delivery. This model works because there are consumers like myself who would quite happily pay the annual fee to get access to the online platform.

 

 

 

Netflix entering the NZ market has proven that with Lightbox providing a somewhat competitive service (and NEON is doomed to fail because Sky just don't get it). Despite what Sky and other broadcasters believe the model is archaic and in the eyes of most rational consumers broken.


 
 
 
 


1690 posts

Uber Geek


  # 1511485 11-Mar-2016 17:07
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voy1d:

 

Poor choice of words.

 

From a consumers point of view the model is broken because it is not giving them what they want (funnily enough consumers will part with money for services) and the model for what a consumer wants is being driven by the media companies. They are telling the consumers what they want / not budging on the product and simply therefore for any consumer to get what they want you'd need to see a mass boycott, which won't happen.

 

Personally, I haven't kept up with the situation with the EPL rights, however I expect that if Sky pick up the rights then I just won't watch it. Why? Because I don't like being dictated to as to how I consume my media. That and I don't often get the chance to watch games live, the ability to watch them when I wake up is a huge drawcard - if I lose that ability then I will just go source the games via other methods.

 

To be honest, sporting organisations could do a lot to learn from the US model where the broadcasts are owned by the sports organisations and the like of Sky only buy the rights to rebroadcast it. They don't get exclusive digital delivery. This model works because there are consumers like myself who would quite happily pay the annual fee to get access to the online platform.

 

 

 

Netflix entering the NZ market has proven that with Lightbox providing a somewhat competitive service (and NEON is doomed to fail because Sky just don't get it). Despite what Sky and other broadcasters believe the model is archaic and in the eyes of most rational consumers broken.

 

 

And yet Foxtel grows subscribers in the first year of Netflix competition.  Broadcast TV consumption declines is Australia by a little more.  Netflix Australia penetration seems to be plateauing (or slowing).  Research in Australia shows that OTT services complement paytv - and seem to be hurting the traditional ad-funded broadcasting model.

 

Broadcast TV consumption in the US declines at a lesser rate than the previous year. Netflix rates of growth in the US undershoot expectations quarter on quarter (lets just blame the credit card problem).

 

Netflix UK penetration in the UK seems to be plateauing (any growth seems to be at the expense of Amazon).  Sky UK continues to grow customers and revenue.

 

And Sky NZ adds customers and revenue. Go figure.

 

The model might be archaic and in your eyes broken but it continues to serve plenty of customers worldwide and generate returns.  The big bundle approach that persists in paytv land may not suit all (in fact it doesnt suit half of NZ homes, 2/3 of Australian homes, or half of the homes in the UK) but it suits plenty to keep the model viable.


169 posts

Master Geek


  # 1511510 11-Mar-2016 17:55
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I'm not sure what exactly you are trying to argue???????

 

 

 

I agree with you completely that the current model is f****d. I answered your question as to who else provides "season pass" type packages.


863 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 1511588 11-Mar-2016 20:40
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Pretty sure you got all cameras with the F1 pass last year, and I see that next week they have the practice on sky sport 4, and in car camera on a pop up channel. No pit lane like last year? Anyway since the in-car is on the pop-up you won't be able to watch it on fanpass. So sky have definitely taken a step back for some absurd reason. And as already mentioned the races are usually on during the night so some sort of on-demand facility is critical. Unsure they'll retain the f1 customers from last year with this strategy.

17639 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

  # 1511722 12-Mar-2016 07:56
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JarrodM: Pretty sure you got all cameras with the F1 pass last year, and I see that next week they have the practice on sky sport 4, and in car camera on a pop up channel. No pit lane like last year? Anyway since the in-car is on the pop-up you won't be able to watch it on fanpass. So sky have definitely taken a step back for some absurd reason. And as already mentioned the races are usually on during the night so some sort of on-demand facility is critical. Unsure they'll retain the f1 customers from last year with this strategy.

 

 

 

Not absurd. One is possibly money, if the rights holders, aka Bernie wanted more of it. Another is churn. If they felt that too many were churning as F1 on demand was too appealing, so we cancelled Sky and got Fanpass. Thats a business decision, and while its less than ideal for us, its sound for them. Non on demand makes most races unwatchable due to timing.


1738 posts

Uber Geek

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  # 1512494 13-Mar-2016 18:58
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In the hopes that someone from Sky actually reads this.

 

 

It would be great if there was an olympics pack that includes all the popup channels...

 

I'm guessing $50-75 or so would good value for the three week event for all channels (maybe more than what is on satelite)

 

Would expect it to be in 1080p ideally with 5.1 sound.

 

 

looks like there is going to be around 7,000 hours of coverage...




CPU: Intel 3770k| RAM: F3-2400C10D-16GTX G.Skill Trident X |MB:  Gigabyte Z77X-UD5H-WB | GFX: GV-N660OC-2GD gv-n660oc-2gd GeForce GTX 660 | Monitor: Qnix 27" 2560x1440

 

 


17639 posts

Uber Geek

Trusted

  # 1516311 20-Mar-2016 09:33
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Ive got to stump for Fanpass today for F1. I've read various good and bad feelings on image quality, so I am unsure how good it is. I'm used to plasma HD on Sky.

 

Ipad Air. I could watch on that, I guess the smaller screen should have good 720p like quality. Prefer not to due to screen size. 

 

TV. Not a smart TV, I can Airplay to ATV4 from iPad, how would that look on a 50 Plasma HD TV (Its a GOOD TV)

 

Retina Macbook Pro. I could watch via the Fanpass website, I'd be quite ok with that. I perceive website playback wont be as good as a dedicated app?

 

I don't expect Sky HD on satellite quality, but I hope its not that far off? I don't do buffer!

 

Thoughts?

 

 

 

PS: Fibre 100/20, AC router is in main living room, 4 metres from me. iPad and Macbook are AC


15 posts

Geek


  # 1517146 21-Mar-2016 19:15
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I found that last year it looked great on my 40" LCD streamed via a Chromecast - not quite as good as the satellite HD quality but not terrible! 80/20 UFB here.

I also tried playing it on my 15" laptop and connecting that to the TV via HDMI - don't think it looked quite as good but I can't remember.

Watched a fair bit on my smartphone last year, zero complaints with the quality of that stream either, and no buffering. From what i can see, the platform they're using (Neulion) is actually pretty good.

What did you end up doing? I went over the ditch to watch it IRL, looked pretty good that way ;) Will have to get fanpass going for Bahrain - although won't the race be at crazy o'clock here in NZ? Might have to try and automate a torrent download during the night and watch it when I get up...

Sky, if you're listening, I'd gladly pay you like I did last year but you've removed my ability to do so. I take the OPs comments on board about it possibly costing you more for the rights to provide delayed streaming F1 coverage via fanpass - but at least give me the option of paying more for it!!

It occurred to me that maybe Neulion charge more to set up and operate mutiple streams for on demand delayed coverage (FP1,2,3, qualy, the race x 21 over the whole year), whereas all you've got now is 4 channels streaming 24/7. So.. How about just delayed qualy and the race?? Please?!

782 posts

Ultimate Geek


  # 1524457 2-Apr-2016 10:03
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"Playback" now lets you catch up on events within the last 24 hours.

new Playback feature on PC and Mac enables you to go back in time up to 24 hours*, to the start of the match, at a time that suits you best.


Hopefully mobile access follows soon

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