WISP (Wireless Internet Service Provider) New Business

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sonyxperiageek

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# 2004158 28-Apr-2018 15:59

nickb800:

Can't see an internet cafe as a way to make money, except in extreme examples (e.g. middle of queenstown servicing tourists and transient workers). Don't think there's much demand for gaming rooms now that everyone has broadband at home and can Teamspeak their friends. If you want to do a cafe/catering then do that (although note that it's a hard way to make money and easy way too loose it too)

Regarding the WISP idea, are you looking to service an urban area or rural? Quite different proposition - urban you need to come in cheaper than fixed line, rural more about provider faster connection/more capacity than fixed line. Wireless broadband from Spark/Vodafone has taken some of both off both markets e.g. 4g home broadband for low users in urban areas, and RBI for rural.

I'd suggest starting a micro business serving your neighbours to slowly scale up and learn the networking side of things - e.g. get gigabit fibre at home, figure out which neighbours you can service with P2P wireless or cable (if they share a fence) and go door knocking with an offer they can't refuse e.g. $50 per month for unlimited. Unlimited means that you don't need a billing system. Yes this is a rough way to go about it, but treat it as a learning opportunity that might make you a bit of pocket money, and expand from there.

Which ISP would allow you to re-sell home fibre? Also, what about if they start downloading illegal content?

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sparkz25

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# 2004193 28-Apr-2018 17:37

sonyxperiageek:

nickb800:

Can't see an internet cafe as a way to make money, except in extreme examples (e.g. middle of queenstown servicing tourists and transient workers). Don't think there's much demand for gaming rooms now that everyone has broadband at home and can Teamspeak their friends. If you want to do a cafe/catering then do that (although note that it's a hard way to make money and easy way too loose it too)

Regarding the WISP idea, are you looking to service an urban area or rural? Quite different proposition - urban you need to come in cheaper than fixed line, rural more about provider faster connection/more capacity than fixed line. Wireless broadband from Spark/Vodafone has taken some of both off both markets e.g. 4g home broadband for low users in urban areas, and RBI for rural.

I'd suggest starting a micro business serving your neighbours to slowly scale up and learn the networking side of things - e.g. get gigabit fibre at home, figure out which neighbours you can service with P2P wireless or cable (if they share a fence) and go door knocking with an offer they can't refuse e.g. $50 per month for unlimited. Unlimited means that you don't need a billing system. Yes this is a rough way to go about it, but treat it as a learning opportunity that might make you a bit of pocket money, and expand from there.

Which ISP would allow you to re-sell home fibre? Also, what about if they start downloading illegal content?

you would need to find a backhaul provider that you can rely on that has enough peering around the place so that you dont have much down time if it ever arose, mainly because i dont think that the likes of the RSP (spark,vodafone,2degrees) would like it if you were selling their service and they weren't getting a cut

we are currently looking at starting a VISP as our current service provider has let us down so much we are still having issues after a month of faults and no resolutions to fix the problem, and the customer service has turned to S**T.

a month on still no fix, no call backs and no information as to what the problem is!

sdavisnz

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# 2004215 28-Apr-2018 18:42

@OP

Where in nz are you located?

Voice gives context

Linux

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# 2004217 28-Apr-2018 18:43

@makmak Would work better

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hio77

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# 2004221 28-Apr-2018 18:54

spa

you would need to find a backhaul provider that you can rely on that has enough peering around the place so that you dont have much down time if it ever arose, mainly because i dont think that the likes of the RSP (spark,vodafone,2degrees) would like it if you were selling their service and they weren't getting a cut

we are currently looking at starting a VISP as our current service provider has let us down so much we are still having issues after a month of faults and no resolutions to fix the problem, and the customer service has turned to S**T.

a month on still no fix, no call backs and no information as to what the problem is!

That sounds to me like a access provider fault rather than service provider.

In other words as a provider you would be just as much up sh!t creak getting things resolved.

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Any comments made are personal opinion and do not reflect directly on the position my current or past employers may have.

sparkz25

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# 2004231 28-Apr-2018 19:15

hio77:
spa

you would need to find a backhaul provider that you can rely on that has enough peering around the place so that you dont have much down time if it ever arose, mainly because i dont think that the likes of the RSP (spark,vodafone,2degrees) would like it if you were selling their service and they weren't getting a cut

we are currently looking at starting a VISP as our current service provider has let us down so much we are still having issues after a month of faults and no resolutions to fix the problem, and the customer service has turned to S**T.

a month on still no fix, no call backs and no information as to what the problem is!

That sounds to me like a access provider fault rather than service provider.

In other words as a provider you would be just as much up sh!t creak getting things resolved.

its a backhaul issue from what we have figured out, currently have 2 connections at home and one is in the bin with 100-150mbit speeds and a truck load of packet loss the other has 800-900mbit with out any issues all from the same RSP but 2 different backhaul providers

CamH

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# 2004290 28-Apr-2018 20:40

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First off, I'd like to applaud you trying to learn about what you're trying to do instead of just rushing in and hiring a bunch of people, taking out loans etc and then crashing. I personally have owned both an internet cafe and currently own a RSP (that's an internet - retail service provider) and so I have a bit of advice:

1) Internet cafe - Don't do it. We purchased an internet cafe in early 2016 to turn it into something else, but had about 9 months before we could get everything in with a proper fit out. When we purchased it, it wasn't a very nice place, so we painted, renovated, upgraded and it was in a very good area with good signage (surrounded by backpackers in the middle of Auckland Central), plus we catered to gamers.

It made no money. Absolutely nothing. The cost to staff the place was more than it was making. Even before you factor in computer upgrades, cleaning, power, rent etc - you'll realize it's not worth it. You won't get people paying more than $3 per hour. That means you need a minimum of 6 computers utilized at all times to pay someone minimum wage. Then on top of that, it's all the expenses I mentioned above. You'd also need a commercial printer as most people who visit internet cafes will want to print as well. The leases for those things aren't cheap and they're not generally worth buying as service cost outweighs the point of purchase.

Just take a look on TradeMe for Internet Cafes. There's quite a few of them, and they've all been there for a while with no changes other than the price of each one dropping every few months.

2) Computer repairs in an Internet cafe - People don't tend to like it. I run a few companies, and given most of them do computer repair, we incorporated computer repair into the aforementioned internet cafe. A lot of people didn't bother to come in once they learned we were also an internet cafe. You'd be better running a computer repair store standalone.

3) Commercial Kitchen in Internet cafe - I think you're possibly trying to do WAY too many things at once. Also, I don't know where you'll find a place that'll be suitable for both businesses. Commercial kitchens are generally away from any CBD sort of area which is where you'd need to be for an internet cafe. Pick one thing and stick to it. It's not ever as easy as you imagine to start / run a business - trying to do multiple at the same time will see you burn out or destroy the businesses because you can't spend enough time on each one.

4) WISP - You really need engineers who know what they're doing. Let's say it's 4am and your network crashes. What do you do? You check everything's powered up, but what now? You've got 20 angry customers, trying to get a hold of your for a solution. Are you going to be climbing on roofs in a storm to check transmitters and running cabling? I'd highly suggest going and getting some work experience with a WISP or even an RSP to start with - I mean, the fact that you think selling off a business grade internet connection will be OK proves that you're nowhere near the level you'd need to be at, and you probably won't get there without some proper training - it's not an easy thing to learn yourself.

If you want to have a chat, feel free to send me a PM. I started at 17 with no money and just a few credit cards from the bank but I started doing just one thing and that was incredibly hard in itself.

hio77

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# 2004294 28-Apr-2018 21:04

CamH:

If you want to have a chat, feel free to send me a PM. I started at 17 with no money and just a few credit cards from the bank but I started doing just one thing and that was incredibly hard in itself.

Interesting, didn't realize that's where you started!

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myfullflavour

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# 2004302 28-Apr-2018 21:38

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The minute you ask for multiple IPv4 on your connection your ISP is probably going to pass you over to a BDM and you’ll be quoted commercial rates.

To give you an idea, 100Mbps bandwidth in the non-residential world costs $1000/month.

A few providers will allow you to resell their services and maybe over time you might be able to build up some scale to justify running your own network.

toejam316

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# 2004311 28-Apr-2018 22:09

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Regarding the WISP thing - find the nearest local WISP to your intended service area, reach out to them, and organize a business meeting to see if you can become involved in their business through investment or reselling, and potentially offering to help invest in new infrastructure in your intended target area for a cut of the profits returned.

Starting a WISP or any ISP is no small feat - to be successful you need to have either boatloads of money (see Lightwire), or all the know how and then some to do the entire thing front to back yourself on a shoestring budget. I won't go into specifics, but suffice to say the $15,000 you're talking about wouldn't cover a full tower build and deployment on a proper WISP scale, however might cover a lower scale "I have wifi at my house in the hills and my neighbours all nick it" sort of scenario. The internet market is incredibly low margin at the best of times, and not a place to be with no experience or knowledge, and I'd really recommend if you want to be involved, you find someone who's done all the hard yards, and is already established, and team up with them to save yourself a lot of troubles.

Given everything I know about WISPs and todays market, I wouldn't try and establish one, certainly not on such a tight budget. This is remortgage the house sort of stuff, if you're really serious about starting up and hitting any scale beyond immediate neighbours. If you are dead set serious on it, feel free to reach out and I might be able to gather some more info and put you in touch with some people, however beyond real cursory stuff I think you'll quickly find a wall where you need to hire people to generate quotes and solutions.

Aredwood

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# 2004313 28-Apr-2018 22:16

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As for the catering business idea. Probably a lot easier to approach a large restaurant that only opens during the evening. And offer to rent their kitchen while they are closed. You will probably have to offer quite a high rent, to cover the cost of the power / water / gas. But at least you can get started without having to buy much apart from food. So would be a far less risky way of starting a catering business compared to building a commercial kitchen from scratch.

nickb800

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# 2004357 29-Apr-2018 07:45

sonyxperiageek:

nickb800:

working side of things - e.g. get gigabit fibre at home, figure out which neighbours you can service with P2P wireless or cable (if they share a fence) and go door knocking with an offer they can't refuse e.g. $50 per month for unlimited. Unlimited means that you don't need a billing system. Yes this is a rough way to go about it, but treat it as a learning opportunity that might make you a bit of pocket money, and expand from there.

Which ISP would allow you to re-sell home fibre? Also, what about if they start downloading illegal content?

As I said, it's a rough approach to create a learning opportunity for the networking. Yes it would breach ISP T&Cs, and wouldn't go well if a customer downloads illegal content, but realistically his chances of getting pinged for either with (say) 5 neighbours connected to his home fibre is slim.

As he scales up, sure, he will need to get a connection that he is authorised to resell, and sort out TISCA stuff too.

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