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  Reply # 591690 7-Mar-2012 13:01
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stevenz: Given that UFB will still be years away for many (most?) people - what're odds of it helping to push the existing DSL prices down? Or is saturation so small that DSL providers aren't likely to care at this stage?

Eventually I think either Fibre prices will go up or DSL will have to go down. 

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  Reply # 591698 7-Mar-2012 13:09
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codyc1515:
stevenz: Given that UFB will still be years away for many (most?) people - what're odds of it helping to push the existing DSL prices down? Or is saturation so small that DSL providers aren't likely to care at this stage?

Eventually I think either Fibre prices will go up or DSL will have to go down. 


You're wrong on DSL pricing.

ADSL2+ in NZ is a regulated offering with prices set by the Commerce Commission. They very clearly indicated late last year that we will see access prices increasing, not decreasing.

     

 
 
 
 


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  Reply # 591702 7-Mar-2012 13:13
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sbiddle:
codyc1515:
stevenz: Given that UFB will still be years away for many (most?) people - what're odds of it helping to push the existing DSL prices down? Or is saturation so small that DSL providers aren't likely to care at this stage?

Eventually I think either Fibre prices will go up or DSL will have to go down. 


You're wrong on DSL pricing.

ADSL2+ in NZ is a regulated offering with prices set by the Commerce Commission. They very clearly indicated late last year that we will see access prices increasing, not decreasing.

     

Sure but just because the access price is going up does not mean that the end user price will go up.

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  Reply # 591706 7-Mar-2012 13:19
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allio:
NonprayingMantis:
I'm guessing you didn't look very hard because I found one in the very first country I checked and with thevery first provider

http://www.iinet.net.au/nbn/nbn-plan-residential.html

40GB (20 peak, 20 offpeak) for $55AU (excluding phoneline of $10AU) on iinet's NBN closest (but a bit worse) 30Mbps/10Mbps we have.


Right, but you forgot to mention the 1000GB you get for $84.95. If Orcon was offering something in the same universe as that, I wouldn't be in this thread complaining, I'd be out on the street with a bottle of bubbles!

NonprayingMantis:
Telstra offers $80 (includuing phoneline) for a measly 5GB on their 25Mbps service as their entry level NBN plan.
http://www.telstra.com.au/bigpond-internet/national-broadband-network/our-plans/


Good find (that is pretty appalling) but again, you forget to mention that for just ten dollars more you get 200GB....


Your question was whether plans with small datacaps exist – I provided three concrete examples.

If you want to talk about whether larger plans also exist, well of course they do. 
Orcon’s 1TB plan at $199NZ, of course, more expensive than the iiNet one (which works out to be around $110NZD, plus landline), but then the 1TB at iiNet consists of 500GB peak and 500GB off-peak.  Orcon’s datacap is anytime – which counts for quite a lot.

In comparison to the telstra one,  yes Telstra offer a 200GB plan for $90AU, approx $120NZD.  Orcon offers 100GB for $99NZD.  so less data, but also significantly cheaper cost.

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  Reply # 591707 7-Mar-2012 13:20
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codyc1515:

Sure but just because the access price is going up does not mean that the end user price will go up.


[Note this is my personal view and represents the view of no company in the known universe]

OK, so the access price may be going up. Do you believe that any part of supporting a faster network with a need for a lot of new systems and different assure processes, which is capable of far higher speeds and has already had plans announced with many times the traffic allowance, will be cheaper?

Cheers - N

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  Reply # 591709 7-Mar-2012 13:22
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Talkiet:  OK, so the access price may be going up. Do you believe that any part of supporting a faster network with a need for a lot of new systems and different assure processes, which is capable of far higher speeds and has already had plans announced with many times the traffic allowance, will be cheaper?

Cheers - N


Yes, and they are in Australia.

NBN is pricing cheaper than existing DSL services.




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  Reply # 591717 7-Mar-2012 13:30
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DonGould:
Talkiet:  OK, so the access price may be going up. Do you believe that any part of supporting a faster network with a need for a lot of new systems and different assure processes, which is capable of far higher speeds and has already had plans announced with many times the traffic allowance, will be cheaper?

Cheers - N


Yes, and they are in Australia.

NBN is pricing cheaper than existing DSL services.


The NBN and pricing in Australia isn't as comparable to the situation here as you'd like to think. Plus... remind me again how much the NBN cost the taxpayers over there again...

In addition, my point above made no reference to Australia. It made reference to cost drivers that will directly affect the pricing of UFB plans.

Cheers - N


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  Reply # 591893 7-Mar-2012 18:50
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Talkiet: The NBN and pricing in Australia isn't as comparable to the situation here as you'd like to think.


I disagree.

Talkiet:  Plus... remind me again how much the NBN cost the taxpayers over there again...


Nothing.  It's not on budget and all being funded by debt with a proposed eventual privatisation when completed.

Talkiet: In addition, my point above made no reference to Australia. It made reference to cost drivers that will directly affect the pricing of UFB plans.


Understood.

The charging model being used by NBNCo is/has lead to ISPs publishing lower costs for fibre than DSL and my point was simply that I see no reason why that should not be the case in New Zealand.

I do understand why DSL prices might be higher than the new fibre.

I do get that there are new processes to pay for, though I get the impression that their might be people talking that up just to clip the ticket.

I watched a presentation by Chorus on UFB recently where someone did a whole talk comparing UFB to some car company in Europe.  It's no wonder that services are expensive if staff are being paid to dream up that junk.

The new fibre should present much less cost to maintain.  

It seems clear that the Australian are passing saving on to consumers.








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  Reply # 592122 8-Mar-2012 08:34
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I don't know if anyone has noticed, but Chorus have updated the map with their Year 2 rollout plans.

http://www.chorus.co.nz/fibre-rollout-map

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  Reply # 592166 8-Mar-2012 09:51
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Doh, looks like I'll be waiting until 2014 for fibre at my place.

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  Reply # 592247 8-Mar-2012 12:04
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I wonder how much money will be wasted on equipment which will account client's traffic (in case if everyone will switch on 100Mbit/s channels).
I mean, channel/routing equipment is rather simple and stateless (and this is the major ISP function).
Accounting, on the other hand, assumes per-client counters which should be incremented for each passing packet.
I guess, at some point half of isp income should be spent on billing system support.

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  Reply # 592287 8-Mar-2012 13:12
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Kraven: I don't know if anyone has noticed, but Chorus have updated the map with their Year 2 rollout plans.

http://www.chorus.co.nz/fibre-rollout-map

Yeah, saw that yesterday. Guess I will be waiting indefinitely. Looks like all of Feilding is past the 2 year mark...

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  Reply # 595291 14-Mar-2012 20:31
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A school I know of will not be able to afford UFB as the monthly connection fee exceeds there budget. That fee is before the data charges. Seems a bit strange considering the government has been going on about the roll out to rural schools.

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  Reply # 595292 14-Mar-2012 20:31
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A school I know of will not be able to afford UFB as the monthly connection fee exceeds there budget. That fee is before the data charges. Seems a bit strange considering the government has been going on about the roll out to rural schools.

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  Reply # 595322 14-Mar-2012 21:15
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lets take a look at some numbers in a different way, from the eyes of a business:

'now':
5 analog lines for a company: 5 @ $40 = $200
'business' adsl with 60GB for company : $100
static ip for that 'business' connection: $20
total: $320/month

with 'ufb':
fibre 100/50 ufb connection with 300GB data = $299
static ip/subnet = $20 (possibly even included in above)
sip channels 5 @$15 = $75 (seems to be the going rate)
total = $394

so based on that, you're going to get a huge upgrade on the internet, probably a more stable service, and you're only going to pay $70 more per month. why all the bitching? is internet not as important as regular telephone lines to businessed in this country - it would seem so when you compare the avg spend against each by small businesses....




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