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  Reply # 731377 12-Dec-2012 13:34
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mattwnz:
robjg63:
I believe we have the commerce commission to thank for the credit card surcharges. It used to be illegal to charge extra for a credit card transaction. The credit card companies of course took a cut and the vendor (and I suppose the odd person who paid cash) would subsidise the credit card transaction. Anyway - you saw a price and thats what you paid.


Did it used to be illegal? I thought it was  previously against credit card companies terms for their vendors to add fees as extra onto the price. But the comcom instead made it possible for companies to add on the credit card fees?




Yeah I thought this was the case too.  Visa strictly prohibited it, especially during the Sydney 2000 Olympics, so Taxi companies over there refused to accept Visa.  Luckily I was aware at the time and had cash on hand.

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  Reply # 731418 12-Dec-2012 14:39
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timmmay: They didn't say how many hours labour, they just give a total amount.

The lights required no new cable AFAIK. The room isn't that big, if he used 12 meter of cable I'd be very surprised, more likely it was closer to 4m. Half of the power points already had cable to them and he didn't change the cables.


Wasn't someone there to verify the time they spent onsite?



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  Reply # 731424 12-Dec-2012 14:49
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No, since it's my neighbour and they've done work for me before I give them access. The builder was there. I charge significantly more than they do, if I have to take time off to watch them the bill more than doubles.




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  Reply # 731425 12-Dec-2012 14:51
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timmmay: No, since it's my neighbour and they've done work for me before I give them access. The builder was there. I charge significantly more than they do, if I have to take time off to watch them the bill more than doubles.


The payment shouldn't be a problem:) But I know where you are coming from, but I think in this situation and the fact you didn't get a quote or estimate it is probably a reasonable price in the circumstances.

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  Reply # 731433 12-Dec-2012 14:59
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timmmay: No, since it's my neighbour and they've done work for me before I give them access. The builder was there. I charge significantly more than they do, if I have to take time off to watch them the bill more than doubles.


Hmm without an estimate, quote or something to go back on, then I don't think there is much you can say about it. I've been in the same position, and it's irksome, but I think pay and move on. 

The labour content surprised me the most, the rest looked fine. 

Because he is your neighbour and it's awkward to fall out with them, I'd not say anything, and not use him again. 

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  Reply # 731478 12-Dec-2012 16:36
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I just had 12 hours electrical work done. Wired up 4 light fittings, 6 power points, 3 cat 6 outlets and a TV aerial. Cost me $1500. Very happy with the price for the work. I supplied all parts.

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  Reply # 731533 12-Dec-2012 18:03
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Dhaya: I just had 12 hours electrical work done. Wired up 4 light fittings, 6 power points, 3 cat 6 outlets and a TV aerial. Cost me $1500. Very happy with the price for the work. I supplied all parts.


Thats a huge hourly rate though. More than many professionals who have spent years at uni. The thing is that many get their apprentices to do the work which is cheaper for them, they then check it to make sure it is ok.



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  Reply # 731537 12-Dec-2012 18:12
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Dhaya: I just had 12 hours electrical work done. Wired up 4 light fittings, 6 power points, 3 cat 6 outlets and a TV aerial. Cost me $1500. Very happy with the price for the work. I supplied all parts.


That's a huge hourly rate.




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  Reply # 731800 13-Dec-2012 09:43
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mattwnz:
Dhaya: I just had 12 hours electrical work done. Wired up 4 light fittings, 6 power points, 3 cat 6 outlets and a TV aerial. Cost me $1500. Very happy with the price for the work. I supplied all parts.


Thats a huge hourly rate though. More than many professionals who have spent years at uni. The thing is that many get their apprentices to do the work which is cheaper for them, they then check it to make sure it is ok.



Difference is that many professionals sit at a desk and work 8 hours a day (I said many, not all)

Tradies often have a lot of downtime between jobs, incidental expenses that cannot be charged for (tools wear out or break, vehicle maintenance, ongoing training for different systems, massive ACC bills for being in a 'hazardous' occupation etc etc)

Additionally you say many professionals who have spent years at uni.... Electricians spend a minimum of 3 years training... I know a few that spent 4 or 5 years training, and then there is ongoing professional development for the decent ones.

I really think people in this thread are underestimating the cost of running a business - for example an accountancy firm... they may pay some of their staff the equivalent of $30 (or more... not sure) an hour... but they charge their clients a damn side more than that.

Don't get charge out rates confused with wages!

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  Reply # 731806 13-Dec-2012 09:46
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yep, and if the parts are being supplied then the contractor has no other way of making margin other than the labour charge.

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  Reply # 732945 15-Dec-2012 18:18
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Evilg:
Don't get charge out rates confused with wages!


Exactly.  The invoice charged for seems more than reasonable to me.


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  Reply # 732955 15-Dec-2012 18:36
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Evilg: 
Tradies often have a lot of downtime between jobs, incidental expenses that cannot be charged for (tools wear out or break, vehicle maintenance, ongoing training for different systems, massive ACC bills for being in a 'hazardous' occupation etc etc)

Additionally you say many professionals who have spent years at uni.... Electricians spend a minimum of 3 years training... I know a few that spent 4 or 5 years training, and then there is ongoing professional development for the decent ones.


Don't get charge out rates confused with wages!


My profession requires a minimum of 8 years of uni and then work experience prior to registration, and even then the hourly rate is less for people high up. Also equipment costs , onging registration, insurance, CPD costs are also very high. 
Downtime applies to all professions, as is the unbilled time doing quotes, travel etc. I accept acc maybe higher, but then again being a trained electrician should be a safe job if you are following all the rules, and not taking risks. But target TV showed that many do take risks.

I have just had an electrician quote for some work, and their quote was at about $60 an hour, which I think is reasonable and think is probably at the lower end of the scale.

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  Reply # 732965 15-Dec-2012 18:56
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mattwnz:

My profession requires a minimum of 8 years of uni and then work experience prior to registration, and even then the hourly rate is less for people high up. Also equipment costs , onging registration, insurance, CPD costs are also very high. 
Downtime applies to all professions, as is the unbilled time doing quotes, travel etc. I accept acc maybe higher, but then again being a trained electrician should be a safe job if you are following all the rules, and not taking risks. But target TV showed that many do take risks.

I have just had an electrician quote for some work, and their quote was at about $60 an hour, which I think is reasonable and think is probably at the lower end of the scale.


got to remember that the domestic side of electrical work is dead easy, you want to see some real skill go take a look at some of the work Industrial electricians do.

(not wanting to offend) Domestic electricains are really the bottom end of the trade and that's why domestic trades are featured on Tv shows like target.

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  Reply # 732979 15-Dec-2012 21:17
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gregmcc:
mattwnz:

My profession requires a minimum of 8 years of uni and then work experience prior to registration, and even then the hourly rate is less for people high up. Also equipment costs , onging registration, insurance, CPD costs are also very high. 
Downtime applies to all professions, as is the unbilled time doing quotes, travel etc. I accept acc maybe higher, but then again being a trained electrician should be a safe job if you are following all the rules, and not taking risks. But target TV showed that many do take risks.

I have just had an electrician quote for some work, and their quote was at about $60 an hour, which I think is reasonable and think is probably at the lower end of the scale.


got to remember that the domestic side of electrical work is dead easy, you want to see some real skill go take a look at some of the work Industrial electricians do.

(not wanting to offend) Domestic electricains are really the bottom end of the trade and that's why domestic trades are featured on Tv shows like target.


Domestic is completely different to commercial or industrial, so I'm not surprised if they charge a lil less.

I know that following the rules makes it safe, but it still only takes one lil slip to touch something live, we can't see it, we can't hear it, we can't smell it, we only feel it when it's too late. . . .

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  Reply # 733093 16-Dec-2012 11:39
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I think if the components are not ones you can get from bunnings/placemakers/mitre10, they tend to be expensive. Also I don't know if its normal, but the main specialist supplier of light switches etc here is trade only, they don't supply the public (or if they do, it is $$$).

And in my experience electricians are just expensive full stop. I don't think your bill was particularly expensive, probably just a matter of you asking for a pricing indication before the job is done next time.

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