Geekzone: technology news, blogs, forums
Guest
Welcome Guest.
You haven't logged in yet. If you don't have an account you can register now.




3091 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 509

Trusted

Topic # 147222 12-Jun-2014 20:04
Send private message

Does anyone know of a product that one can buy off the shelf that converts hydrogen into power.
Am looking for something around 50 watts output.  

I have seen on amazon, the small cellphone chargers and bike lamps that run on hydrogen.

When I google for hydrogen generators or fuel cells, it only seems to return results in converting water into hydrogen, where I am looking for the reverse - converting hydrogen into power.




Ray Taylor
Taylor Broadband (rural hawkes bay)
www.ruralkiwi.com

There is no place like localhost
For my general guide to extending your wireless network Click Here




View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic
 1 | 2

gzt

9147 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1290


  Reply # 1064487 12-Jun-2014 21:51
Send private message

You are looking for 'hydrogen fuel cell'. Horizon are the leader in off the shelf.

http://www.horizonfuelcell.com/#!portable-fuel-cells/c1rvs

gzt

9147 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1290


  Reply # 1064500 12-Jun-2014 22:08
Send private message

BOC use Horizon as OEM for the Hymera range. BOC in NZ also BOC medical. I'd be surprised if they carry stock but at least it's a local supplier.

 
 
 
 


2319 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 533

Subscriber

  Reply # 1064623 13-Jun-2014 02:43
Send private message

Sounds interesting - can you tell us more about what you are doing?



3091 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 509

Trusted

  Reply # 1064626 13-Jun-2014 04:04
Send private message

eracode: Sounds interesting - can you tell us more about what you are doing?


We have a 60 watt load at a remote site and am trying to work out how to power it.
15x deep cycle batteries is a huge cost to replace every 3 years at $6k

Wind is not acceptable.

Solar requires a huge battery battery bank and 900 watts of solar array.

So I thought hydrogen - I was reading about fuel cells around 5 years ago and couldnt find the particular product I was looking for.
But the hydromax 150 looks like it would be perfect.

However looking at the cost of setting up a 300 litre storage system to provide a month or two worth of power may be still uneconomic. Even though we visit the sites every 2 months anyway.


I thought, if we went down the hydrogen + solar path and used the excess solar energy to make hydrogen onsite using a hydrogen generator and a large water tank, and then stored the hydrogen for reconversion to power after a couple of days of rain, but it looks like the tank pressures required would be too complicated





Ray Taylor
Taylor Broadband (rural hawkes bay)
www.ruralkiwi.com

There is no place like localhost
For my general guide to extending your wireless network Click Here




829 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 113

Trusted

  Reply # 1064627 13-Jun-2014 05:06
Send private message

There was a methane fuel cell manufacturer at rfuanz last month showing off their product which is used by the NZTA to power a radio site near Milford sound. Maybe a quick google on that project might help and they have them in use in NZ conditions now

563 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 89


Reply # 1064665 13-Jun-2014 08:44
Send private message

Slightly off topic; but I've always wondered about storing energy as gravitational-potential.

i.e. A rig with a sufficiently heavy weight slowly raised mechanically on a cable, either [directly by wind turbine or via solar-powered DC motor] and appropriate gear ratios.

Energy would be retrieved from the system by lowering the weight causing a DC motor (generator) to turn, all controlled by a computer of course.

Advantages;

 

  • Kinetic energy can be stored directly by attaching directly to gear system (i.e. wind/hydro turbines).
  • Solar / electrical energy can stored via DC motor.
  • No minimum power output requirement of turbine or motor as gear ratio can be adjusted accordingly on-the-fly to enable continuous storage of energy.
  • Weight system could be buried underground or surface-mounted and consist of any material (old engine block or 1000L water cylinder).

Haven't crunched the physics on it though to see what weight's / cable length's would be required to store a decent amount of power.

829 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 113

Trusted

  Reply # 1064670 13-Jun-2014 08:58
Send private message

This is done on a small scale in Africa, to drive leds that minimise the risk of naked flames.

Anyway maybe the bayliss spring could be a starter?

563 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 89


  Reply # 1064675 13-Jun-2014 09:15
Send private message


1724 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 885


  Reply # 1064677 13-Jun-2014 09:18
Send private message

This stuff probably needs it's own thread folks




Location: Dunedin

2676 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 526


  Reply # 1064680 13-Jun-2014 09:21
One person supports this post
Send private message

Try Methanol, its a more mature tech,

Apparently NIWA are using it to power some of their remote date collectors

From:

http://www.niwa.co.nz/publications/isu/instrument-systems-update-17-may-2011/new-sodar-makes-the-wind-visible

"The fuel cell The fuel cell converts chemical energy stored in the methanol fuel into electrical energy. It can supply up to 65 Watts of power continuously. A 28-litre cartridge of methanol will power the SODAR 24 hours a day for around three weeks. To reduce the amount of methanol needed and to extend the time between site visits the power supply is supplemented with solar panels."


Sounds almost exactly what you are wanting, might pay to give someone a call and see where they got it and how much it cost...

954 posts

Ultimate Geek
+1 received by user: 138

UberGroup

  Reply # 1064682 13-Jun-2014 09:25
One person supports this post
Send private message

Hydrogen is a slippery thing and even thinking about generating it would require far more energy input than you would get out.

I would more look at methanol, less leaky and less explody but still burny lol. The Efoy line uses about 1L of methanol per kwh, 50w is about 1.2kwh a day so you'd need 100l for a 3 month supply but I'd put up a small solar array, small battery bank and an Efoy unit and you'd get 6 months between fueling




Most problems are the result of previous solutions...

All comment's I make are my own personal opinion and do not in any way, shape or form reflect the views of current or former employers unless specifically stated 



3091 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 509

Trusted

  Reply # 1064731 13-Jun-2014 10:31
Send private message

Okay so looking now at methanol.
Being a liquid it would be much easier for us to transport

Does anyone know where to buy methanol in large quantities, and if the fuel cells/generators are silent?

BOC doesnt list methanol on their website




Ray Taylor
Taylor Broadband (rural hawkes bay)
www.ruralkiwi.com

There is no place like localhost
For my general guide to extending your wireless network Click Here




1724 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 885


  Reply # 1064753 13-Jun-2014 10:55
Send private message

Check if Ethanol will do the same thing, it's a very similar substance and may be easier to get  in bulk. Most RTD's are just a basic mix spiked with ethanol, and I've seen it in drums.

Otherwise, Race cars often run on Methanol, and I believe car clubs often get it by the drum.




Location: Dunedin

Fully Operational
3343 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 1088

Trusted
Vocus
Subscriber

  Reply # 1064763 13-Jun-2014 11:13
Send private message

kenkeniff:


There are a few problems with this concept...

1. When there is no solar or wind power available to lift the weight, and no load applied by the generator, the weight will be free to drop, wasting the stored energy.
2. The rotational speed of the generator will be wildly inconsistent depending on the load.
3. You need a very strong motor to lift the weight, and a fairly deep hole.  For eg. to store ~ 1 kWh of energy you need about 40 tonnes and a 10 metre deep hole.

2676 posts

Uber Geek
+1 received by user: 526


  Reply # 1064764 13-Jun-2014 11:14
Send private message

raytaylor: Okay so looking now at methanol.
Being a liquid it would be much easier for us to transport

Does anyone know where to buy methanol in large quantities, and if the fuel cells/generators are silent?

BOC doesnt list methanol on their website


try this list,

http://www.nzchemicalsuppliers.co.nz/list/search?search=methanol

Most suppliers will sell it to you in a 200 lites drum (40/44 Gallon)

http://www.tmkpackers.co.nz/index.php/site/product/methanol

Heck its probably even local, Methanex in Taranaki produce over 2 million tonnes of the stuff a year

 1 | 2
View this topic in a long page with up to 500 replies per page Create new topic



Twitter »

Follow us to receive Twitter updates when new discussions are posted in our forums:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when news items and blogs are posted in our frontpage:



Follow us to receive Twitter updates when tech item prices are listed in our price comparison site:





News »

Phone prices rising as users move upmarket
Posted 24-Nov-2017 17:16


Talking net neutrality on RNZ Nine-to-Noon
Posted 24-Nov-2017 12:11


Air New Zealand experiments with blockchain technology
Posted 23-Nov-2017 15:39


Symantec selects Amazon Web Services to deliver cloud security
Posted 23-Nov-2017 10:40


New Zealand Ministry of Education chooses Unisys for cloud-based education resourcing management system
Posted 22-Nov-2017 22:00


Business analytics software powers profits for NZ wine producers
Posted 22-Nov-2017 21:52


Pyrios strikes up alliance with Microsoft integrator UC Logiq
Posted 22-Nov-2017 21:51


The New Zealand IT services ecosystem - it's all digital down here
Posted 22-Nov-2017 21:49


Volvo to supply tens of thousands of autonomous drive compatible cars to Uber
Posted 22-Nov-2017 21:46


From small to medium and beyond: Navigating the ERP battlefield
Posted 21-Nov-2017 21:12


Business owners: ERP software selection starts (and finishes) with you
Posted 21-Nov-2017 21:11


Why I'm not an early adopter
Posted 21-Nov-2017 10:39


Netatmo launches smart home products in New Zealand
Posted 20-Nov-2017 20:06


Huawei Mate 10: Punchy, long battery life, artificial intelligence
Posted 20-Nov-2017 16:30


Propel launch Disney Star Wars Laser Battle Drones
Posted 19-Nov-2017 21:26



Geekzone Live »

Try automatic live updates from Geekzone directly in your browser, without refreshing the page, with Geekzone Live now.



Are you subscribed to our RSS feed? You can download the latest headlines and summaries from our stories directly to your computer or smartphone by using a feed reader.

Alternatively, you can receive a daily email with Geekzone updates.