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631 posts

Ultimate Geek


  #2412987 5-Feb-2020 12:30
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Be wary of changing plans if you're currently on Flixie and still have a way to go to the end of your 6 months.

 

In my case Flixie runs out in May, if I change to Earnie today then my Generation cost goes up 2c/kWh and I add a further 1.85c/kWh for the "Earnie Fee" ("Flixie Fee" is 0.15c/kWh). So I would be paying an extra 3.85c/kWh +GST for some rewards which sound exciting but are (I believe) intentionally difficult to quantify.


67 posts

Master Geek

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  #2424267 19-Feb-2020 21:43
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I've been looking at my rates with Electric Kiwi vs what I'd be paying for Flick on their Freestyle plan. These last few days, and I appreciate its only a few days, Flick has seemed considerably cheaper than my EK rates.

 

 

 

Take for example right now, my rate with EK is 26c/kWh, where as Flick are at 15.1c/kWh.  So a good 10c difference (both exc GST).  

 

 

 

I understand that the freestyle plan as the potential to sky rocket in price at any time without warning, but it seems like I'm paying almost double a lot of the time for my usage.  Am I missing something completely obvious here?! 


337 posts

Ultimate Geek

Lifetime subscriber

  #2424274 19-Feb-2020 22:00
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I was with Flick until the end of last year. I joined with their 12 month price guarantee. At the end of the 12 months Flick had cost me $400 more than the mainstream provider in my area that they compare with. They did give me a $400 credit on my account, but I had still paid out that out sooner than I should have.
With the volatility in the power market I would not join Flick without the 12 month guarantee.
I am not with Flick now.

SBQ

91 posts

Master Geek


  #2424490 20-Feb-2020 13:47
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Well I must say I enjoyed Genesis's 'Power Shout' on Monday night. I'm also quite certain if you live in Christchurch, Flick is not gonna save you $ compared to Genesis day / night rate plan.


192 posts

Master Geek

Lifetime subscriber

  #2424735 21-Feb-2020 06:02
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SBQ:

 

Well I must say I enjoyed Genesis's 'Power Shout' on Monday night. I'm also quite certain if you live in Christchurch, Flick is not gonna save you $ compared to Genesis day / night rate plan.

 

 

It depends what you're comparing. I'm currently with Flick Fixie in Christchurch, but may return to Freestyle later this year. Compared to what I'm paying now, Genesis appears to be a bit cheaper for a locked-in fixed term plan but a bit more expensive for an open plan.

 

And for me, money isn't the only consideration. Even if Genesis was the cheapest option by hundreds of dollars a year, I'd avoid them for moral reasons. My opinion based on quite a bit of reading about the NZ electricity market is that all the large gentailers are exploiting flaws in the market for profit and Genesis are the biggest cuplrit at that game,


54 posts

Master Geek


  #2425723 23-Feb-2020 01:23
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SBQ:

 

Well I must say I enjoyed Genesis's 'Power Shout' on Monday night. I'm also quite certain if you live in Christchurch, Flick is not gonna save you $ compared to Genesis day / night rate plan.

 

 

Genesis had over 60% retail customers in 2010 and they have been steadily losing market share so they now have less than 40%. They need more customers like you to convince others to join and turn things around for them. Have you thought aout starting another thread so you and other Genesis customers can talk about your deals and savings? Every little bit could help...


SBQ

91 posts

Master Geek


  #2425840 23-Feb-2020 11:45
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luckiestmanalive:

 

Genesis had over 60% retail customers in 2010 and they have been steadily losing market share so they now have less than 40%. They need more customers like you to convince others to join and turn things around for them. Have you thought aout starting another thread so you and other Genesis customers can talk about your deals and savings? Every little bit could help...

 

 

As a previous Flick customer for 2 years, it was clear I should not of switched over from Genesis customer. Of course not everyone has the same usage pattern but in my case, I can easily shift most of our power usage to off-peak times. The key distinction as I mentioned before on many pages ago, Genesis allowing the off-peak times throughout Saturday & Sunday vs Flick, the weekends were treated the same as week-days (off peak 9PM to 7AM). Despite the Christchurch power grid being owned by Orion (Who set these off-peak hours) I never knew why so many retailers have differences in time? I recall some on Contact having offpeak that kicks after 10pm or 11pm which is less useful for me.

What is the Genesis market share here in Christchurch?


192 posts

Master Geek

Lifetime subscriber

  #2425864 23-Feb-2020 13:08
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SBQ:

 

luckiestmanalive:

 

Genesis had over 60% retail customers in 2010 and they have been steadily losing market share so they now have less than 40%. They need more customers like you to convince others to join and turn things around for them. Have you thought aout starting another thread so you and other Genesis customers can talk about your deals and savings? Every little bit could help...

 

 

As a previous Flick customer for 2 years, it was clear I should not of switched over from Genesis customer. Of course not everyone has the same usage pattern but in my case, I can easily shift most of our power usage to off-peak times. The key distinction as I mentioned before on many pages ago, Genesis allowing the off-peak times throughout Saturday & Sunday vs Flick, the weekends were treated the same as week-days (off peak 9PM to 7AM). Despite the Christchurch power grid being owned by Orion (Who set these off-peak hours) I never knew why so many retailers have differences in time? I recall some on Contact having offpeak that kicks after 10pm or 11pm which is less useful for me.

What is the Genesis market share here in Christchurch?

 

 

Your comment about Flick treating weekend days like weekdays in Christchurch is bizarre to me. I switched over to Flick very promptly after they joined the Christchurch market and I got weekend days treated as off-peak from day one. Perhaps the problem may have been with your meter configuration?

 

If a separate thread about Genesis Energy is started, as a non-customer (for electricity or any other fuel) I generally would not participate, but I'll offer a starting topic for that. This was on the news last night:

 

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/residents-in-north-christchurch-suburb-living-fear-gas-explosion-local-business

 

Residents in north Christchurch suburb living in fear of gas explosion from local business

 

Residents in the Christchurch suburb of Northcote say they're living in fear, afraid of an explosion in their backyards.

 

That's because a local gas bottling company (Genesis Energy) has not being (sic) given resource consent for some of its operations.


SBQ

91 posts

Master Geek


  #2425896 23-Feb-2020 14:37
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heapsort:

 

Your comment about Flick treating weekend days like weekdays in Christchurch is bizarre to me. I switched over to Flick very promptly after they joined the Christchurch market and I got weekend days treated as off-peak from day one. Perhaps the problem may have been with your meter configuration?

 

If a separate thread about Genesis Energy is started, as a non-customer (for electricity or any other fuel) I generally would not participate, but I'll offer a starting topic for that. This was on the news last night:

 

https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/residents-in-north-christchurch-suburb-living-fear-gas-explosion-local-business

 

Residents in north Christchurch suburb living in fear of gas explosion from local business

 

Residents in the Christchurch suburb of Northcote say they're living in fear, afraid of an explosion in their backyards.

 

That's because a local gas bottling company (Genesis Energy) has not being (sic) given resource consent for some of its operations.

 

 

Flick has changed their off-peak schedule to reflect what it should be. BUT at the time I was with Flick over a year ago, they did not. Their pricing schedule clearly showed (use to be on a downloadable PDF file ie Christchurch_-_Price_Schedule_01_Apr_2017_Web_Schedules.pdf) weekends did not count as off-peak. So it wasn't simply an issue of the meter configuration despite having contacting them during the time to ask why (when Genesis did?) - they offered no reason.

As a company, i'm sure Genesis isn't so ethical and I don't bother with their LPG side of the business. What matters is they meet my needs on electricity and give me a fair price without the noise that I receive from many competing 'door knocking' retailers (from carbon emissions, generations, blah blah).

 

 


192 posts

Master Geek

Lifetime subscriber

  #2425907 23-Feb-2020 15:18
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SBQ:

 

Flick has changed their off-peak schedule to reflect what it should be. BUT at the time I was with Flick over a year ago, they did not. Their pricing schedule clearly showed (use to be on a downloadable PDF file ie Christchurch_-_Price_Schedule_01_Apr_2017_Web_Schedules.pdf) weekends did not count as off-peak. So it wasn't simply an issue of the meter configuration despite having contacting them during the time to ask why (when Genesis did?) - they offered no reason.

 

 

I have been with Flick in Christchurch for more than three years, with weekend days off-peak (like 9pm-7am night rates) every weekend. I don't recall ever seeing a document from them indicating peak rates would apply on weekends, which would have made my billing an anomaly. If I'm understanding correctly, you were with Flick in Christchurch for two years and had weekend days treated like weekdays all that time?

 

Clearly at least one of us had something weird going on with our meter or plan. I wonder if any other long-time (current or ex) Flick customer in Christchurch can add a third data point to this small sample size.

 

(Edit: corrected night rate typo 7pm-9am to 9pm-7am)


109 posts

Master Geek

Subscriber

  #2425996 23-Feb-2020 20:24
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heapsort:

 

SBQ:

 

Flick has changed their off-peak schedule to reflect what it should be. BUT at the time I was with Flick over a year ago, they did not. Their pricing schedule clearly showed (use to be on a downloadable PDF file ie Christchurch_-_Price_Schedule_01_Apr_2017_Web_Schedules.pdf) weekends did not count as off-peak. So it wasn't simply an issue of the meter configuration despite having contacting them during the time to ask why (when Genesis did?) - they offered no reason.

 

 

I have been with Flick in Christchurch for more than three years, with weekend days off-peak (like 9pm-7am night rates) every weekend. I don't recall ever seeing a document from them indicating peak rates would apply on weekends, which would have made my billing an anomaly. If I'm understanding correctly, you were with Flick in Christchurch for two years and had weekend days treated like weekdays all that time?

 

Clearly at least one of us had something weird going on with our meter or plan. I wonder if any other long-time (current or ex) Flick customer in Christchurch can add a third data point to this small sample size.

 

(Edit: corrected night rate typo 7pm-9am to 9pm-7am)

 

 

Indeed, we've been with Flick since Oct 2016 and weekend days have always been offpeak rates. And it was published in the rates pdfs (before shifting, I did my homework, setting up a spread sheet to compare the costs, using our usage patterns, with Flick and with our then incumbent provider, Genesis). At that time, our savings with Flick were some 20% c.f. Genesis.

 

I have a copy, saved on 1 March 2017, of the schedule SBQ references and, in fact, it states all day weekends are off peak.

 

 

Also I must point out, that in the many years we were with Genesis, we did NOT have off peak rates during weekend day hours! Quite the opposite to what SBQ espouses repeatedly.

 

I've kept my spreadsheet updated with our actual usage and costs with Flick, and with Genesis's published tariffs - it demonstrates we have consistently been saving at least 15% on Flick compared to Genesis.

 

Edited for grammar and clarity.


SBQ

91 posts

Master Geek


  #2426054 23-Feb-2020 22:00
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robertsona:

 

Indeed, we've been with Flick since Oct 2016 and weekend days have always been offpeak rates. And it was published in the rates pdfs (before shifting, I did my homework, setting up a spread sheet to compare the costs, using our usage patterns, with Flick and with our then incumbent provider, Genesis). At that time, our savings with Flick were some 20% c.f. Genesis.

 

I have a copy, saved on 1 March 2017, of the schedule SBQ references and, in fact, it states all day weekends are off peak.

 

 

Also I must point out, that in the many years we were with Genesis, we did NOT have off peak rates during weekend day hours! Quite the opposite to what SBQ espouses repeatedly.

 

I've kept my spreadsheet updated with our actual usage and costs with Flick, and with Genesis's published tariffs - it demonstrates we have consistently been saving at least 15% on Flick compared to Genesis.

 

Edited for grammar and clarity.

 

 

Very interesting. I did a history search of my emails; My application was in June 2016 and I moved over to Genesis in Feb 2018. Then it seems Flick had been overcharging me on the weekends (and in your case, Genesis was over charging you on weekends too which is quite the irony).

I could of swore when I called them up before switching, they gave me no explanation on clarity of the off peak rate on Saturday & Sunday. (As on your sheet - it just said 'Weekends'. I just knew that when I used the Flick Meter, the meter rate charge was consistently on the day rate as it would be on any weekday).

When I switched over to Genesis, NO CHANGE on my meter configuration was done. But my bill drastically dropped like 20% (and even more during the winter months - because of May to August Orion sur-charge (I think it was 6 or 7c/kWhr ?) Keep in mind, it's the winter months where we consumed the most electricity so this sur-charge really hurts. With Flick I had bills nearly $400/month.. but now with Genesis (and keep in mind electricity prices have gone up over the past 2 years), i'm well below the $300/month range in the winter time.


234 posts

Master Geek


  #2426057 23-Feb-2020 22:25
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SBQ:

 

Well I must say I enjoyed Genesis's 'Power Shout' on Monday night. I'm also quite certain if you live in Christchurch, Flick is not gonna save you $ compared to Genesis day / night rate plan.

 

 

This is absolutely not the case, at least in my circumstance and those of several others that I know of. You also can't comment on anyone else's situation either as the pricing change based on a whole variety of factors, with one of the most important of those being the way that the metering is configured and how the plan is set-up (i.e. a blended rate vs. a TOU rate). Someone I know just switched from Genesis to Flick as it was between 5-15 c/kWh cheaper as they moved from a blended rate to a TOU rate, could time shift, had solar so received the wholesale rate for this vs. 8c / kWh & moved to a low user plan at the same time. Overall a considerable saving. The other factor to consider is that a lot of the times Mercury, Genesis and Meridian will offer "special" rates on-application which skews "me better than you" comparisons. The only objective way to find out what the best price is is to use Consumer Powerswitch (which is endorsed by the Electricity Authority) and should list all publicly available up-to-date rates because it factors in your individual factors, such as whether you have someone at home during the day and the current plan you are on, to work out the best rate for you.

 

SBQ:

 

[...] The key distinction as I mentioned before on many pages ago, Genesis allowing the off-peak times throughout Saturday & Sunday vs Flick, the weekends were treated the same as week-days (off peak 9PM to 7AM). [...]

 

 

You're wrong again with this one too. Go check either Flick or Orion's website for pricing schedules. This has never once been the case in, at the very least, the last two years. If what you are saying was true then you would have a very valid reason to go back to Flick & ask for a refund as the product offering was clearly not at cost.


SBQ

91 posts

Master Geek


  #2426067 23-Feb-2020 23:03
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boosacnoodle:

 

SBQ:

 

Well I must say I enjoyed Genesis's 'Power Shout' on Monday night. I'm also quite certain if you live in Christchurch, Flick is not gonna save you $ compared to Genesis day / night rate plan.

 

This is absolutely not the case, at least in my circumstance and those of several others that I know of. You also can't comment on anyone else's situation either as the pricing change based on a whole variety of factors, with one of the most important of those being the way that the metering is configured and how the plan is set-up (i.e. a blended rate vs. a TOU rate). Someone I know just switched from Genesis to Flick as it was between 5-15 c/kWh cheaper as they moved from a blended rate to a TOU rate, could time shift, had solar so received the wholesale rate for this vs. 8c / kWh & moved to a low user plan at the same time. Overall a considerable saving. The other factor to consider is that a lot of the times Mercury, Genesis and Meridian will offer "special" rates on-application which skews "me better than you" comparisons. The only objective way to find out what the best price is is to use Consumer Powerswitch (which is endorsed by the Electricity Authority) and should list all publicly available up-to-date rates because it factors in your individual factors, such as whether you have someone at home during the day and the current plan you are on, to work out the best rate for you.

 

SBQ:

 

[...] The key distinction as I mentioned before on many pages ago, Genesis allowing the off-peak times throughout Saturday & Sunday vs Flick, the weekends were treated the same as week-days (off peak 9PM to 7AM). [...]

 

You're wrong again with this one too. Go check either Flick or Orion's website for pricing schedules. This has never once been the case in, at the very least, the last two years. If what you are saying was true then you would have a very valid reason to go back to Flick & ask for a refund as the product offering was clearly not at cost.

 

 

 

 

I'm saying this was true FOR ME and before leaving Flick, they did not offer or confirm to me an explanation. An issue of having the wrong meter configuration? As I said, no change in meter config was done when going back to Genesis.

Again, you can't use the example of the person that has solar ; most people don't... but most people need to cook their meals and attend to children's needs which is usually around Flick's peak sur-charge time. Let me clarify during the time I was with Flick, they had peak hours from 7AM to 10AM and 5PM to 7PM which raised the spot prices A LOT and was hard to make any savings. Let's look at Flick's pricing now in Christchurch:

https://www.flickelectric.co.nz/christchurch-pricing/

Both FIXIE and EARNIE plans have kWh rates much higher than Genesis. You don't need to be a rocket scientist to see the price difference. Off-peak 12.13c/kWH  Peak 29.20c/kWH  (Low-User rates).

Other thing when I was with Flick.. they used some weird algorithm to determine the amount of savings I was having throughout the year. I never understood how that was based or calculated on if it had any relevance to our usage pattern if off-peak / high peak hours. What made sense to me was I need to have food ready at breakfast and dinner time and that was ALWAYS the highest spot price.

 

 


192 posts

Master Geek

Lifetime subscriber

  #2426122 24-Feb-2020 05:32
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SBQ:

 

Let's look at Flick's pricing now in Christchurch:

Both FIXIE and EARNIE plans have kWh rates much higher than Genesis. You don't need to be a rocket scientist to see the price difference. Off-peak 12.13c/kWH  Peak 29.20c/kWH  (Low-User rates).

 

 

Again, you are not exactly comparing equivalent plans there. Flick's Earner plan (which is rather new, and not one I'd use personally) has built-in rewards so a direct comparison is out. For its Fixie plan, Flick states "no fixed-term contracts or exit fees" but for some reason you only quoted Genesis prices for a plan with a "12-month fixed-term plan" and "early termination charge of $150.00"

 

If we instead compare Fixie to the Genesis low-user plan with no fixed term, Genesis' peak rate per kWh is 21% higher than Flick. So even if one is only concerned about price - and I've mentioned before I have moral qualms about being a direct customer of a large gentailer, and Genesis in particular - the matter really is nowhere near as clear as you claim.

 

Edit to add: another benefit to consider - while Flick Fixie does not lock in the customer, it does lock in the price. I'm currently paying less on Fixie than the prices in the PDF you linked, and I will be until August. By then, I may decide to switch to Freestyle.


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