Smart electricity meter installation

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#1704127 16-Jan-2017 14:03

We had an EDMI smart meter installed for electricity in late November. We have mains gas as well so we still have a meter reader come around to read that. The last 2 visits I'm pretty sure she has read the smart meter values too (I'll confirm after the next visit).

We used to have 2 meters (2 phase), 1 was supposedly controlled (but we don't have electric hot water so it powered half the house at a cheaper rate), but now that the smart meter is in they are both phases are setup as Anytime.

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Geektastic

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#1704175 16-Jan-2017 15:25

Amosnz:

We had an EDMI smart meter installed for electricity in late November. We have mains gas as well so we still have a meter reader come around to read that. The last 2 visits I'm pretty sure she has read the smart meter values too (I'll confirm after the next visit).

We used to have 2 meters (2 phase), 1 was supposedly controlled (but we don't have electric hot water so it powered half the house at a cheaper rate), but now that the smart meter is in they are both phases are setup as Anytime.

We have both although I still have no accurate idea when I am using which! It was much easier in the UK with simply peak and off peak charges. All electricity from around midnight to early morning was off peak, so you could easily set washing machines, dishwashers etc to use that - even night storage heaters.

AFAICS 'controlled' means that the electricity company decides when it is cheap but the consumer won't actually know...is that correct?

gregmcc

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#1704215 16-Jan-2017 15:40

Geektastic:

Amosnz:

We had an EDMI smart meter installed for electricity in late November. We have mains gas as well so we still have a meter reader come around to read that. The last 2 visits I'm pretty sure she has read the smart meter values too (I'll confirm after the next visit).

We used to have 2 meters (2 phase), 1 was supposedly controlled (but we don't have electric hot water so it powered half the house at a cheaper rate), but now that the smart meter is in they are both phases are setup as Anytime.

We have both although I still have no accurate idea when I am using which! It was much easier in the UK with simply peak and off peak charges. All electricity from around midnight to early morning was off peak, so you could easily set washing machines, dishwashers etc to use that - even night storage heaters.

AFAICS 'controlled' means that the electricity company decides when it is cheap but the consumer won't actually know...is that correct?

Controlled means they can if they want to turn off *anytime*, generally it's turned off 6am-8pm and 5pm-8pm peak usage times

JayADee

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#1704440 17-Jan-2017 01:57

My old meter isn't super, super old, we had a new one installed about 15 or so years ago outside. Hopefully it's been fairly accurate. I was kind of hoping I'd be able to see it reporting on our electricity usage so I could track our power usage better as I'd like to cut back. We're using too much for two people. But having the ability to switch to more providers would be good. If I recall the cheapest provider around here does require a smart meter.

We use LPG for hot water and only have the one meter so we're pretty straight forward as far as power goes.

I'm not a big fan of people installing stuff on my house in case they screw it up and cause some sort of problem weather it be a water leakage issue at the wall, interference with our wifi or whatever. I can't see any particular problem with smart meters otherwise after googling them but thought maybe you guys could shed some light.

I am aware I could refuse to allow it.

Thanks for your responses.

Are the meters reliably accurate?

Aredwood

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#1704977 18-Jan-2017 02:07

@Paul1977 the label on that meter says it is owned by Arc Innovations. They have since been sold to Vector (lines company in Auckland) So yes there are lots of different smart meters. But since Vector AMS (who install the EDMI meters) and Metrix (who install the Elster meters and are owned by Mighty river power) together control most of the smart meter market.

As for accuracy - http://www.geekzone.co.nz/forums.asp?topicid=72665 read what you will into it. I have one of those same Elster meters on my own house. So far all of my tests have shown it to be accurate. but I still seem to use alot of power despite me having gas cooking and solar hot water. Yet I know a few people who have the EDMI meters who have electric cooking and hot water. And some of them use less power despite also having more people living in their houses.

My household load profile is mostly electric motors and electronic devices. While the typical household is mostly resistive loads (heating elements). So if there is any inaccuracy with the smart meters it is far more likely to show up in my house. As I have lots of devices all with different power factors and harmonic currents. The meter in my house has a very difficult task to accurately measure how much power I use. Im thankful every power company I have been with so far hasn't enforced the clauses in their contracts regarding power factor. And that they don't bill for KvAR usage.

Geektastic

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#1705140 18-Jan-2017 11:48

As far as accuracy goes, our power bills did not seem to change much between the two kinds of meter. Not scientific but there you go!

At least now we do not have the "low guesstimate this month - oops, massive bill next month now we've actually bothered reading it!" scenarios we used to get.

MaxLV

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#1706143 20-Jan-2017 00:32

richms:

Powerbill will become accurate. Most of the people that have them put in and have sudden massive bill increases have been freeloading with a gunked up analog meter for years and going on about how they only have a $70 power bill blah blah blah and then the accurate meter goes in and BAM $400 bill and they blame the smartmeter.

Got one fitted 3+ years ago... It almost immediately 'stabilised' my power so I could pay a set amount each month and know I would never get any shocks with the bill. I currently pay $40 F/N, no matter what the monthly bill is, and it always covers the amount due each month. Some months (during the summer) I have nothing to pay. I dont pay more than I did with the old mechanical meter, if anything it's a bit less.

I had an interesting 'experience' getting it installed though.

Received the letter from the power company saying was going to be installed and to contact them to arrange a suitable date.

Arranged the date (in 8 weeks time, the earliest available date they had), and was told as the power would be turned off to install the meter, they would contact me 30 minutes before cutting the power.

Also asked them have they contacted my landlord? They said the dont have to.

Install date came around, no call to say the power will be turned off to install the meter, and as far as I was aware it hadn't been installed. At the end of the day I called the power company to find out why I hadn't been called, and when was the meter going to be installed...

Their reply? It was already installed, and they had done it a month ago!!

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#1706182 20-Jan-2017 07:44

Geektastic:

As far as accuracy goes, our power bills did not seem to change much between the two kinds of meter. Not scientific but there you go!

At least now we do not have the "low guesstimate this month - oops, massive bill next month now we've actually bothered reading it!" scenarios we used to get.

Same here. The overall price is about the same but it doesn't go "low-high". Mine is presumably an EDMI meter as it has a Vector logo on it (I'm too lazy to go outside and look at it, but I remember thinking it a bit odd to see a Vector logo in a Horizon area).

neb

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#1707112 21-Jan-2017 19:46

JayADee:
Electricity company wants to put one on our house. Any cons to it? Thanks.

Once your household is exposed to the effects of a smart meter, expect to experience headaches, fatigue, problems sleeping, ringing in your ears, dizziness, flatulence, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, hair loss, difficulty breathing, pinpoint pupils, climate-change denialism, tightness in the chest, moist desquamation, teenage pregnancy, gastrointestinal pain and vomiting, involuntary urination, and an urge to listen to Trump campaign speeches. I may have missed a few symptoms out there, maybe someone else can fill in the rest.

neb

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#1707118 21-Jan-2017 19:52

Geektastic:
The available information is pretty top level - it lacks much detail.

If you want more detail you can always fit something like a Flukso, which is the best if its class that I could find as of a few years ago, that'll give you precise readings for any household circuits you care to wire up down to the single-watt level. Also, having the company-run meters not be able to resolve much detail is a good thing, with power-disaggregation algorithms a decent meter can tell exactly what you're doing at any point in time based on power patterns (down to the level of wake up, shower, shave, brew a cup of coffee, etc).

JayADee

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#1735419 12-Mar-2017 20:39

Gah! A week after my meter is installed I read this: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11816828

which says a lot of them are very inaccurate!

I've emailed my provider to find out what kind I've got.

richms

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#1735422 12-Mar-2017 20:45

I backed this on indiegogo ages ago. Not sure how much use its analysis stuff to determine what is running will be, but will be interesting to see if it can resolve a single power supply in a house with probably over 100 of them running.

Richard rich.ms

Aredwood

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#1735487 13-Mar-2017 01:07

JayADee: Gah! A week after my meter is installed I read this: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11816828

which says a lot of them are very inaccurate!

I've emailed my provider to find out what kind I've got.

Interesting, Although none of those meters are commonly used in NZ as part of the smart meter roll out. At least for single phase installations. They are putting a harmonic current waveform through those meters. (according to the oscilloscope screen) Which is produced by non power factor corrected energy saving lights and electronic power supplies.

As for light dimmers, the researchers didn't say what type of lights they were using with the light dimmers. As if you use non dimmable lights with a dimmer. And sometimes dimmable lights with the wrong dimmer. You will get extremely bad current waveforms that are very difficult to measure accurately.

As for my own house - I have since found out that my meter is consistently reading a power factor of more than 0.9 Which if true will explain my power bills. So more testing definitely needed. Then there is the metering standards. I have not read the NZ ones as they seem to all be behind paywalls. But if they say the meters only need to be accurate for resistive loads, lagging inductive loads and leading capacitive loads. Then a meter could be inaccurate for harmonic and phase angle control loads (light dimmers). Yet still comply. So knowing what is in those standards is very important.

Also a power company would be playing with fire if they install meters that are known to not read correctly for some types of loads. Not just if they get accused of overcharging. But it would be hypothetically possible to build a plug in device that will cause the meter to under read.

sir1963

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#1735707 13-Mar-2017 12:50

JayADee: Gah! A week after my meter is installed I read this: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11816828

which says a lot of them are very inaccurate!

I've emailed my provider to find out what kind I've got.

Heres another article

https://hardware.slashdot.org/story/17/03/12/2256215/millions-of-smart-meters-may-over-inflate-readings-by-up-to-600

kiwifidget

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#1735712 13-Mar-2017 13:08

Counties Power installed a smart meter at our house ages ago, but because Nova aren't smart to read it we still have to get the meter read manually.

SIGH.

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