Sanity check - hot water cylinder replacement

Forums › Home Workshop DIY › Sanity check - hot water cylinder replacement - $3k

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#2932392 21-Jun-2022 09:23

lchiu7:

And two gas large cylinders lasts a year alternating between them.

lol hearsay alright

i would like to find someone who could make their 2 bottle last that long. any decent sized family will be going through way more than that

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CokemonZ

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#2932393 21-Jun-2022 09:25

Additionally we are moving to the the electric kiwi move master plan, so am going to get a timer installed I reckon.

That will be more effective for me than gas, and less trouble.

itxtme

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#2932397 21-Jun-2022 09:46

insane: Sounds like they are taking advantage of your misfortune.

https://www.hotwatercylinders.nz/like-for-like-low-pressure.html

Smaller unit but less than half the cost installed. Presumably they have larger options too.

That was 2min of searching... Pop a job on builders crack, or your local Facebook community group, will probably have a few bites immediately.

If you're an AA Insurance custom you might even be able to take advantage of their preferential tradies for emergencies like this.

Would be true but OP is upgrading to mains pressure.

OP 3k is a reasonable price. If you are considering time shifting the heat up time with movemaster get a larger tank so that you have capacity to hold your cheaply heated water. Good call on the gas, personally I think people have rocks in their head to install gas with the way all indicators are pointing around government policy.

lchiu7

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#2932401 21-Jun-2022 09:57

Jase2985:

lchiu7:

And two gas large cylinders lasts a year alternating between them.

lol hearsay alright

i would like to find someone who could make their 2 bottle last that long. any decent sized family will be going through way more than that

I probably misheard him. I think what he meant was two cylinders that can switch over automatically when one gets empty so you don't lose gas supply. But he didn't say how many you might use in a year.

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Bung

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#2932403 21-Jun-2022 10:01

Elgas estimate 1 x 45kg cylinder every 50 days if used for 20 minutes hot water only per day.

lchiu7

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#2932409 21-Jun-2022 10:17

Bung: Elgas estimate 1 x 45kg cylinder every 50 days if used for 20 minutes hot water only per day.

OK just for discussion purposes Genesis charges $130 for a 45kg bottle https://www.genesisenergy.co.nz/for-home/products/explore-pricing/bottled-gas

So using that estimate let's say to be safe 10 cylinders a year so $1300 a year.

Last month I used 76 units (cu feet?) of natural gas for 3 people hot water and cooking and that cost me $160 so annually $1920. So based on the back of the bus ticket option, if you can get gas via cylinders to an Infinity, it might be an option to consider.

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Blurtie

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#2932437 21-Jun-2022 11:34

This is getting slightly OT, but we have gas hot water (not hooked up for cooking) - we roughly use a 45kg bottle a month for 2 adults and 2 kids (6 and 2).. So baths most nights for the kids, 2-3 showers per day. In peak winter (CHCH) we use will more.

For some context, I have friends, also Chch based, 2 adults, 1 kid under 3, who have gas hot water/cooking and a bottle lasts them roughly 2 months. No baths tho.

With the Genesis pricing linked, there's also a monthly bottle rental charge of $5 per bottle..

20 minutes of hot water use a day sounds light to me for our situation, especially when you factor in dishwashers/washing machine use...

CokemonZ

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#2932440 21-Jun-2022 11:48

Back on topic, turns out price was excl gst - so really 3500. Have another guy coming around this afternoon.

Got a second quote verbally for 2500 ± gst, but can't do the job to next week.

djtOtago

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#2932462 21-Jun-2022 12:02

Reading the above posts, gas appears to be a very expensive method for getting hot water.
My electric power cost for last year was $2410.00. Given that hot water is supposed to be around 30% of a house holds energy consumption (*), my hot water from our 220 litre mains pressure cylinder only cost $730.00 for the year.

That's for 4 Adults having at least one shower each every work day.

* https://www.consumer.org.nz/articles/hot-water-energy-saving-tips

Edit: Change from low to mains pressure 3 years ago, cost was around $2300.00 from memory.

johno1234

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#2932465 21-Jun-2022 12:18

I think we paid a bit less, replaced the old LP cylinder with HP and relocated it. Also had to replace some shower mixers to deal with the higher pressure hot water.

I pulled the inner cylinder out of the old one - a nice big copper vessel which I plan to repurpose some day... possibly cut in half to make planters...

Linuxluver

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#2933143 22-Jun-2022 13:21

CokemonZ: Hi hive mind.

My hot water cylinder started leaking and needs urgent replacement.
Replacing low pressure for mains, and a tiny bit of plumbing. Needs new valves etc.
180l steel internal cylinder.
I've had a plumber recommended and don't really want to go through 3 quotes if I don't need to. Pita, time and no hot water - you know.
Is 3k about right?

We replaced our 50yo 120L hot water cylinder with a new Bosch mains pressure 180L electric cylinder last year for $3250.

We love it......

We have solar panels and it's programmed to heat between 9:00-10:00 (solar) / 15:30-17:00 (solar) / 03:00-04:00 (a cheap time on the grid). The water is always hot.

I've also had quotes done for our rentals and just over 3K seems to be the number I see over and over.

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CokemonZ

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#2933173 22-Jun-2022 14:58

Allright - I have had a wide variation in quotes, from $3,450 for a plain mild steel, to $2,900 for a stainless steel that is solar/heatpump ready to $2,700 for a mild steel but different brand.

As far as I can see the difference was:

1. $3,450 - primarily residential, and smaller jobs. Came recommended in local groups as has done lots of jobs around here. Work looks good, and very responsive.

2. $2,900 - primarily new builds - doing this type of job when he finishes for the day at the site. Reasonably responsive, but definitely do it on his schedule. Only one who recommended getting solar/heatpump ready as you never know what might happen in 10 years. Has been recommended by a colleague who did a whole new bathroom with him.

3. $2,700 - Essentially only does hot water cylinders. Knew his stuff, but super busy, at least a week out.

I am going with No. 2 as a little of the urgency has gone out of the equation, and I liked the recommendations, and pricing was good.

nickb800

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#2933191 22-Jun-2022 15:20

Stainless Steel lining is a great choice. My in laws had their mild steel/enamel cylinder fail after 4 years and the warranty payment was pro-rated down as they were at year four of a five year warranty. Stainless should get you a ten year warranty, and arguably 20 year plus life expectancy.

I'd be skeptical of the solar/heat pump compatible upgrade (although many stainless cylinders come with that standard). Solar hot water is on its way out, solar PV is cheaper and more flexible. Most of the affordable heat pump hot water options on the market involve an integrated unit (heat pump and cylinder together), so you'd be looking at a dearer external heat pump solution. Also, an external heat pump upgrade would require the external unit to control the hot water cylinder's element (for legionnaires control and general temperature boosting). This is fairly trivial but seems less likely in a mass-market solution - in other words, I don't think anyone's going to be offering heat pump bolt-on's in the future when integrated units are simpler to install and easier to support.

CokemonZ

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#2933195 22-Jun-2022 15:29

As far as I can tell the stainless ones are all solar/heatpump compatible, though a thermostat upgrade may be required on Rinnai ones.

mclean

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#2933437 23-Jun-2022 10:36

nickb800: Stainless Steel lining is a great choice. My in laws had their mild steel/enamel cylinder fail after 4 years and the warranty payment was pro-rated down as they were at year four of a five year warranty. Stainless should get you a ten year warranty, and arguably 20 year plus life expectancy.

I think the warranty for cylinder replacement on Rheem glass-lined steel heaters is now 10 years, the same as for stainless steel. The life of steel cylinder depends a lot on how diligent you are at checking and replacing the sacrificial anode.

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